Back off the rookies.

[GoApps70]

not sure how Clausen makes good decisions? He plays scared. That is why he checks down and scrambles so much. Not turning it over doesn't = good decisions are being made. You got to give your team a chance and means you have to be willing to let your teammates go make a play.

Clausen DOES play scared. He normally looks at one receiver and wants to get the ball away before he gets his uniform dirty. Defenders will always see 75% of where the ball is going by watching Clausen.

Yes I would much rather have Jake Delhomme here throwing into triple coverages and me getting a f**king headache from holding my breath every f**king time his borderline retarded self drops back to pass.

Delhomme was better than Clausen even when he was throwing 5 interceptions per game, and at least normally Delhomme could get a pass to the end zone for a wide open receiver.

at least Moore gives the team a chance. He is a risky QB.....but that is better than what Clausen can give us.

We tried that for a couple of games and pulled him for a rookie QB. NOT the answer, but better than Clausen.

Moore is the better option right now. With Fox gone, Clausen getting these reps could be pointless.....b/c there is no way to know if Clausen will be in the plans for the next HC.

Moore is better, but Armanti Edwards IS the answer. Tired of hearing about him being an option QB in college. AE has a great arm, can run well and fast, and most importantly can avoid the rush much better than any of the other QB's.

Sure sure. If what you are saying is true then all those guys are doomed for a while.

Unless you put Armanti Edwards in.

Rookies who are going to make it in the NFL wtill need to show flashes of brilliance at some point. Even on the worst team in the NFL.

Exactly, and Clausen sure has NOT show anything. He doesn't survey the field, cannot take snaps, gets too excited when trying to figure out what to do, cannot even pass far enough when you have an open TD waiting for you in the end zone, cannot hand off to running backs well, cannot buy enough time in the pocket, no mobility hardly, so overhyped it's ridiculous. And this guy has had a professional QB coach since he was in the 7th grade, what a waste of money.

You see rookies on other teams doing it.

Not dominating...just anything to hold your hat on.

just show me something

Flacco went in and looked fine a couple of years ago with the Baltimore Ravens. Saw Armanti Edwards and Flacco play against each other in college. Edwards outplayed Flacco in any and every way possible. Put Edwards in at QB.

Fwiw, that was a nice over the shoulder catch that Edwards made, even if it was out of bounds. If he can do it, and keep it inbounds, then he could turn into a nice receiver.

Sure Edwards can be a great receiver, but we need a QB....we need Armanti Edwards at QB.

And who would you prefer that we use in their place? It's not like we're playing them while Peyton Manning and Austin Miles ride the bench.

This batch of rookies is what we're stuck with, for better or worse. Time to look forward to next year, there is no saving this year. As Bobby Knight said, "The best thing about Freshmen is that they become Sophomores."

Again, put Armanti Edward in as QB. Can sure as heck outplay any of the other QB's that we have on this team.

Scherer also said that he kind of screwed Jake up.

One of my biggest fears with Clausen is this. He has a low release point and a slow windup motion. Yet, if they try to fix it, he could end up being worse off.

Clausen is worthless as a QB. If they keep playing him, he will have a good pass every now and them, but so would I. Too slow in everything he does, slow windup (is telegraphing what he is about to do, so passes get blocked more) and low release point as you say, plus he doesn't seem to even know what a passing lane is. I believe he picks some defensive player to throw it right above their helmet. Clausen is worthless at QB.

Clausen just hasn't shown enough to keep him out there getting "experience". He doesn't look ready to be getting first hand learning experience yet. You can ruin a young QB.

You can ruin a young QB, or like in this case, find out that that QB is NOT an NFL QB like we have seen.

Hype. Clausen is all hype. Didn't show much the first two games, but he didn't turn the ball over so we were all content. Now, we realize that he has ALOT to improve on. Constant 3 and outs. Doesn't cut it.

Put Armanti Edwards #10 in as QB right now!!! See him scramble around the pocket, pick spots to run for yardage, not throw the ball away unless really necessary, as the announcers said use that laser arm of his to actually hit receivers not just throw kinda at them in the general area.

[Brooklyn Bully]

I like what Minter said tonight on Panthers Game Day, "You have to give them time.". And he's right. What would trading for Vincent Jackson or starting Moore the rest of the way do? Give us 4 wins instead of 2 with Jimmy while sticking with LaFell? They're ROOKIES. Most rookies do not start in the NFL. We have one at QB and 2 starting at WR. That's almost unheard of. All we can do is give them time. They can end up busts at the end of the year, but the year is over anyway so you may as well go with it. I'd rather them gel as a unit now, than sit them and gun for 5-6 wins. OOOOH 5 wins!

Oh, and as I said in another thread...we are SPOILED here in Carolina. NOTHING will fix this season...NOTHING. There is no rhyme and reason behind changing anything unless the coaches know Jimmy and LaFell are rattled. We're SO used to winning or almost winning seaons, we can't even fathom having a piss poor record. It's like we expect some fix to happen, and end up 7-9. That ain't happening.

[Cat'sGrowl]

I'm trying to understand what the opposition to Kurb's argument here.

Kurb has the logical, smart, and correct argument.

Having a bunch rookies be key components to your football team is a valid reason for losing when there is noone better to replace them.

Is that what you people are trying to say?

That if we start Matt Moore we might automatically be awarded 5 wins by the NFL?

For the love God, let the kids play.

They've actually done quite well given what they've been working with.

[Brooklyn Bully]

Gettis is just as much a rookie as LaFell. I agree that he is playing better, and should be our #2. The only thing you're suggesting is to start Moore over Clausen. That only adds value if you think Moore is the future. If not, then every snap he gets is a waste of a learning experience for Clausen. Plus, Clausen and Gettis have shown some chemistry with each other. Getting them more experience together can be very valuable next year.

This here. The only way we re-sign CRA's love muffin is if he turns this season around and we end up 7-9 or 8-8. With this O-Line, these rooks at WR, J-Stew's slow start, and Fiametta's mediocrity, that won't happen. He's as good as gone. I actually see him in Seattle or Buffalo or Arizona next year.

[Brooklyn Bully]

The only people using the rookie excuse are fans on message boards.

Don't hear the coaches using the rookie excuse, don't hear the network guys using it in the middle of the highlight reels, don't hear the players using it, nobody's using it on the NFL network..... seems the only place I'm reading about it is here.

Fox used it today in a locker room interview and even said, "They're really going to hit the wall after eight games and they don't even know it yet."

[chef17]

I agree that rookie mistakes will be made and we should expect those. With that said, Clausen had 61 total passing yards. Add in the sacks and he had 27 net yards passing. He threw one interception and if I remember correctly Baker punted 8 times while Clausen was in. That equals 27 net passing yards on 9 series. Rookie QB or not, there is no excuse for 3 passing yards a series.

[Proudiddy]

People are looking to place blame and the players are the easiest targets because you see them on the field f*cking up... We're not watching Richardson, Hurney, and Fox's brains work on TV, so people don't think of what got us where we are right now...

I think LaFail is garbage and will not be any better than Jarrett, even if he improves, his potential is extremely limited b/c he can't catch consistently, or at all for that matter.

Armanti gets a pass b/c he's not a WR. He should be utilized in some way, but I'm not sure it should be strictly as a WR. At this point he should get a chance to run plays at QB, it doesn't matter, but he shouldn't be sitting on the bench, he's got to develop. (Disclaimer: I am in no way associated with App. St., this is purely an objective opinion)

Clausen, I didn't like him from day one and didn't believe he was the franchise QB that people were trying to make him out to be... BUT, with his pedigree and background, I wanted to believe he could be, and maybe I didn't know enough about him... Wrong... He's proving me right...

I pull for any guy we put out there, b/c if they succeed, odds are, are team is succeeding - which is why I don't understand the blind hate for some of the players we've had over the years without even giving them a chance - Jake, Clausen, Moore, Armanti, etc.

Once again, these dumbass casual fans need to look at the front office and understand that this is on them. It's hard not to blame a rookie WR for looking like poo when he was put in the position to look like poo. LaFell shouldn't be starting, but he was drafted by our dumbass FO to do just that... Clausen shouldn't be starting (at least with the present state of the roster, especially at WR), but he was drafted to do just that... Gettis shouldn't be starting either, but at least he looks the part, sometimes you get a surprise like that - Marques Colston did it... But, he won't have numbers anything like that because there's not an OL to protect a QB, playcalling is shitty, and the rook QB has a noodle arm while the other one likes to gamble. Meanwhile, both have been benched and their confidence is destroyed.

Blame the front office. Write them. Call them. Demand your money back. They don't give a f*ck. We shouldn't either.

[Brooklyn Bully]

I agree that rookie mistakes will be made and we should expect those. With that said, Clausen had 61 total passing yards. Add in the sacks and he had 27 net yards passing. He threw one interception and if I remember correctly Baker punted 8 times while Clausen was in. That equals 27 net passing yards on 9 series. Rookie QB or not, there is no excuse for 3 passing yards a series.

You're right, there is no excuse for ANY qb to have a god awful game. Look at the Bears qb today...god awful and not even a rookie. Remember Rex Grossman a few years ago? Like a 9 passer rating in that MNF game. Jake had some poo games as well. It happens. Hell Cutler looked like ass last week and he has a rocket for an arm. It takes time, if the rookie qb is for real. We have the time. You can't find out if he's for real on the bench, and in most cases, you can't find out if he's for real after only three starts. Clausen may not be for real. But Moore will turn nothing around here, and we will not re-sign him. Let Jimmy answer the question as to if he's the real deal or not.

[chef17]

You're right, there is no excuse for ANY qb to have a god awful game. Look at the Bears qb today...god awful and not even a rookie. Remember Rex Grossman a few years ago? Like a 9 passer rating in that MNF game. Jake had some poo games as well. It happens. Hell Cutler looked like ass last week and he has a rocket for an arm. It takes time, if the rookie qb is for real. We have the time. You can't find out if he's for real on the bench, and in most cases, you can't find out if he's for real after only three starts. Clausen may not be for real. But Moore will turn nothing around here, and we will not re-sign him. Let Jimmy answer the question as to if he's the real deal or not.

I completely agree that we should wait to see what Clausen can do. I also understand that every QB will have a horrible game they would like to forget. I just don't agree that we should "back off the rookies". At the end of the day they are still NFL players. Some mistakes are to be expected. Others are just sad. Our rookies are making both.

[GoApps70]

I normally would be fine with giving rookies time.

But they have to show some promise.

Clausen doesn't have an upside. He is pathetic from A to Z.

He can connect on a pass that a local high school QB can make. Once in awhile he may throw an actual good pass, but his decision making is poor, and he is slow in deciding how to do what needs to be done.

I do not know if we have ever had a QB as bad. Someone mentioned a couple of bad ones, but Clausen is worse than any of those.

[Carl Spackler]

I normally would be fine with giving rookies time.

But they have to show some promise.

Clausen doesn't have an upside. He is pathetic from A to Z.

He can connect on a pass that a local high school QB can make. Once in awhile he may throw an actual good pass, but his decision making is poor, and he is slow in deciding how to do what needs to be done.

I do not know if we have ever had a QB as bad. Someone mentioned a couple of bad ones, but Clausen is worse than any of those.

You sir, are an idiot if you think that. Take the Armanti jersey off and realize that Weinke, Collins, Peete, Fasani, Reich, Carr, Moore, all of them except for Jake and Beuerlein, are worse. Look at the O-line, I could say Schwartz couldn't block my grandmother and LaFell couldn't catch a cold but once in a while they probably could.

[Mr. Scot]

They are freaking rookies people.

They shouldn't be the focal points of our offense.

They should be slot WR's and playing in garbage time. (well its all garbage but I digress).

:thumbsup:

Pretty much.

[CatMan72]

Yup, can't expect much from an offense with a rookie QB throwing to rookie WR's.

It's the first time that's happened since '98 and there's a damn good reason for it: It doesn't work.