If first round QBs are "destined busts" as people like to refer them to...

[Murph]

I think Ryan was legit too and Atlanta wanted him all the way, as did other teams. Hurney rarely talks so highly about any prospect.

[Delhommey]

My main point is look through the Fox Hurney years and tell me when you thought they were idiots for taking a player in the first round rather than a QB.

[frash.exe]

This is funny. Joe Flacco was NOT a game manager this season? In that game against Tennessee, he really was lights out in moving the ball downfield....11-22 for 161 yards. Collins was picked off only once, and threw for 280 yards....and you can't tell me the game didn't change when Chris Johnson got hurt at the end of the first half. It's also tough to blame Collins for Lendale White and Alge Crumpler losing fumbles in that game.

Had we gotten Flacco this season, do you really think we would be THAT much better off and would have gone to the Super Bowl, given how bad our defense has played? It's not like we would have been able to have him bring Baltimore's defense with him.

It's not really much about "THIS SEASON" as it is in the future. Flacco's got an arm, and he was able to do an outstanding job in his first season. Now, from here, where does the kid go? Might we see some 3500 passing yard seasons? 4000 yard passing seasons? 25 TD seasons? Will his presence make the Ravens a consistent contender finally?

I don't know for sure, but it sure as hell looks like it.

[frash.exe]

My main point is look through the Fox Hurney years and tell me when you thought they were idiots for taking a player in the first round rather than a QB.

Well here you go. First of all, if Eric Shelton was the bulldozer power back everybody picked him to be, there would be no Jon Stewart here. Shelton would probably be having some 1000 yard seasons if he panned out, and he would be the feature back. DeShaun would probably stay as the change of pace like he was with Davis, so he wouldn't be run to the ground and fail. Foster was always a better player as a complement back anyway.

This team has spent countless early picks on running backs, and only the last two finally gave us the "2 back system" we want. Shelton was undoubtedly a bust and for the most part so was DeShaun, considering what we expected him to be (a good game here and there does not make a player). You've read the transcripts saying how neither Fox nor Hurney like developing QBs, and that they don't like to take the risk. Gee, I wonder if the Giants felt the same way, or the Steelers felt the same way, or Indy felt the same way with Peyton 10 years ago, where would those teams be right now without their QBs. Peyton practically carries that Indy offense on his back, and down the stretch, the play of Eli Manning in his SB run, and Roethlisberger in his SB run (though not so much SB 40 itself).

It's kinda stupid for them to say that "QBs take too long to develop" when we've seen them keep DeAngelo behind Foster for 2 years and Davis only started his second year in the league, and was only used as a situational safety or linebacker his rookie season.

Of course when you look at them, and only single them out, yep, their first round picks have served them well. Jon Beason looks good with his 3 ints and 140 tackles a year, Peppers looks good with his 14 sacks, 60 tackles, Davis looks solid with his stats, as does Gamble. They are all starting material.

...how did the defense do collectively as a unit the past two years? None of them missed significant playing time. Do all those first round picks (4 of them btw) really pay off like you think they do considering the defense has finished in the lower half of statistics for the second year in a row and gave up 98 points in its last 3 games including Arizona?

[Fox007]

Well here you go. First of all, if Eric Shelton was the bulldozer power back everybody picked him to be, there would be no Jon Stewart here. Shelton would probably be having some 1000 yard seasons if he panned out, and he would be the feature back. DeShaun would probably stay as the change of pace like he was with Davis, so he wouldn't be run to the ground and fail. Foster was always a better player as a complement back anyway.

This team has spent countless early picks on running backs, and only the last two finally gave us the "2 back system" we want. Shelton was undoubtedly a bust and for the most part so was DeShaun, considering what we expected him to be (a good game here and there does not make a player). You've read the transcripts saying how neither Fox nor Hurney like developing QBs, and that they don't like to take the risk. Gee, I wonder if the Giants felt the same way, or the Steelers felt the same way, or Indy felt the same way with Peyton 10 years ago, where would those teams be right now without their QBs. Peyton practically carries that Indy offense on his back, and down the stretch, the play of Eli Manning in his SB run, and Roethlisberger in his SB run (though not so much SB 40 itself).

It's kinda stupid for them to say that "QBs take too long to develop" when we've seen them keep DeAngelo behind Foster for 2 years and Davis only started his second year in the league, and was only used as a situational safety or linebacker his rookie season.

Of course when you look at them, and only single them out, yep, their first round picks have served them well. Jon Beason looks good with his 3 ints and 140 tackles a year, Peppers looks good with his 14 sacks, 60 tackles, Davis looks solid with his stats, as does Gamble. They are all starting material.

...how did the defense do collectively as a unit the past two years? None of them missed significant playing time. Do all those first round picks (4 of them btw) really pay off like you think they do considering the defense has finished in the lower half of statistics for the second year in a row and gave up 98 points in its last 3 games including Arizona?

I think this is the winning argument.

Pretty hard to counter that..........

[Spike]

Preseason. He was dreadful.

Not saying he's a bust yet, but he didn't exactly wow anyone.

So was Moore, and people still cream themselves over him. And Moore was a mediocre college player who doesnt have the talent to start at the NFL level.