Clausen versus Weinke- a better comparison

[panthers55]

Yep. West Coast vs Smashmouth.

The reality is that we aren't playing smashmouth anymore. As I noted, Seifert ran more in Weinke's 2 games as they have run in Clausen's 2 games.

[CRA]

Your argument was that flacco played lights out his first 2 games, and you were probably going off memory of his games later in the season than facts. Flacco might have played for the winning team those 2 games, but it was against teams that won 4 games each during the whole season.

I never said Flacco played lights out. I said Flacco looked good and did what was needed to get 2 wins. He looked better than Clausen despite the stats you are pimping.

so again I will ask, you are claiming Clausen looked better than Flacco did through their first 2 starts?

[mav1234]

I am somewhat curious how you are so sure who is Clausen's first read, second read, etc. Is it just that I watch the game at a quality where I can't see into his eyes or something? I see his head turning and moving slightly so I assume he is looking through different reads. that, I can't imagine that a 20 yard pass to Gettis is a first read.

[Guild]

sweet, and I will quit saying it if you can find me one example. That isn't a crazy request.

Like I said though, show me one pass he hit where he stayed in the pocket and went to his 2nd read.

The only thing you will be able to find if you are lucky is him going to a checkdown at RB directly after.

While I think you have a valid point, the line wasn't giving him the best protection or time to even progress through reads at expected rookie speed. As I recall it anyway, I could be wrong... maybe I'll rewatch the game again.

[HPPantherzfan]

I am somewhat curious how you are so sure who is Clausen's first read, second read, etc. Is it just that I watch the game at a quality where I can't see into his eyes or something? I see his head turning and moving slightly so I assume he is looking through different reads. that, I can't imagine that a 20 yard pass to Gettis is a first read.

It wasn't just like the pass to DJ at the end of the game wasn't his first read, he scans the field well, especially for a rookie

[fjblair]

If Clausen sucks again next week, I would. What has Clausen done but average 10 points a game and suck. Moore wasn't any worse and at least has a history of winning. Clausen has a history of nothing.

Moore played poorly but yanking him after 2 games for Clausen was stupid and shortsighted. JC is clearly not ready yet. Running game and defense were more glaring debacles in first 2 games than QB was..

[mav1234]

I never said Flacco played lights out. I said Flacco looked good and did what was needed to get 2 wins. He looked better than Clausen despite the stats you are pimping.

so again I will ask, you are claiming Clausen looked better than Flacco did through their first 2 starts?

Honestly, I thought Flacco looked mediocre in his first two games. He showed some flashes, made some rookie mistakes, showed some of why the coaches had faith in him. Without the defense he had... heh... But he was a rookie. He clearly had potential. Same with some other rookies we've been talking about around here...

Anyway, I would say he didn't outplay Clausen by any real stretch, no. His team outplayed Clausen's, sure. But I wouldn't lay that all on Clausen.

EDIT: On Moore, I agree, I would have let him have probably until the bye week, but at least another week. I don't think Clausen was as prepared as he should have been. That being said, I trust him out there more than I do Moore at this point as a starter =(

[CRA]

While I think you have a valid point, the line wasn't giving him the best protection or time to even progress through reads at expected rookie speed. As I recall it anyway, I could be wrong... maybe I'll rewatch the game again.

but again, if a QB bails when he senses slight pressure....it makes an OL look even worse.

Look, Jimmy has made some good decisions at times when protection breaks down. I give him credit for that. However, he is bailing on some plays before they develop......either with a rushed pass or scramble. That makes the OL look worse than they are....and again, they haven't been great.

[mav1234]

"haven't been great"? They've been below mediocre. For a unit that is supposed to be great, not just good, they have really failed to live up to expectations. I wouldn't even say they were average.

Clausen is getting about the same protection as Moore did. You can say he's bailing on plays early, but he is sensing pressure and moving around the backfield to extend plays. I think that is a GOOD thing. Now, we'll see if that habit continues once protection improves. IF IT DOES, then we have a problem. We don't want him moving around when he doesn't need to.

[X-Clown]

I never said Flacco played lights out. I said Flacco looked good and did what was needed to get 2 wins. He looked better than Clausen despite the stats you are pimping.

so again I will ask, you are claiming Clausen looked better than Flacco did through their first 2 starts?

They have similar statlines despite the fact that Jimmy played tougher competition and didn't have the support of one of the greatest defenses in the NFL. It's telling your argument is weak though since you keep backpedaling and try to change the focus of the discussion.

[Sloth]

Rookie, Matt Moore - 3 starts. He had no time to work on his chemistry and etc. that people are claiming is handicapping Clausen.

- 2 picks, Carolina went 2-1.

Smith - 22 receptions, 257 yards, 1 TD

what is Jimmy's excuse? for not being able to get Smith the ball again?

That's awesome. How'd he play recently?

[Peppers90 NC]

what the hell is this thread about? P55, you are quickly losing your faculties, settle down boy.

[mav1234]

Should note that Matt Moore's rookie starts came at the end of the season, against teams resting their starters (at least a couple of 'em, though he played great), having already played in multiple games, and having had quite a bit of practice time with Smitty (even if he hadn't taken a ton of first team reps, he was taking some).

[Squirrel]

Biggest problem with Clausen is the team is trying to win with him. Most teams protect the rookie QB by running the ball more and not put the game in their hands. The kid is going to get killed next week. Put Moore in and let him play against the Bears.