Rough Depth Chart (with position analyses)

[shaqattaq]

4 hours ago, CPcavedweller said:

The front 7 isn’t bad. 
 

We need to draft Tyler Warren. 
 

that’s my takeaway. 

Drafting a TE at #8 puts a knot in my stomach, but there's a really good chance that he could be BPA. He immediately improves all areas on offense, it's hard not to like him.

[MHS831]

12 hours ago, Aussie Tank said:

Wharton is gonna start over Robinson

I struggled with that one, and you are probably right.  I personally was hoping we cut Robinson, and that is still a possibility.  However, with Wharton's weak performance last year vs the run, I put Robinson (not much better) as the starter).

[MHS831]

11 hours ago, DaveThePanther2008 said:

I wouldn't be upset if we picked up another TE but Sanders showed improvement and with a full season under his belt could very well take the next step. Tremble is also getting better and better. Maybe Frank take the next step and becomes TE3. Hopefully 2024 was the last season we have to look at stone hands Thomas. 

TE might be a luxury pick that we cannot afford this year--that is why I dropped them on the priority list.  If they re-sign Franks and possibly Matthews, we could go with that.

[MHS831]

9 hours ago, TheSpecialJuan said:

Impressive work, man. 

It is the only way I can see the big picture...I am a visual learner, much like a toddler who likes porn, football, and long walks on the beach.

[MHS831]

7 hours ago, carpanfan96 said:

Nice job. They are letting Wallace start. They like Jalon Walker but as an edge. His ability to blitz and run with TE’s. 

That was a problem area for me--I do not see Wallace as a starting level ILB right now, and I do not see Walker's value as a pure edge.  Maybe my thinking was biased early on.  Walker himself said his value is if they move him around.  I guess with the versatility he's shown - working stunts, dropping in coverage, even spying athletic quarterbacks - would give Evero a valuable chess piece they can move around the formation.

[BeenPounding]

11 hours ago, MHS831 said:

This is rough.  I do these for myself-helps me keep up with all the chaos and see the blueprint at times.  It never hurts to share this with you, but the roster is very fluid--when I do this, it changes the next day. 

I see 12 areas that must still be addressed.  If you consider that only 3-4 draft picks make a difference, we still have work to do.  Of course, we have some depth players that could be in the plans and I am not aware--such as CBs Evans and Bartholomew, LBs Windmon, Rattigan, etc.

Hope this helps to see it all--I am sure there will be disagreements.  However, depending on what we do in free agency over the next few days, it seems the draft will address FS, WR, Edge early on. 

Yellow areas must be addressed.  This thing will not be valid by Thursday, so enjoy it now.

Offense   RED: IR or PUP;  PURPLE: PRACTICE SQUAD  

 

 

(0) Offensive Line: The Panthers are set, but they may still add a RT for depth and an eventual replacement for Moton. The key depth players (Mays, Zavala, and Christensen) have starting experience. Nijman will probably be cut, and Kingston could go back to the PS,    Mays and Christensen can play every position on the OL.  

(2) Wide Receiver:  Considering Moore and Devin Thompkins are free agents, the Panthers are currently with 3 Wide receivers. 2 more are needed, probably 3. Expect the Panthers to watch the waiver wire, sign an UDFA if possible, and draft one.

(1) Running Back:  After Chuba, nothing.  I think we will draft a RB on day 3, perhaps finding a UDFA or two for the PS. How the Panthers approach RB will tell us about  Brooks.

(0) Quarterback: The roster is set at QB, but the PS may not be. Is Plummer the #3?

(1) Tight End:  Similar to Wide Receiver, the Panthers have some horses in the barn, but no thoroughbred. The fact that the Panthers have not signed a TE in free agency might indicate they are drafting one or going to go with what they have.  Assuming they can’t address all needs, can the Panthers go with Sanders, Tremble, Franks (special teamer)? That depends on the offense and their opinion of Sanders. 

 

Analysis:  The Panthers must address WR and hit on two players who can contribute immediately.  Legette and Coker need to improve; AT needs to stay healthy.  I think they will sign a free agent WR before the draft.  Of course, the TE room could use a name brand TE to go with Tremble and Sanders.  TE can be a strength.  RB?  Don’t get desperate, but look for quality on day 3 of the draft. Frankly, I am sure that some very good RBs will not be drafted and would sign with Carolina knowing that they would have a shot at playing time as a rookie.

Offensive Needs:  WR, TE, WR, RB, and possibly RT

 

Defense

Edge: Jack  OLB Linebacker	Defensive End	Defensive Tackle	Defensive End	Edge: Sam OLB Linebacker
Jadav Clowney	Derrick Brown	Bobby Brown	A’Shwn Robinson	DJ Wonnum
		Shy Tuttle	T’Shwn. Wharton	Pat Jones
Amare Barno		Jaden Crumedy		DJ Johnson
Cornerback	Will LB	Mike LB	Nickel CB	Cornerback
JC Horn	Trevin Wallace	Josey Jewell	Chau Smith-Wade	Mike Jackson
	ChanderWooten	JacbyWindmon
Akayleb Evans	ClaudinCherilus	John Rattigan		S. Bartholomew
	Free Safety		Strong Safety
			Tre Moehrig
			D. Richardson

 

(0) Defensive Tackle:  Bobby Brown and Shy Tuttle with Crumedy on the PS. I think the Panthers are set.

(1) Defensive End: Derrick Brown, A. Robinson and T’Shawn Wharton.  Robinson had 5 sacks in 2024 and Wharton had 6.5.  Robinson is better vs. Run.  The draft is deep at DT. It is possible that the Panthers draft one later that is strong vs, the run.

(0) Sam Outside Linebacker:  Over TE and holds the edge.  DJ Wonnum, Pat Jones. DJ Johnson and Barno could be cut.

(1) Jack Outside Linebacker: Nine technique who gets to the QB.  Jadaveon Clowney needs an edge to limit his plays and mentor. This is interesting if Walker is the pick–not sure what it means.  It should be noted that Pat Jones had more sacks as a reserve in Minnesota.  

(1) Will Inside Linebacker:  Trevin Wallace should be the backup.  The Panthers need a starter.  Wooten will likely be cut.  

(1) Mike Inside Linebacker:  Jewell is getting up there in age and could use an understudy.  Rattigan and Windmon showed some promise,  I see an addition to this position in the draft.

(1) Cornerback:  Horn and Jackson are solid, Smith-Wade could be the nickel, but it is not his job at this point. There is no depth unless the Panthers like Evans and Bartholomew, a pair of CBs who played down the stretch and were decent. I think they will add one at some point. 

(0) Strong Safety:  Moehrig will be an upgrade at SS and he can play deep zone S.  Richardson is adequate depth.

(2) Free Safety: The Panthers will draft one and sign one in free agency later this week, imo.  There are some solid Safeties in the draft, but most are SS. 

Analysis: Morgan and company are focused on the defense, so they paid a lot of money to players who are good tacklers and strong against the run.  It is interesting that Morgan did not address LB in free agency, and we cannot expect Jewell and Wallace to hold it down in the absence of Shaq. The Panthers need an edge rusher, despite having Clowney, Wonnum, and Jones.  This could suggest that they like Javon Walker, planning to use him as the Will LB and an occasional edge rusher.  However, the Panthers have nothing at S. This is a difficult analysis because, as it stands right now, they are going to need to prioritize some areas and leave others in need of upgrading.  

Defensive Needs:  Free Safety, Edge (depth), Will Linebacker, Cornerback (depth), Defensive End (depth), Sam Linebacker (depth), Free Safety (depth)

Prioritized Needs

1. Wide Receiver

2. Free Safety

3. Edge (depth, future starter)

4. WIll Inside Linebacker

5. Running Back (depth)

6. Mike Inside Linebacker (depth, future starter)

7. Tight End

8. Defensive End (depth)

9. WIde Receiver (depth)

10. Cornerback (depth)

11. Offensive Right Tackle (depth)

12. Free Safety (depth)

 

2 hours ago, Stingray3030 said:

Here is my order in terms of positions of need going forward:

OLB/EDGE, S, RB, WR, DT, LB, CB, TE

I have no problem calling Tremble or Sanders TE1 - mid, but both were TE1 caliber.  I also have more faith in the development of our WR's than many here, but still have no issue putting it higher need.  I very much don't consider Clowney a starting OLB anymore - and he proved it last year.  His numbers and his pay are on par with Jones - so same same.  We desperately need to find starters at OLB and S - our last 2 starting openings.  

I expect our first 2 picks to be some combination of OLB and S - but I could see us taking BPA for DT.  I don't think WR or TE in the first round is the best idea (especially WR this year given the prospects).  If we are taking a WR I would rather see us trade back into RD1 for Burden or Tet since we have so much draft capitol.  RB in the 3rd round is also very tempting to me....Judkins, Henderson, Giddens, Skattebo - love em all in the 3rd.  I don't see any downside drafting a RB there.  If he's great, great - we can always trade a guy if we have too many in a year.  And if he sucks we are good too cause RB's are always available in FA and are fairly cheap these days...it is just a backup at this point.

Awesome work!!!

 

As much as I would love to grab Warren in the first, it's not the best allocation of resources.  Looking at the chart is one thing, but we need to look at what our biggest need and desires as a team are.

Last year we were able to score points against good and bad teams.  While the offense needs refinement, it isn't the issue holding us back from wins and losses.  It was our defense, point blank.

So in free agency we have shored up that unit, to a degree.  Getting DB back along with our additions and the players we have retained will create improvement.  The injury bug killed us at the start of the season.

Good things I saw from last year that helps us build:

Defensively:

* Jacoby Windmon - Think he is going to be a great depth piece at ILB.

* Richardson at S - I think he could be more of a FS if given the chance.  Adding a vet like Simmonds wouldn't be too bad of an idea as a mentor.

* Wonnom was better than expected after he returned from his serious injury.  I think you may be able to swap him and Clowney at this point of their careers.  Clowney is much better at edge setting than rushing.

* Mike Jackson was legit.  There was SOOO much pressure on the CB's last year because of our poor play from the front 7.

*Free safety is a concern, but I imagine we will get a solid free agent to fill that void.

Offensively:

* Coker - I think he's going to be special.  Great find

*AT - the dude still has IT.  He may be quicker in a phone booth than full field, but he did his job.

* TT and Sanders - we have something building here.  Tremble's year long injury and Sanders freak injury really hurt last year.  We need to add a Will Dissey type TE.  Vet who can block and get open in a pinch.  If we draft one I would really focus on Mitchel out of ND or Jackson Hawes from GT.  Bartholomew out of Pitt could be a great 7th round or UDFA.

* Our line is awesome.  If we add a RT to develop we are set.  I like Ozzy Trapilo or Ajani Cornelius. 

* RB depth - I think we need depth by committee.  I would use two draft picks here.  My first target would be Ollie Gordon III.  His stock has slipped, but he is great in pass protection, solid as a receiver, and can fit the bruiser role.  My second RB pick would be Breshard Smith our of SMU.  Smith is a great receiving back and would be solid as a returner.  Think Blacksheer 2.0, but a better runner.  If Dylan Sampson falls as low as the mocks say I wouldn't be opposed to him as well.  If we go the vet route, I would look at Foreman or Dobbins.

Draft:

* 100% on team trade back unless.... Graham or Carter slips.

* If we stay at 8, outside of the two listed above I think we need to look at Pierce/Walker as our top two options.  I like Walker as a chess piece ala Frankie Luvu, but that is a lot to bank on for that high of a pick.  Pierce may be an asshole, but I don't think he has been around alphas like Derek Brown/JC Horn/Clowney that can teach him how to be a pro.  Remember Donte Jackson?  You can change a rookie with the right culture.

* Trade back into the mid teens and grab an additional second round pick, WR is in play.  If I have the chance to draft any of these three Golden/Burden/Egbuka after picking up an additional 2nd I do it in a heart beat.  You could then trade up in the second to get a Donnavan Eziruaku or Mike Green or live with drafting Landon Jackson/Jack Sawyer/Princley without the trade.  Keeping two second round picks also allows you to add one more impact D-line player.  TJ Sanders or Deonte Walker sound much better added to our crop of FA additions.  Could you imagine a three man front of Brown, Walker, and Bobby Brown on obvious run downs?

 

Long story short, we are in a MUCH improved position than last year.  If we can get through camp without the rash of injuries we had last year I can truly see us making some waves in the NFC South this year.

[MHS831]

7 hours ago, NJPanthers89 said:

I think the TE room with Sanders and Tremble is set.  Two talented young guys who need to show up.  The WRs desperately need an alpha #1.  Leggette needs to really take a step forward, and we have to pray Thielen stays healthy.  Tet McMillan should be the target at 8 and would be a major upgrade to this offense.  A FA signing or two is inevitable as well.  
 

Defensively they are doing it right.  You don’t need a dominant expensive defense in today’s NFL.  You need a blue collar defense that can show up, stop the run, and create turnovers.  It’s very difficult to completely shut down other teams with the rules today.  The money should be spent on the offense, it’s an offensive driven league.  With that said there are obviously holes at LB and FS that Morgan will address at some point.  The roster is not going to be completely fixed this offseason but we should expect another trend to the upside with next off season being critical for a potential playoff push.  

I love Mason Taylor from LSU, but I believe that Sanders is developing and bringing in a #1 stud could be counterproductive to his development.  I also think Tremble was turning the corner as a blocking TE.  We have Franks (ST TE) and Jordan Matthews on the roster.   It would be a luxury pick--just depends.  Are we planning on running 12 personnel much?  I do not think so, but if we want to, that might be the only reason I see for adding a TE. 

[MHS831]

7 hours ago, kungfoodude said:

I am not sure about that. Wharton is really bad against the run.

I definitely see Robinson on early downs; I am confident that they rotate.  Brown, on the other hand, likes to stay in the game, but that may make him injury prone. 

[MHS831]

7 hours ago, Aussie Tank said:

The size speed slut that Morgan is almost guarantees Stewart as the pick for me. A sneaking end if round 2 pick for me is Jayden Higgens 

It would be a Legette-type pick, if you ask me.  I think drafting Jones may have reduced his lust for Stewart.  To me, all signs point to Walker or CB Will Johnson (let me explain:  If the defensive front becomes our strength, then the offense will throw it more. If Moehrig becomes a box safety, that might indicate that we are in a cover three look a lot.  Johnson is a zone CB, but Horn and Jackson can man up and press if needed. Smith-Wade then becomes the Dime back, as God intended.  If all this is how they are thinking, Will Johnson is attractive at #8).  I still see a free agent WR in our future.  It is also noteworthy that what I just described requires a smart, athletic FS.  There are some good S in the draft, but not a FS who can cover the field as a cover 3 deep S if necessary--the kid from South Carolina stands out. Just speculating--I have no idea what the are doing-hope they do. 

[MHS831]

5 hours ago, theinstrumental said:

Nice post! Crumedy's more of a backup end than a nose at only 305, right?

TY --I know that Evero had some small DTs last year--I thought he was listed as NT depth--but I think he is a three-spot depth player.  His best chance to play is to beat out Tuttle, imo, so I put him there.

[MHS831]

5 hours ago, CPcavedweller said:

The front 7 isn’t bad. 
 

We need to draft Tyler Warren. 
 

that’s my takeaway. 

I would love having him and I see the value.  I am concerned that we have so many other needs that lack the depth.  need vs. BPA?

Edited 3 hours ago by MHS831

[MHS831]

4 hours ago, Beast_3000 said:

Have you watched the tape on Tyler Warren? I think he could be the Alpha our TE/ WR room needs. He’s a good blocker 6-6 and I honestly think Tet McMillan is scared to run a 40 because his time would mirror Warren’s 4.6.

 

I love him if we only focus on TE as a need, but if you step back, can you justify taking him and leaving an elite CB, Edge, S, or WR on the table, positions that are probably bigger needs? As much as BPA is what they say, I am not sure that we can ignore these positions if you consider that only 3 players (on average) per draft make an impact.  I wish we were not in this situation, but Fitterer did us NO favors--he missed in free agency, he missed in the draft.

[MHS831]

2 hours ago, Camp Fodder said:

54 mil for a backup?

That is odd--if you look at the stats and not the pay, you probably start Robinson and play him on early downs and bring in Wharton on passing downs--but this might suggest that the Panthers are going to draft a DE (this draft has 24-starting caliber DT/DEs, according to Daniel Jeremiah) and cut Robinson, who is over 30.  Cutting Robinson would save $5.5m vs the cap.  To me, considering Robinson was "meh" last year and we just signed Wharton, I cut him and draft a rookie who is better at stuffing the run.  Since Brown could use a backup, we could draft 2 DEs.  The talent pool is incredibly deep this year.

Edited 3 hours ago by MHS831

[MHS831]

2 hours ago, Jay Roosevelt said:

QB:
We should look to add a developmental QB late in the draft, IMO. Never hurts to take a shot in the 6th or 7th round. I'm not sure Plummer is that guy. Bonus if it's someone who can be a short-yardage/QB sneak threat.

 

I really think there is some developmental talent in this draft at QB.  People look at QB as a day 1 starter, but there are 5 or so who will drop and could be great additions late.  In the fifth round, a player is likely not an impact player, so why not draft a Rourke and protect him on the PS?  When Dalton leaves and Bryce's big contract talks are heating up, it would be nice to have a guy seasoned in the system and ready to play.