Carolina Panthers GM Hurney won't be hurting for a job

[Baschski]

Wow I forgot how sick our '08 draft was.

[jramsey4]

I really think you all are giving Hurney too much credit for our drafts. If you look at the drafts prior to 07 (Gregory's first year) they were average at best. Now if you look at his contract's and FA acquisition he has been average to below average. I don't think he is as involved in scouting as one would assume.

I put this in the same ballpark as the HC and QB always getting too much credit or too much blame for a win or loss. If he walks we'll be fine as I wager Gregory would get a promotion at least until we see what happens this season.

[KillerKat]

I really think you all are giving Hurney too much credit for our drafts. If you look at the drafts prior to 07 (Gregory's first year) they were average at best. Now if you look at his contract's and FA acquisition he has been average to below average. I don't think he is as involved in scouting as one would assume.

I put this in the same ballpark as the HC and QB always getting too much credit or too much blame for a win or loss. If he walks we'll be fine as I wager Gregory would get a promotion at least until we see what happens this season.

qft!

[Snake]

Ater reading that type of racist verbage that you so easily quote,have you ever considered that you may be a racist?

LOL the thing about it is that I embrace whatever I am. If I am a racist so be it.:smilewinkgrin:

[cookinbrak]

I really think you all are giving Hurney too much credit for our drafts. If you look at the drafts prior to 07 (Gregory's first year) they were average at best. Now if you look at his contract's and FA acquisition he has been average to below average. I don't think he is as involved in scouting as one would assume.

I put this in the same ballpark as the HC and QB always getting too much credit or too much blame for a win or loss. If he walks we'll be fine as I wager Gregory would get a promotion at least until we see what happens this season.

That's why I posted the list. "Hurney's great in later rounds" or "Hurney knows how to find talent" is some folks logic, but look at how many players we have left from the last few drafts. Take away the first pick and it gets laughable.

[BF91]

I really think you all are giving Hurney too much credit for our drafts. If you look at the drafts prior to 07 (Gregory's first year) they were average at best. Now if you look at his contract's and FA acquisition he has been average to below average. I don't think he is as involved in scouting as one would assume.

Prior to '07? Haven't Peppers, Foster, Witherspoon, Gross, Manning, Gamble, Wharton, Davis, Hangartner, Haye, Williams, Marshall, Anderson, and King either started for us, are projected to start for us, or have started somewhere else? I'd say that having 15 of the 41 players we drafted between '02-'06 become starters is a pretty good ratio. As far as producing starters or expected starters is concerned, pre-Gregory and with Gregory has been about the same.

[KillerKat]

Prior to '07? Haven't Peppers, Foster, Witherspoon, Gross, Manning, Gamble, Wharton, Davis, Hangartner, Haye, Williams, Marshall, Anderson, and King either started for us, are projected to start for us, or have started somewhere else? I'd say that having 15 of the 41 players we drafted between '02-'06 become starters is a pretty good ratio. As far as producing starters or expected starters is concerned, pre-Gregory and with Gregory has been about the same.

Everyone from 07 to right now is still on the team except for Ryne Robinson and Tim Shaw. Thats 32 of 34 right now. And in your list Foster and Manning were one year wonders. And Haye only played in 2 games.

[BF91]

Everyone from 07 to right now is still on the team except for Ryne Robinson and Tim Shaw. Thats 32 of 34 right now. And in your list Foster and Manning were one year wonders. And Haye only played in 2 games.

Couldn't everyone from '07 til now still being on the roster be a product of the fact that they're younger, and therefore cheaper than the players we drafted from '02-'06? Some of those players moved on to other teams, and some never made it in the league. The same can be said of the players currently on the Panthers. Some of them will move on, becoming starters and back-ups for other teams, and some will never get another job after they're done being third-string for us.

Foster wasn't exactly a one-year wonder, he had three very solid seasons for us where he had well over 800 yards and was at or over 4.0 Y/C in two of those years. He didn't have much staying power after leaving, but he was good while he was here.

Manning was also not just a one-year wonder. He started one year for us and was a capable #3 CB for both us and Chicago. Again, not much staying power, but hardly a one-year wonder.

Haye only played in two games for us, but as I said in my original post, he started elsewhere. He's been a one-year wonder, recording 6 sacks in '07, but he went on to start another 29 games over the past two years.

[KillerKat]

players being cut from one team and starting for other teams does not mean what so ever that the GM from the team that player got cut from gets the credit. Especially if that player still sucked on the new team lmao.

[Woodie]

I really think you all are giving Hurney too much credit for our drafts. If you look at the drafts prior to 07 (Gregory's first year) they were average at best. Now if you look at his contract's and FA acquisition he has been average to below average. I don't think he is as involved in scouting as one would assume.

I put this in the same ballpark as the HC and QB always getting too much credit or too much blame for a win or loss. If he walks we'll be fine as I wager Gregory would get a promotion at least until we see what happens this season.

Most GM's rely heavily on their scouting department to evaluate players. So obviously the quality of the scouting plays a huge part in any GM's success rate. Of course they don't solely rely on scouts, but to blame Hurney for pre-Gregory draft mistakes without giving credit for post-Gregory draft hits is not providing an unbiased evaluation of his performance as GM.

No doubt that the drafting since Gregory has come on board has been better. But to be honest, it wasn't bad before. And one thing people need to realize is that the draft isn't just Hurney's call. Fox is HEAVILY involved with who we take. So along with the scouting department and Hurney, Fox should share the credit/curses for our drafts.

[Woodie]

Also, I don't know if anyone has thought about the fact that Hurney was just a cap manager until he took over as GM when Fox came here. And before that, he had been a newspaper man. So he didn't have a lot of experience evaluating talent. As a result, he most likely relied more heavily on his scout's and Fox's opinions (along with Bushofsky, who was top notch), and probably didn't have as much of a voice in the choices as he does now...despite the official word being that they had a three headed monster.

The point is that Hurney has grown as a GM. Sure, he's made mistakes, but all GM's do. However, taken as a whole, Hurney has been a key figure in putting this team together, and personally, I like the guys we have. So I can't really complain about the job he has done. Even the big contract to Jake and the Peppers fiasco were handled logically (despite some fans still not understanding - by choice or ignorance - the complexities of both situations).

[Baschski]

Someone please tell me how Hurney doesn't handle FA well? Is it because we don't blow half our salary cap on guys like Albert Haynesworth and Brandon Marshall? I think we've done a great job of picking up diamond-in-the-rough kinda guys at great value to plug in as needed. Despite what some people may think, generally the less involved you are in free agency and the less big-name signings you have, the better.

[jramsey4]

Someone please tell me how Hurney doesn't handle FA well? Is it because we don't blow half our salary cap on guys like Albert Haynesworth and Brandon Marshall? I think we've done a great job of picking up diamond-in-the-rough kinda guys at great value to plug in as needed. Despite what some people may think, generally the less involved you are in free agency and the less big-name signings you have, the better.

Last time I checked Marshall was never a FA. I don't mind how he has handled FA recently but he has made quite a few blunders when he has went after mid-high priced FA (Whale, K. Johnson, Hackett, Lucas). Its not that hard to find a gem when you sign 3 or 4 and see who works out (IE what we did in 08 at G).

Another problem I have with Hurney is how he is reactive instead of proactive. I know I saw how shallow we were at DT (especially NT) last year from how lousy we looked at the end of the season. We should have handled that position like we did G in 08. Or that could have been because of how cap screwed we were but that was a product of having tagged Pep for 17 mill.

I know I have said this time and again, he is Good not great. He is like the average looking girlfriend, not too bad but you could do better. But also like your GF if you dump her you might end up with a hot crazy women that wont leave (IE a GM that is horrible).

[Baschski]

Last time I checked Marshall was never a FA. I don't mind how he has handled FA recently but he has made quite a few blunders when he has went after mid-high priced FA (Whale, K. Johnson, Hackett, Lucas). Its not that hard to find a gem when you sign 3 or 4 and see who works out (IE what we did in 08 at G).

Another problem I have with Hurney is how he is reactive instead of proactive. I know I saw how shallow we were at DT (especially NT) last year from how lousy we looked at the end of the season. We should have handled that position like we did G in 08. Or that could have been because of how cap screwed we were but that was a product of having tagged Pep for 17 mill.

I know I have said this time and again, he is Good not great. He is like the average looking girlfriend, not too bad but you could do better. But also like your GF if you dump her you might end up with a hot crazy women that wont leave (IE a GM that is horrible).

Irrelavent that Marshall wasn't a FA. My point was that we don't reach to pick up high priced players like Marshall, trading or signing. Also, I understand your point at DT, but I think Hurney was very PROactive regarding the LB position, wasn't he? You can't take the DT situation alone and generalize about every decision.