NFL.com rankings, Panthers 30th ??!!?

[DudeNamedJeremy]

30 still bothers me. we have 2 of the top 10 possibly top 5 rbs in the league, one of the best o-lines in the league and arguably one of the best wrs..no i'm not talking about hines ward.

don't even get me started on the players we have on d...

30? seriously?

[CRA]

It may be different, but that doesn't mean they can't be as good or even better. The only player that the Panthers lost who is even close to being irreplaceable, was Peppers.

Peppers allowed Carolina to get by being average across the rest of the DL. Sure, he wasn't consistant but he still allowed for the Panther to be pretty weak elsewhere on the DL. There is a reason they paid the man 1 million a Sunday...and that is b/c they knew Pep at 75% allowed them to get away with a lot. Let's not forget an inconsistant and broken handed Pep easily put together one of his better seasons in a pretty strong overall career last year.

Based on the scheme Foxy plays....losing Pep, the DL now has the potential to be horrific. A horrific DL makes everyone behind them much worse.

A bad defense could ask a great ground attack based offense to become the type offense they aren't suited to be too often...thus making them less efficient.

Carolina has potential. Potential to be very bad or pretty good. Defensively, we are asking and hoping for a LOT imo in order for this team to be very good in 2010. It could happen. But it is not a surprise that those neutral look at Carolina and don't choose to see everything going "best case scenario" on defense. Thus, odds are high people think Carolina could have a rough year.

[koolkatluke]

Peppers allowed Carolina to get by being average across the rest of the DL. Sure, he wasn't consistant but he still allowed for the Panther to be pretty weak elsewhere on the DL. There is a reason they paid the man 1 million a Sunday...and that is b/c they knew Pep at 75% allowed them to get away with a lot. Let's not forget an inconsistant and broken handed Pep easily put together one of his better seasons in a pretty strong overall career last year.

Based on the scheme Foxy plays....losing Pep, the DL now has the potential to be horrific. A horrific DL makes everyone behind them much worse.

A bad defense could ask a great ground attack based offense to become the type offense they aren't suited to be too often...thus making them less efficient.

Carolina has potential. Potential to be very bad or pretty good. Defensively, we are asking and hoping for a LOT imo in order for this team to be very good in 2010. It could happen. But it is not a surprise that those neutral look at Carolina and don't choose to see everything going "best case scenario" on defense. Thus, odds are high people think Carolina could have a rough year.

Saying this you have too remeber they have been expecting this and preparing for the loss of J pep. EB and CJ have been waiting in the wings and they drafted more pass rusher this year. Plus you can say Pep carried the line but we still sucked until Hollis stabled the middle. The lost of Pep may hurt but the way they are attacking the problem is sound. Rotation - rotation- rotation send as many fresh bodies as you can send.

[CRA]

Saying this you have too remeber they have been expecting this and preparing for the loss of J pep. EB and CJ have been waiting in the wings and they drafted more pass rusher this year. Plus you can say Pep carried the line but we still sucked until Hollis stabled the middle. The lost of Pep may hurt but the way they are attacking the problem is sound. Rotation - rotation- rotation send as many fresh bodies as you can send.

at the same time, realistically CJ has been waiting in the wings awhile......Carolina never replaced Rucker nor Jenkins....and now they are faced with replacing Peppers. A great DE like Peppers will never be the deciding factor in a great run stopping unit. Hollis definately gets some credit there.

Rotation, rotation, rotation isn't a sure or even likely solution. If freah bodies where they key to a good DL and especially one that wanted to rely on front 4 pressure....every team in the NFL would have a good DL. Bodies aren't a solution if all they are is fresh bodies. I'll take a stud player over fresh bodies any day of the week. Multiple guys have to be something they have yet to be in order for this team to be good. That is a pretty big gamble.

[koolkatluke]

Peppers allowed Carolina to get by being average across the rest of the DL. Sure, he wasn't consistant but he still allowed for the Panther to be pretty weak elsewhere on the DL. There is a reason they paid the man 1 million a Sunday...and that is b/c they knew Pep at 75% allowed them to get away with a lot. Let's not forget an inconsistant and broken handed Pep easily put together one of his better seasons in a pretty strong overall career last year.

Based on the scheme Foxy plays....losing Pep, the DL now has the potential to be horrific. A horrific DL makes everyone behind them much worse.

A bad defense could ask a great ground attack based offense to become the type offense they aren't suited to be too often...thus making them less efficient.

Carolina has potential. Potential to be very bad or pretty good. Defensively, we are asking and hoping for a LOT imo in order for this team to be very good in 2010. It could happen. But it is not a surprise that those neutral look at Carolina and don't choose to see everything going "best case scenario" on defense. Thus, odds are high people think Carolina could have a rough year.

Same neutral opinoins can't look at the situations in Tampa, Oakland, KC, and Cleveland and think they are better that is plain not doing your job as a football reporter.

[CRA]

Same neutral opinoins can't look at the situations in Tampa, Oakland, KC, and Cleveland and think they are better that is plain not doing your job as a football reporter.

I don't disagree with that. Maybe i could see someone giving Tampa a slight bump. but it is slight. The rest I think stayed the same.

[monstercat]

This D-line will not be anything close to "horrific". We may not have Peppers anymore, but we do have some competent pass rushers and Louis Leonard will provide more pass rush up the middle than Kemo did.

I can understand being a little concerned about the D-line, but there is no need to go overboard and use words like horrific or horrible. It's not like they will all be learning a brand new system this time, like they were early last season when they gave up the majority of those rushing yards...and that was with Peppers in there.

[koolkatluke]

I don't disagree with that. Maybe i could see someone giving Tampa a slight bump. but it is slight. The rest I think stayed the same.

2 Rookie DT's and WR's both position usely take a few year too catch up too the speed in the NFL. How do they get any bump they've done nothing else too improve themsleves?

[CRA]

This D-line will not be anything close to "horrific". We may not have Peppers anymore, but we do have some competent pass rushers and Louis Leonard will provide more pass rush up the middle than Kemo did.

I can understand being a little concerned about the D-line, but there is no need to go overboard and use words like horrific or horrible. It's not like they will all be learning a brand new system this time, like they were early last season when they gave up the majority of those rushing yards...and that was with Peppers in there.

We don't know that. Brown has only proven to be a pass rushing down DE with still lots of learning to do, Tyler and Lenard are unproven at this point (neither has provided even average play for a team in years for different reasons), Brayton is a great patch inserted into a decent group at DL, and Johnson is a guy that has never achieved his potential yet.....

everyone on the DL people are assuming will be players they have not proven to be. The DL is a wildcard. Can't say it won't be bad. It is Fox's weakest DL on paper and his defenses ask a lot of them....more so than lots of defenses in the NFL.

Maybe the overboard on my end is just to keep balance. Can they stop the run? That is a question mark. Can they get the passer? That is another question mark. If they can't do neither they will make everyone behind them worse or if they do one poorly they will still make the rest weaker. Some people are too quick to assume this group will be something none of them have proven to be. This ain't the DL on paper you want if you are trying to run a Fox or a cover 2 defense in 2010.

I don't mind what is going on in Carolina. I just think 2010 people are choosing to look at things in a best case scenario across the board on defense. I think it is more optimistic than realistic.

[CRA]

2 Rookie DT's and WR's both position usely take a few year too catch up too the speed in the NFL. How do they get any bump they've done nothing else too improve themsleves?

it is year 2 imo of a rebuilding in Tampa. I expect them to overall be slightly better than they were overall last season. Not much, but don't think progress being made is absurd especially if Freeman is in all season.

[koolkatluke]

it is year 2 imo of a rebuilding in Tampa. I expect them to overall be slightly better than they were overall last season. Not much, but don't think progress being made is absurd especially if Freeman is in all season.

Freeman is not that good imo. Plus just like us they have added nothing.

On the Dline thing you could be right but it just seem too me that Fox and Co. have been preparing for this. Plus like MC said they have been in the system for a year and the guys are trying too prove somthing.

[CRA]

Freeman is not that good imo. Plus just like us they have added nothing.

On the Dline thing you could be right but it just seem too me that Fox and Co. have been preparing for this. Plus like MC said they have been in the system for a year and the guys are trying too prove somthing.

I don't think they have been preparing suceesfully but I am a negative nancy. I think they started preparing last season with the draft of Brown. But they were still searching for the next Rucker and anyone to step up replace what Jenkins brough on good days at DT when they realized they need to replace Peppers.

I think the DL could work but Foxy would have to do some of his best coaching and not get stuck in his stubborn ways. The LBs need to be successfully involved more and I don't see the front 4 approach or a heavy cover 2 being successful in 2010. They talent on this defense is at LB and imo in 2010 we aren't built to be playing Foxball on defense or Meeks cover 2.

I am anti Fox but imo I think he has a talented group of guys that IF he used properly he could have some surprising success. But he is gonna have to show us a lot more from a coaching aspect to make it work. If Fox is Fox I think it could a long year. The offense will be solid but the as long as they aren't put in position to be something they aren't.

[koolkatluke]

I don't think they have been preparing suceesfully but I am a negative nancy. I think they started preparing last season with the draft of Brown. But they were still searching for the next Rucker and anyone to step up replace what Jenkins brough on good days at DT when they realized they need to replace Peppers.

I think the DL could work but Foxy would have to do some of his best coaching and not get stuck in his stubborn ways. The LBs need to be successfully involved more and I don't see the front 4 approach or a heavy cover 2 being successful in 2010. They talent on this defense is at LB and imo in 2010 we aren't built to be playing Foxball on defense or Meeks cover 2.

I am anti Fox but imo I think he has a talented group of guys that IF he used properly he could have some surprising success. But he is gonna have to show us a lot more from a coaching aspect to make it work. If Fox is Fox I think it could a long year. The offense will be solid but the as long as they aren't put in position to be something they aren't.

You may be a Fox hater and when it comes too the offense side of the ball I'm with you more times then against but Defence is one thing Fox has had success in. No matter who we have lost the defence has most of the time finished in the top 10 or atleast 15. Now you can dog him about the way he handcuffs the offense but defence is somthing he will take control of if it isn't working the way he feels. Usely he gets the defence right.

[KatsAzz]

Here is the link for the one hour block where Steve spoke with the Mac Attack.

Go to the 20:15 mark.

http://wfnz.cbslocal.com/2010/06/08/mac-attack-hour-3-68/