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Morgan at the Shrine Bowl, talks about looking for players who are passionate (dawgs)

Captain Morgan

By Captain Morgan,
in Carolina Panthers

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d-dave Veteran

d-dave

Posted
Posted

As far as the draft, there is a balancing act between traits, production and the mental aspect of things.  I was listening to NFL on CBS (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LQXhu-VdOzs)

They mentioned a guy who was tenacious, a true dawg of a Center, but he's 5-11, 275lbs....  He just doesn't have the traits at the position.  Guys like DBrown would literally throw him through a wall like a child.  Just because he's a dawg doesn't mean we're going to go after him.

Anyone who thinks that there's some kind of one sized fits all, single attribute that determines draft stock - you're wrong.  It's a balancing act.

In the top 10, you NEED to get the absolute studs or a QB.  We got our QB (for now) so we need guys who will produce for years.  Look at Luke and CMC.  People devalued them because of their positions, but both ended up being exceptional players.  Heck, Luke will be a HOFer at some point.  If the Panthers feel that there are only 5-6 true 1st round, top 10 worthy selections, then you trade down.  Don't be hasty.  Be smart and flexible.

Now we all know the draft is a crap shoot.  Sure you can pretend like you have all the answers, but we don't.  Guys get hurt.  Guy can't transition to the NFL.  Some guys need time.  Others will hit the ground running and be instant all pros as a 5th round pick.  After the past few drafts, I'd rather go for volume than get tied to a single player.  We need all the help, talent and skill we can get!

Now if Mason Graham falls to 8, I'm sprinting up to the podium!

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MHS831 Grand Master

MHS831

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I am going to rock the boat because that is what boat rockers do, I think. 

Morgan will trade the #8 pick if he can if Carter is not on the board.  TMac, Graham are possible too. 

In his recent comments (forget where I read them--probably here) he referred to the #1 pick in general, but added that a trade was possible. 

I think it depends on what we do in free agency, but we have about 8 starting positions to fill:  (CB, S, S, LB, DT, DE, Edge, WR)  

So it makes sense, in a draft that seems deep in front 7 players, to trade back and try to grab 3 starters--NT, Edge, and S or WR.  I think we can get a DE (3,5 tech) later who can rotate with Robinson and Brown.

 

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MHS831 Grand Master

MHS831

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45 minutes ago, PanthersNCSU said:

Deven Thompkins is 5'8", 155 lbs

Not that we used him much at all at WR, but we at least have someone of Tez's size on the roster. Don't know if we'd consider it a no go, especially if he slips in the draft. 

He is tiny.  I should say that there are some decent WRs later in the draft--it is simply not loaded with #1 WRs.  I really like Bech from TCU, for example.

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WhoKnows Grand Master

WhoKnows

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22 hours ago, theinstrumental said:

We don't have to talk in hypotheticals. Morgan's been here since 2021. The traditional linebackers that we've drafted since then have been Brandon Smith and Trevin Wallace, both great size/speed athletes. DJ Johnson is another great athlete. We haven't drafted many guys who have a chance at impacting the run game--that could be the entire problem--but I can't think of anyone who failed because they're not physically talented enough. Michael Barrett, maybe? But we're talking about picks that matter.

You are confusing great athletes with talent. XL is a great athlete but I think Coker has shown to be more talented. Running routes and having great hands are “talents” for a WR.

DJ Johnson was never considered a great talented edge who just didn’t have enough passion.

We need great football players. DL that know how to get leverage, fire off the line the quickest and make plays. If you watched our defense, we had so many guys who couldn’t get off blocks or couldn’t maintain their gaps. Doesn’t mean they didn’t try hard or were bad athletes, they just weren’t good talented football players.

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SmokinwithWilly Grand Master

SmokinwithWilly

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First and foremost, I think when we do our evaluations we need to have our positional top tiers as guys that can actually do the fundamentals at their position. Catching with the hands at WR, footwork and bend on the lines, and for fugs sake, can they tackle someone. 

I'll use Greg Little as an example. He was graded 1st round material by Hurney and some others, then he went to the combine. His drills were awful. I honestly couldn't figure out how he got by in college because it was so bad. I'm no NFL scout, but even to the average football enthusiast, I'd say it was pretty obvious his movement and balance were never going to cut it. The rest is history. 

Some of these guys can be coached up, but we don't have years to do it for everyone. If the prospects can't meet basic skill requirements, no matter what the hype, we need to move on by. We've drafted too much on potential and too little on skill. After they pass the skills eye test, then move on to talent and dawg or whatever else. 

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frankw Grand Master

frankw

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Posted (edited)

I like Morgan a great deal from a personal standpoint for plainly obvious reasons but as the lead talent evaluator of this team I have become tired of this trope already. Ditch the RAS bullshit. Ditch the need to cling to feel good stories about prospects who have connections to the Carolinas and focus instead on who the best prospect is regardless of background or college they played for. Ditch the cliche tough guy tropes. Stop trying to think you're the smartest guy in the room and that you and only you see things 31 other GM's supposedly don't. Just draft good healthy(!) football players.

Edited by frankw
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    • MHS831
      Morgan at the Shrine Bowl, talks about looking for players who are passionate (dawgs)

      By MHS831 · Posted

      I think, at 8, there will be a player someone covets.  These top teams have few needs, so they might package a first and second and maybe a future pick to move up to take a player they covet.  Gonna think out loud here for a second-- Offensive tackle--I went to a site (randomly) that lists team needs in prioritized order. ELEVEN teams list OT as a priority.  (Ravens, Browns, Bears, Jets, Niners, Seahawks, Bucs, Chiefs, Packers, Commanders, Patriots, Rams).  IMO there are 2 elite OT prospects and probably 4 to 5 with first round grades. I see Sanders and Ward (QB), Hunter (CB), Carter (Edge) and Johnson (CB) going in the top 7--Graham or TMac are probably likely to go next.  The Jets pick 7 and will not be picking a QB.  They will probably take OT Will Campbell.  At that time, there is one elite OT left and ELEVEN teams that need an OT.  Granted, some will address this need in free agency, but how many starting OTs are available?  Now, consider you are the Chiefs, Seahawks, Packers, Bucs, or Ravens.  They have little to no cap space, so grabbing a stud OT in free agency is unlikely and there are not any.  You also realize that 10 or so picking before you need an OT.  Once the Jets take an OT---the Panther phones will be ringing--teams will target Kelvin Banks, OT Texas.  If they wait, they could hope that Josh Simmons (Ohio State) falls to them, but they are unlikely to wait for the unlikely.  So the Panthers will have to ask themselves, "Would I take the Commanders' first and second and the 2026 second rounder for our first rounder?"  We do not have a second rounder in 2026.  We'd pick 29th and 61st in 2025.  That would give the Panthers 3 picks in the first 61 picks.  So who might be there? Let's say that Graham (DE Michigan) is available at #8.  Most say "No brainer."  But the Phone rings offering you two second rounders to move back 21 spots in round 1.  You have a lot of needs.  What could you get? Estimates, based on Player Rankings: 27. Derrick Harmon, DT, Oregon 57. (from Rams--not part of trade)  Donovan Ezeiruaku, Edge, Boston College 61. Maxwell Hairston, CB Kentucky (assuming Mike Jackson leaves--Hairston has been eye opening at the SR Bowl practices) So basically, to give up on Graham, you get a good CB and a good DT and a future second rounder in a draft in which you had no second round.  
    • CPF4LIFE
      Morgan at the Shrine Bowl, talks about looking for players who are passionate (dawgs)

      By CPF4LIFE · Posted

      Except bryce did absolutely nothing at all accept show up with a lot of forced weight and back pack/ hoodie. No physical activity till his pro day. 
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