[The Athletic] How Bryce Young went from slumped shoulders and shaky footwork to soaring confidence

[kungfoodude]

3 minutes ago, Joe Bear said:

Cousins is a third-tier QB now. I'd take Prescott or Ryan (and Delhomme) over Goff any day.

Well Cousins might not even be a 3rd tier guy now, TBH. He looks a lot like Ryan at the end.

There is zero world where I would take Delhomme over any of those guys. He was never more than a 3rd tier QB. Goff/Prescott/Ryan were always 2nd tier QB's. 

Love Jake but he was never better than league average at his best.

[Joe Bear]

Just now, kungfoodude said:

Well Cousins might not even be a 3rd tier guy now, TBH. He looks a lot like Ryan at the end.

There is zero world where I would take Delhomme over any of those guys. He was never more than a 3rd tier QB. Goff/Prescott/Ryan were always 2nd tier QB's. 

Love Jake but he was never better than league average at his best.

Cousins is definitely cooked.

[kungfoodude]

2 minutes ago, Joe Bear said:

Cousins is definitely cooked.

I can't see him recovering but you never know. If he does, it's probably more like a Joe Flacco recovery than being prime Cousins.

[Navy_football]

6 minutes ago, kungfoodude said:

Well Cousins might not even be a 3rd tier guy now, TBH. He looks a lot like Ryan at the end.

There is zero world where I would take Delhomme over any of those guys. He was never more than a 3rd tier QB. Goff/Prescott/Ryan were always 2nd tier QB's. 

Love Jake but he was never better than league average at his best.

Yeah we tend to take a revisionist history approach with Delhomme. Yes we went to a Super Bowl and was a good team during his tenure. But a better QB would have led the Panthers to multiple Super Bowls. Receivers, running backs, oline, defense, special teams were all good to elite. Fox and his conservative approach (including playing DBs 15 yards deep on 3rd and 5) was the biggest issue with those teams. We got so excited about his last minute heroics. Forgetting that Delhomme was the reason the game was close to begin with.

[kungfoodude]

2 minutes ago, Navy_football said:

Yeah we tend to take a revisionist history approach with Delhomme. Yes we went to a Super Bowl and was a good team during his tenure. But a better QB would have led the Panthers to multiple Super Bowls. Receivers, running backs, oline, defense, special teams were all good to elite. Fox and his conservative approach (including playing DBs 15 yards deep on 3rd and 5) was the biggest issue with those teams. We got so excited about his last minute heroics. Forgetting that Delhomme was the reason the game was close to begin with.

He was a non-elite gunslinger. Those guys weren't super hard to find. He had one year that he finished top 10 in passing yds and two years in the top 10 in passing TD's.

Most of the guys we are comparing him to had many of those years.

[outlaw4]

3 hours ago, kungfoodude said:

Goff has 100% of the time been a tier above Delhomme. Jake was great for us but he was rarely more than a middle of the pack NFL QB.

Not going to say Delhomme was better as a pure player than Goff. But in crunch time, I would trust Delhomme way more than Goff. His clutchness is what made him work here, and I'm hoping some of those good moments Young had in tight moments is a sign he's also a QB that shines the best when it matters the most.

[kungfoodude]

Just now, outlaw4 said:

Not going to say Delhomme was better as a pure player than Goff. But in crunch time, I would trust Delhomme way more than Goff. His clutchness is what made him work here, and I'm hoping some of those good moments Young had in tight moments is a sign he's also a QB that shines the best when it matters the most.

Yeah, Delhomme has a higher GWD/GM Played ratio than Goff. I think it would even be more pronounced in the playoffs.

[PanthersGTI]

Delhomme was Farve lite on the field. 

[PootieNunu]

19 hours ago, outlaw4 said:

Not going to say Delhomme was better as a pure player than Goff. But in crunch time, I would trust Delhomme way more than Goff. His clutchness is what made him work here, and I'm hoping some of those good moments Young had in tight moments is a sign he's also a QB that shines the best when it matters the most.

Lets us not forget the 2008 season when Jake decided to lose his mind in the playoffs and throw 5 ints vs the Cardinals. We could have beaten that team easily and they ended up in the super bowl.

Goff has basically done the same thing Jake has in the playoffs, they both been to a super bowl and championship game. 

Edited 4 hours ago by PootieNunu

[Davidson Deac II]

21 hours ago, Navy_football said:

Yeah we tend to take a revisionist history approach with Delhomme. Yes we went to a Super Bowl and was a good team during his tenure. But a better QB would have led the Panthers to multiple Super Bowls. Receivers, running backs, oline, defense, special teams were all good to elite. 

Lots of better qb's have never lead a team to multiple Superbowls.  And imo, the only year we had truly elite talent on the offensive side was 2003/04.  Proehl, Moose, Smith,  Davis, Foster, and a Roided up offensive line.  The next few seasons, we drafted Williams, but didn't have anywhere near the talent level of 03.  08 saw us with some decent offensive talent when we added Stewart and brought Moose back, but by then Delhomme's arm was shot.  

In some ways, I think our 2005 run to the NFC championship game was amazing given that we had so little talent outside of Smith, on offense.  

Edited 3 hours ago by Davidson Deac II

[Johnstonny]

Did you see the QBs that are leading the playoffs? Did you see the QBs that were good and lost? Do we have that in Bryce? It is a team sport, and everyone needs to do their job to be great.

[kungfoodude]

7 minutes ago, Johnstonny said:

Did you see the QBs that are leading the playoffs? Did you see the QBs that were good and lost? Do we have that in Bryce? It is a team sport, and everyone needs to do their job to be great.

Well, one is a rookie, one is a tier 2 QB that is trending towards tier 3 with their current OC. The other two are elite.

[outlaw4]

1 hour ago, PootieNunu said:

Lets us not forget the 2008 season when Jake decided to lose his mind in the playoffs and throw 5 ints vs the Cardinals. We could have beaten that team easily and they ended up in the super bowl.

Goff has basically done the same thing Jake has in the playoffs, they both been to a super bowl and championship game. 

Not exactly an apples to apples comparison since the Cardinals game was post-Tommy John Delhomme who was throwing ducks for passes. He got away with it most of the season, but it fully unraveled in the worst possible way. He just wasn't the same QB anymore. Goff's best defense is getting concussed during the game but he'd already turned the ball over twice by the time he got hit.

30 minutes ago, Johnstonny said:

Did you see the QBs that are leading the playoffs? Did you see the QBs that were good and lost? Do we have that in Bryce? It is a team sport, and everyone needs to do their job to be great.

The common thread amongst the winning QB's is not turning the ball over. My biggest concern with Bryce is with the fumbles but he seems not to put the ball in danger through the air that often. Only way to find out for sure is getting to the playoffs.

[Davidson Deac II]

IMO, there are really only about 2-4 elite qb's in the NFL right now.  Mahomes, Burrow, Allen, and maybe Jackson.  And a few others that could become elite.  Getting an elite qb is one of the hardest things to do in the NFL.    

Edited 2 hours ago by Davidson Deac II