Anyone left who does not believe in Bryce ?

[mrcompletely11]

9 minutes ago, TD alt said:

Who has passed judgment? Y'all are a piece of work. You act like stating the obvious current trend on QB efficiency on two young QBs, including ours, is passing judgement. I know some of you have a difficult time comprehending, while others of you feign it. The story hasn't been written on either Stroud, or, more importantly, Bryce Young. As I am a Panthers fan, I am infinitely more interested in discussing Bryce, and not just in a negative sense whenever the topic of Stroud comes up like some...and I'm not going to apologize for it, and I'm not going to apologize for being tired of the understated shots at Young whenever the two come up, and I'm certainly not going to continue to discuss either of them within the context of the past, and definitely not going to negate the larger context of their current situations when comparing them presently and speculating about the future. Deal with it!

Someone is drunk

[CPF4LIFE]

I can only imagine this place if Stroud had of lost that game yesterday. As of matter of fact where is Icege and that awesome what's his face that's always responding to me??

Yall just gonna leave alt all by himself to lead the hate train like that?  Lol

[Joe Bear]

7 hours ago, mav1234 said:

Stroud had one of the better rookie seasons of all time, and had a bit of a slump his sophomore season but is in the playoffs, and stepped up when it mattered to help lead his team to victory.... It's easy to praise that kind of play and success.  Young's had a tougher road but is playing well now. It's harder to hang out hat on his accomplishments - it's still about his potential.

And as to pulling teeth, I dunno man. I don't see it that way anymore. You've got people like Frankw and me saying we're excited for next year and saw real growth.

Meanwhile we've got you coming in and calling Stroud pedestrian and others in the playoff thread trolling after a drive... So the trolling then brings in people to defend Stroud etc... 

I think he said Stroud was having a pedestrian game. One TD is pedestrian, considering five Young TDs in one game was described on this board as "efficient" and "not bad". If five's efficient, that standard implies that one would probably be trash.

Stroud also has one of the best defenses in the NFL to lean on when he's having a pedestrian game, while Young has one of, I'll be kind and say, one of the three worst defenses of all time -- a defense that allowed 653 more rushing yards than the 31st-ranked defense.

A lot of that falls on injury luck, which has not hurt Houston but destroyed the Panthers in the sense that two of the top three defensive players on the roster were lost for the season in Weeks 1 and 3 respectively. But it's impossible to blow out a team when you put up points but the defense is swiss cheese. Stroud knows he can score 20 and win. Hell, Young's had to be pushing or above 40 the last three weeks just to have a chance. It's OK to be cautiously optimistic about Young. Excited, even. Convinced he's a star? Some are. I'm not. But hey, he could be. This is the first year in a long time that you're entering it with hope of genuine good QB play.

[Joe Bear]

41 minutes ago, CPF4LIFE said:

I can only imagine this place if Stroud had of lost that game yesterday. As of matter of fact where is Icege and that awesome what's his face that's always responding to me??

Yall just gonna leave alt all by himself to lead the hate train like that?  Lol

I mean, the inverse is also true. Many can imagine this place if Young's Week 18 was like Herbert's Week 19. I know you'd have been on here 10x as much as you were.

No one's saying it's not OK to like Stroud too. He was No. 1 on my board, after all. But he doesn't play here, so some should maybe consider a move to the Texans board, where like-minded people reside.

[mav1234]

1 minute ago, Joe Bear said:

I think he said Stroud was having a pedestrian game. One TD is pedestrian, considering five Young TDs in one game was described on this board as "efficient" and "not bad". If five's efficient, that standard implies that one would probably be trash.

Stroud also has one of the best defenses in the NFL to lean on when he's having a pedestrian game, while Young has one of, I'll be kind and say, one of the three worst defenses of all time -- a defense that allowed 653 more rushing yards than the 31st-ranked defense.

A lot of that falls on injury luck, which has not hurt Houston but destroyed the Panthers in the sense that two of the top three defensive players on the roster were lost for the season in Weeks 1 and 3 respectively. But it's impossible to blow out a team when you put up points but the defense is swiss cheese. Stroud knows he can score 20 and win. Hell, Young's had to be pushing or above 40 the last three weeks just to have a chance. It's OK to be cautiously optimistic about Young. Excited, even. Convinced he's a star? Some are. I'm not. But hey, he could be. This is the first year in a long time that you're entering it with hope of genuine good QB play.

You may want to read more of his posts. He's been talking about Stroud all year... Or really, in a specific window (second half of the season lol) where one can compare Bryce favorably to him.  He's talking about trends etc. 

I'd argue Stroud was better than pedestrian that game, anyway. But then, I watched the game, while you're referring to stats and he's referring to commentators thoughts on the game lol.  320 yards isn't pedestrian imo.

Also basically NOBODY thinks Bryce's last game was just "not bad"... There's not some big group of fans that thinks Young's 5 TDs was just efficient and not exceptional... In fact the few haters yet acknowledge that's a lot of TDs but have pointed out that players like Daniel Jones did the same so maybe don't get too excited yet... I refuse to entertain the idea anyone that is above trolling level is unimpressed by Bryce's last game.

[Joe Bear]

Just now, mav1234 said:

You may want to read more of his posts. He's been talking about Stroud all year... Or really, in a specific window (second half of the season lol) where one can compare Bryce favorably to him.  He's talking about trends etc. 

I'd argue Stroud was better than pedestrian that game, anyway. But then, I watched the game, while you're referring to stats and he's referring to commentators thoughts on the game lol.  320 yards isn't pedestrian imo.

Also basically NOBODY thinks Bryce's last game was just "not bad"... There's not some big group of fans that thinks Young's 5 TDs was just efficient and not exceptional... In fact the few haters yet acknowledge that's a lot of TDs but have pointed out that players like Daniel Jones did the same so maybe don't get too excited yet... I refuse to entertain the idea anyone that is above trolling level is unimpressed by Bryce's last game.

I think there are about five posters on here who want Young to not play well because it means they're wrong, and their posts reflect that mindset on a consistent basis.

Personally, I'd rather the Panthers win and Young play well, whether I predicted it (I didn't) or not.

There's definitely a possibility some people on here are spouting opinions they don't even believe, just for engagement and to see if others will agree with them. It's very common in the political sphere. I want to say I wish I joined this sinking ship before it was feet from the ocean floor, but with some of the discourse, or lack thereof, I'm not certain about that.

[mav1234]

Just now, Joe Bear said:

I think there are about five posters on here who want Young to not play well because it means they're wrong, and their posts reflect that mindset on a consistent basis.

Personally, I'd rather the Panthers win and Young play well, whether I predicted it (I didn't) or not.

There's definitely a possibility some people on here are spouting opinions they don't even believe, just for engagement and to see if others will agree with them. It's very common in the political sphere. I want to say I wish I joined this sinking ship before it was feet from the ocean floor, but with some of the discourse, or lack thereof, I'm not certain about that.

It think five is an overestimate... Cp4LIFE may be one but not sure who else.  I think for the most part there's still a few fans unconvinced but only a couple that want Bryce to fail.  I don't think you're claiming I'm in that group but I definitely am not.

But a lot of us that are Stroud fans are not like that... 

There's a lot of trolling in this thread - the guy you were quasi defending, he even admitted to basically just trolling here. It does derail things quite a bit... Ah well. Forums are like that 

[Joe Bear]

8 minutes ago, mav1234 said:

It think five is an overestimate... Cp4LIFE may be one but not sure who else.  I think for the most part there's still a few fans unconvinced but only a couple that want Bryce to fail.  I don't think you're claiming I'm in that group but I definitely am not.

But a lot of us that are Stroud fans are not like that... 

There's a lot of trolling in this thread - the guy you were quasi defending, he even admitted to basically just trolling here. It does derail things quite a bit... Ah well. Forums are like that 

Nah, I'm not claiming you're in any group. You seem pretty level-headed to me and most of your opinions are similar to mine.

[CPF4LIFE]

4 minutes ago, mav1234 said:

It think five is an overestimate... Cp4LIFE may be one but not sure who else.  I think for the most part there's still a few fans unconvinced but only a couple that want Bryce to fail.  I don't think you're claiming I'm in that group but I definitely am not.

But a lot of us that are Stroud fans are not like that... 

There's a lot of trolling in this thread - the guy you were quasi defending, he even admitted to basically just trolling here. It does derail things quite a bit... Ah well. Forums are like that 

Its so funny to me....I have NEVER posted i wanted bryce to fail. I said from the very beginning I didn't think he would be a good pro based off evaluation right here on this forum. There is a difference..but People tend to hear things the way they want to hear them and address you as such. I also don't bash Bryce as much as people claim...acknowledging his improvement and at the same time calling out how his performances have been overrated by certain folks is not bashing. Hell, I think I would know my post aren't that frequent outside of gamedays. I got stuff to do than sit on here all day like anybody else. I know what I say and I know my stance on bryce. I don't hate the guy, i never claimed that. I would say I have more heat for fans that blindly defend him for everything including the local media then bryce directly who actually takes accountability.

[mav1234]

3 minutes ago, CPF4LIFE said:

Its so funny to me....I have NEVER posted i wanted bryce to fail. I said from the very beginning I didn't think he would be a good pro based off evaluation right here on this forum. There is a difference..but People tend to hear things the way they want to hear them and address you as such. I also don't bash Bryce as much as people claim...acknowledging his improvement and at the same time calling out how his performances have been overrated by certain folks is not bashing. Hell, I think I would know my post aren't that frequent outside of gamedays. I got stuff to do than sit on here all day like anybody else. I know what I say and I know my stance on bryce. I don't hate the guy, i never claimed that. I would say I have more heat for fans that blindly defend him for everything including the local media then bryce directly who actually takes accountability.

Your crazy insane negativity and weird takes makes me wonder otherwise lol. But it's fine to have high standards if that's all it is.

[CPF4LIFE]

34 minutes ago, Joe Bear said:

I mean, the inverse is also true. Many can imagine this place if Young's Week 18 was like Herbert's Week 19. I know you'd have been on here 10x as much as you were.

No one's saying it's not OK to like Stroud too. He was No. 1 on my board, after all. But he doesn't play here, so some should maybe consider a move to the Texans board, where like-minded people reside.

My guy...Youngs first 2 weeks was about as ugly as it gets. My energy didn't change. There was nothing really to be said, he was benched and wasn't the topic of discussion far as I was concerned for a while. I

[CPF4LIFE]

2 minutes ago, mav1234 said:

Your crazy insane negativity and weird takes makes me wonder otherwise lol. But it's fine to have high standards if that's all it is.

Lol...That in fact is a troll my guy. And I am far from it. What's funny is up to bryce getting benched there was nothing you can say whatsoever to even dispute my opinion. Hell, bryce was looking WORSE than what i ever thought he would be...thats facts. It surprised me. The people that wanted to argue were quiet for weeks, some even told me I was right. One of my close friends did who was a bryce guy. I never trolled them during that time but then bryce comes back shows some life and now they have so much energy and want to be COMBATIVE, PULL RECEIPTS and whatever else they think is getback. Take all that into consideration and you think my takes are insanely negative and weird? Lol....Yeah okay cool, it sounds like you just don't want to look at it from another perspective. Thats okay too.

[tukafan21]

1 hour ago, Joe Bear said:

I think there are about five posters on here who want Young to not play well because it means they're wrong, and their posts reflect that mindset on a consistent basis.

Personally, I'd rather the Panthers win and Young play well, whether I predicted it (I didn't) or not.

There's definitely a possibility some people on here are spouting opinions they don't even believe, just for engagement and to see if others will agree with them. It's very common in the political sphere. I want to say I wish I joined this sinking ship before it was feet from the ocean floor, but with some of the discourse, or lack thereof, I'm not certain about that.

I'm not sure there are any actual Panthers fans that WANT Bryce to fail or not play well.  I'm as anti-Bryce as they come on this board, and I don't want him to fail.  I just have no faith in him ever being able to be the type of QB who is going to raise the level of play from his teammates and drag them to wins and SB contention.  And because of that, as long as he's our starting QB, our ceiling as a team will always be limited.

Yes, I'll admit that this season he changed my mind from saying he should already be out of the league to thinking he actually could be a below average game manager starting QB in this league.  But outside of Week 18, this turnaround from him still had him putting up well below average stats, it was just better than it was before, but it was nowhere near great.

So no, I just don't think he can ever be even a Top 20 QB in this league, who can be the reason you win games on a consistent basis.

Saying that doesn't mean I want him to fail, it's just calling it like I see it.  Do I hope I'm wrong and he turns into the next Drew Brees?  Of course, but to say I think it will happen would just be lying.