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Serious question: Jameis Winston or Bryce Young straight-up?

HardcoreHokie

By HardcoreHokie,
in Carolina Panthers

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MHS831 Grand Master

MHS831

Posted
Posted
21 hours ago, HardcoreHokie said:

Nevermind LOL

Jameis being Jameis.

But it’s still an intriguing comparison of different careers for a #1 overall.

I think I could like him (as a teammate) in small doses--but he is a unique individual

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kungfoodude Grand Master

kungfoodude

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Depends on the kind of offense you are running and team you have. Winston can perform better on a team with an elite defense that can erase his mistakes(which will come). But, turnovers are also anathematic to modern NFL offenses. Winston also doesn't have any more upside. He has reached 100% of his potential as a player. He's a cannon armed, TO prone gunslinger that will make insane plays that few in the league can and he will throw INT's that will make middle school QB's blush. You'll live and die by his decisions.

Bryce is a fairly ceiling limited and far less developed player. He will never be able to make the insane throws or comebacks or do any of the wild things that Winston does. He also won't be all too often heaving crippling INT's. He is a guy that can MAYBE effectively manage a game and put you in positions to win, with the right people around him and the right sort of team. 

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mav1234 Grand Master

mav1234

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1 hour ago, kungfoodude said:

Depends on the kind of offense you are running and team you have. Winston can perform better on a team with an elite defense that can erase his mistakes(which will come). But, turnovers are also anathematic to modern NFL offenses. Winston also doesn't have any more upside. He has reached 100% of his potential as a player. He's a cannon armed, TO prone gunslinger that will make insane plays that few in the league can and he will throw INT's that will make middle school QB's blush. You'll live and die by his decisions.

Bryce is a fairly ceiling limited and far less developed player. He will never be able to make the insane throws or comebacks or do any of the wild things that Winston does. He also won't be all too often heaving crippling INT's. He is a guy that can MAYBE effectively manage a game and put you in positions to win, with the right people around him and the right sort of team. 

Although I think you're not entirely wrong, I'll say that Bryce has seemed very, very good with comebacks the last few weeks. And nothing ruins a comeback like a turnover - which Winston just loves.

He's had like 8 TDs and 8 INTs in the last four games, lol. And 4 of those TDs (and 3 INTs) came in just 1. 

I just don't think he's a wise player to have as more than a backup, while the jury is now out on Bryce (he got a retrial after a guilty verdict was overturned in appeal, it seems)

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frankw Grand Master

frankw

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Not a comparison that makes sense. They are at completely opposite stages of their careers.

Still. With all the hopium in the air right now it is worth noting that while as a passer he is known for his boneheaded decisions currently Jameis Winston is 20th in passer rating while Bryce Young sits at 41.

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mav1234 Grand Master

mav1234

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18 minutes ago, frankw said:

Not a comparison that makes sense. They are at completely opposite stages of their careers.

Still. With all the hopium in the air right now it is worth noting that while as a passer he is known for his boneheaded decisions currently Jameis Winston is 20th in passer rating while Bryce Young sits at 41.

QB rating doesn't care about interceptions very much as long as there's also TDs. In general, coaches don't see it that way... Or Winston wouldn't be on his third team. Plus over the last 4 games Bryce has an average QB rating of 85 and Jameis has an 80.  But imo Jameis has had tougher opponents (and his team has thus score less than us). So... We will see how Bryce goes.

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frankw Grand Master

frankw

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23 minutes ago, mav1234 said:

QB rating doesn't care about interceptions very much as long as there's also TDs. In general, coaches don't see it that way... Or Winston wouldn't be on his third team. Plus over the last 4 games Bryce has an average QB rating of 85 and Jameis has an 80.  But imo Jameis has had tougher opponents (and his team has thus score less than us). So... We will see how Bryce goes.

Jameis has more experience. But while Jameis has always had dicey decision making at best he's always had that big play home run potential at any given moment. Fair or not we're still waiting to see that from Bryce. And that's what separates the two of them as first overall picks.

No offense or disrespect to anyone else but as a Panthers fan who has seen a lot I don't consider that a sample size compared to the whole body of work but that's just my opinion. We're talking 25 total games. To me a true sample size will be the last 4 games paired with the remaining games on the schedule. If Bryce can sustain consistency throughout that whole stretch then we have something to build on. But  I refuse to deal in these hopes revolving around 4 games or less. Seen it with Kyle Allen. Seen it with Teddy Bridgewater. And realistically we can name any number of QB's who have strung together a handful of impressive games but ultimately faded back to the norm. We will have to wait and see which category Bryce lands.

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    • mav1234
      Serious question: Jameis Winston or Bryce Young straight-up?

      By mav1234 · Posted

      I understand the hesitancy. The one reason I'm hopeful is Bryce's biggest improvements have been on deep routes that are very hard to defend and demonstrate a high level of play. A lot of Teddy and Allen's 'high level' play was right at the LoS. But it's only been a few games like you say. We shall see. The good thing is we have a number of games left to evaluate him.
    • CPF4LIFE
      PFF names Panthers QB Bryce Young the best deep passer

      By CPF4LIFE · Posted

      Show me where I haven't given him his props for playing better? Do you UNDERSTAND how bad he was to start the year? So anything that isn't absolutely horrible was an improvement for bryce....do you get that? Far as throwing dimes yeah the reactions are different but also just maybe.....WE SHOULD BE USE TO IT BY NOW and not still waiting till the back half of YEAR 2. You ever think maybe some folks feel that way? Aidan O connel performance doesn't take away but WE didn't start the circle jerk comparisons of the teams we play and where there ranked against whoever the qb was starting here. When dalton stepped in last year and threw 300 yards and 3 tds against Seattle all we heard was how trash Seattle defense was. He steps in this year and does it again against the Raiders and the bengals but those teams defenses are also trash according to some of you so it doesn't matter. Therefore, you can't blame people for applying that same logic to bryce and if another qb performs even better against that same team. If the roster is so weak no qb should be having good games and if bryce is the best qb on the roster then he should be putting up the better games no matter who we play.  Once again,  I have acknowledged his improvement but let's not try to sit here act like demanding crow, apologies, and retractions is somehow the same thing. It's still to early for that and nothing but built up emotion. 
    • Mage
      PFF Weeks 9-13 top passing grades

      By Mage · Posted

      If you include Week 8, he drops to 13th in offensive grade and 11th in passing grade.   Still pretty solid.  
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