Serious Thoughts Fellas What numbers would Bryce..

[Mage]

3 minutes ago, CRA said:

I could throw a 99 yard TD pass to XL.  

Fun fact: There have only been 13 99-yard TD passes in NFL history.

We haven't had one since 2011, Eli to Cruz.  There were two in 2011 (Brady to Welker).

Edited 9 hours ago by Mage

[bythenbrs]

1 hour ago, strato said:

His passing chart needs to look like a good NFL quarterback. With no red dots and plenty of downfield completions. 
The team has to run an offense that doesn’t rely on screens and flairs and rollouts. 
I don’t think that is going to happen. 

The full route tree, not the simplified ‘what can Bryce realistically do’.  Can he make ALL the throws?

[SmokinwithWilly]

27 minutes ago, Icege said:

This has been asked multiple times throughout the season... Most of the reasonable fans frustrated by Bryce's performance just want to see him string together consecutive performances as well as be who uplifts the team when they're struggling sometimes.

However, when it comes to the folks that seem to hate him, they're never going to be happy. That's why they won't say what their threshold is... because it doesn't exist. Instead it's, "Oh, I know he'll never hit 4000yds, 40+ TDs, under 5 INTs, and a winning Powerball ticket... But I know the future and that he'll never do that so tank tank tank."

Here's the problem with using stats only. Without the proper context, they're worthless. Example. Bryce throws for 3000 yards and 40 touchdowns. Amazing right until you view the context. Those numbers are generated by 40 75 yard screen passes that go for TDs. Now Bryce threw for 40 air yards on all those plays combined. Was it the receiver or Bryce who was responsible for all those stats? Obviously, this is a completely impossible scenario, but it is exaggerated to illustrate the issue with judging statistics alone. 

The eye test is a far better qualifier of is he an NFL franchise QB. Is he seeing the field? Is he able to go through his progressions. When the pocket gets squeezed, does he bail out or step up? If the defense stacks 8 in the box to stop the run, is he able to make them pay for it? Can he make the deep throws consistently with accuracy? Right now, he looks like he might be able to be a backup QB. Unless he makes a serious improvement in his overall game, I'm still looking for another franchise QB come off season. 

 

Edited 8 hours ago by SmokinwithWilly

[trucpfan]

6 minutes ago, SmokinwithWilly said:

Here's the problem with using stats only. Without the proper context, they're worthless. Example. Bryce throws for 3000 yards and 40 touchdowns. Amazing right until you view the context. Those numbers are generated by 40 75 yard screen passes that go for TDs. Now Bryce threw for 40 air yards on all those plays combined. Was it the receiver or Bryce who was responsible for all those stats? Obviously, this is a completely impossible scenario, but it is exaggerated to illustrate the issue with judging statistics alone. 

The eye test is a far better qualifier of is he an NFL franchise QB. Is he seeing the field? Is he able to go through his progressions. When the pocket gets squeezed, does he bail out or step up? If the defense stacks 8 in the box to stop the run, is he able to make them pay for it? Can he make the deep throws consistently with accuracy? Right now, he looks like he might be able to be a backup QB. Unless he makes a serious improvement in his overall game, I'm still looking for another franchise QB come off season. 

 

I’m with this I’m using this next week in the barbershop, it might be more eye test then stat sheet. I do understand a deceptive stat sheet but I was thinking of normal plays not an abundance of screens or quick hitches but just normal QB play to determine if we’re going to try another year with Bryce being we gave up a tremendous amount for him.

[kungfoodude]

1 hour ago, LinvilleGorge said:

Numbers he isn't capable of putting up on a consistent basis. I've already seen enough. He just doesn't have the talent to be a viable starting QB in the NFL.

Yeah, this is basically the same as asking, "What if Bryce Young suddenly had Patrick Mahomes brain, how would he do?"

It isn't happening. This ship is beyond sailed. Send him somewhere else, let us move on and him move on. 

[Icege]

10 minutes ago, SmokinwithWilly said:

Here's the problem with using stats only. Without the proper context, they're worthless. Example. Bryce throws for 3000 yards and 40 touchdowns. Amazing right until you view the context. Those numbers are generated by 40 75 yard screen passes that go for TDs. Now Bryce threw for 40 air yards on all those plays combined. Was it the receiver or Bryce who was responsible for all those stats? Obviously, this is a completely impossible scenario, but it is exaggerated to illustrate the issue with judging statistics alone. 

The eye test is a far better qualifier of is he an NFL franchise QB. Is he seeing the field? Is he able to go through his progressions. When the pocket gets squeezed, does he bail out or step up? If the defense stacks 8 in the box to stop the run, is he able to make them pay for it? Can he make the deep throws consistently with accuracy? Right now, he looks like he might be able to be a backup QB. Unless he makes a serious improvement in his overall game, I'm still looking for another franchise QB come off season. 

 

Agreed. A healthy bit from column A (stats) and column B (film) paints the most accurate picture, which is currently that Bryce is not performing up to the standard a 1st round QB (let alone drafted #1 overall) is expected to (statistically). When we dig into the film to see why, we see that while he's having his struggles (not stepping up in the pocket, bailing out early, hesitating on some throws, making occasional bad reads, etc) the team that surrounded him last season was simply awful. Bottom 5 defense, bottom 5 OL, bottom 5 weapons... but somehow one player has to overcome ALL of that in their rookie season? Yeesh...

Taking this season into consideration, he started where he left off last season and was rightfully benched. Since starting again, the team has gotten on its first winning streak in a few years and he's made good plays to keep them in the game. Is he lighting it up? Nah... but he is beginning to show the reason so many draftniks had him as QB1a for his class.

Re: what the team does next season... who friggin knows anymore at this point T_T. Resign Dalton? Sign Jones? Draft somebody in the mid-to-late rounds? Go with another UFA? Maybe grab an FA that can compete with Bryce for the starting position and draft a rookie to sit and develop? Might be best of both worlds for the team, but ugh... not a fun position to still be in with question marks throughout the position group.

[UnluckyforSome]

It does not matter. He cannot do it.

[SmokinwithWilly]

20 minutes ago, Icege said:

Agreed. A healthy bit from column A (stats) and column B (film) paints the most accurate picture, which is currently that Bryce is not performing up to the standard a 1st round QB (let alone drafted #1 overall) is expected to (statistically). When we dig into the film to see why, we see that while he's having his struggles (not stepping up in the pocket, bailing out early, hesitating on some throws, making occasional bad reads, etc) the team that surrounded him last season was simply awful. Bottom 5 defense, bottom 5 OL, bottom 5 weapons... but somehow one player has to overcome ALL of that in their rookie season? Yeesh...

Taking this season into consideration, he started where he left off last season and was rightfully benched. Since starting again, the team has gotten on its first winning streak in a few years and he's made good plays to keep them in the game. Is he lighting it up? Nah... but he is beginning to show the reason so many draftniks had him as QB1a for his class.

Re: what the team does next season... who friggin knows anymore at this point T_T. Resign Dalton? Sign Jones? Draft somebody in the mid-to-late rounds? Go with another UFA? Maybe grab an FA that can compete with Bryce for the starting position and draft a rookie to sit and develop? Might be best of both worlds for the team, but ugh... not a fun position to still be in with question marks throughout the position group.

He's made some plays but he's also missed throws when it mattered. An interception and timely fumble got the win vs the Giants. The true test of whether or not he's progressing is going to come against playoff caliber teams.

Next season? It's unpopular, but I'd bring in several QBs, one through the draft if we like him. I'd bring in Jones (for the right price) or Hooker if we could get him to compete with Bryce and Dalton for the starting and backup position and cut whoever doesn't get it done. Draft position be damned at this point. Put the best QB on the field and take out the trash. 

[CBDellinger]

I dont think I'd focus on just numbers... Im just as interested to see if he can lead the team and if the players will rally around him.  We gotta see competitive football and more clips like the one JC Horn posted after the game in Germany.  If the team has his back then fugg it.

[Jon Snow]

You should ask Canales and Morgan that question because I have absolutely no say in the matter and neither do you.

[strato]

Apparently 126 or whatever it was passing will do it. And yeah it doesn't matter what I think either. 

 

[CBDellinger]

22 minutes ago, Jon Snow said:

You should ask Canales and Morgan that question because I have absolutely no say in the matter and neither do you.

I mean... hes not wrong.

[Gapanthersfan]

His style of play is limited by his physical ability, hence, the field of play is condensed. we need someone who can make all the throws. If this team is content with winning 9 games a season, every other season, relying heavily on premium offensive talent… 

Bryce’s ceiling is maybe 1-2 games above .500, as long as he is surrounded by playmakers. The whole point of a franchise QB is to make B- talent look like pro-bowlers, and load up the defense with capital you didn’t have to spend on the O. We have that equation exactly ass backwards. 

[Panthering]

Can he get to 100+ yards passing by halftime? It seems impossible for him. He shows off in garbage time when the opposing defense lets up. I agree with everyone else about the eye test, he routinely fails that. The best eye test thing I saw from the Giants game was he actually stood tall in the pocket some, even stepping up in the clean pocket to make the pass. Keep doing that and throwing with anticipation and maybe it'll work out some for him. But I just don't have much hope for him long-term.