Build up the Dline, just like the Oline

[Manna]

[Navy_football]

29 minutes ago, catnip said:

On the defense it depends on if Evero stays .  Do we stay 3-4 or go 4-3 ..On offense it depends on if Theilen stays and if we extend Dalton .

The Panthers really shouldn't be planning to bring back Dalton for a starting salary. It would 100% be a desparation move by the front office. He's only good for 3-5 games at a time. Same with Theilen. He shouldn't factor in the Panthers' plans going forward. If anything, do him a solid and trade him in the off season - if he's still on contract. 

[strato]

3 minutes ago, kungfoodude said:

If at some point during the draft a QB becomes BPA, by all means, get them. I just don't want us to keep floundering on these failed QB projects because this team is still awful and can't help them develop. Also....we HAVE to improve our QB evaluation process. Since Tepper took over:

Bryce Young

Matt Corral

Will Grier

I mean....wow.

We have different people in place to do that now, but people don't seem to recognize that. I don't much care where they come from but this taking the third best QB top five in the draft over valuation because of the position, yeah we don't need to participate in that. 

I build up an imaginary scenario where we can trade out of that position not too far back and get the defensive stud we want while having ammo to trade back into the late 1st if a QB falls. That we want. 

 

[kungfoodude]

5 minutes ago, strato said:

We have different people in place to do that now, but people don't seem to recognize that. I don't much care where they come from but this taking the third best QB top five in the draft over valuation because of the position, yeah we don't need to participate in that. 

I build up an imaginary scenario where we can trade out of that position not too far back and get the defensive stud we want while having ammo to trade back into the late 1st if a QB falls. That we want. 

 

Yeah, I am not 100% against trading down but it needs to be at the right price. Also, because this appears to be a draft lacking in a lot of elite prospects, trading down could potentially backfire(as it always can, I suppose) or net a lower yield than typical.

I just don't want to be fumbling around and reaching, which in the Tepper era has been a CONSTANT problem. The organizational impatience(and incompetence) been murderous.

 

[strato]

1 minute ago, kungfoodude said:

Yeah, I am not 100% against trading down but it needs to be at the right price. Also, because this appears to be a draft lacking in a lot of elite prospects, trading down could potentially backfire(as it always can, I suppose) or net a lower yield than typical.

I just don't want to be fumbling around and reaching, which in the Tepper era has been a CONSTANT problem. The organizational impatience(and incompetence) been murderous.

 

I guess bottom line is we need to give Canales a shot at His QB. However they find it. 

Ideally we would sign an undervalued vet that Canales knows what he is getting, and start looking hard for one we can grab at good value and groom.

And for me it is okay to burn a pick on a miss just don't cripple your future. Hitting on your other picks should allow for a long shot every so often. 

[kungfoodude]

10 minutes ago, Navy_football said:

The Panthers really shouldn't be planning to bring back Dalton for a starting salary. It would 100% be a desparation move by the front office. He's only good for 3-5 games at a time. Same with Theilen. He shouldn't factor in the Panthers' plans going forward. If anything, do him a solid and trade him in the off season - if he's still on contract. 

I mean, someone has to start. If we are rolling out Brycd for 17 games in 2025, I suppose that means we will get to watch the rebuilding process all over again.

You can try and get another veteran QB in free agency but they will also have a salary attached. 

If you want to take a gamble on another young and bust QB, that's fine but that also likely leads to more rebuilding after the 2025 season. Those guys so rarely pan out.

So what is left? Draft a QB? Sure, maybe. But this isn't an impressive QB draft on paper and they are going to be walking into a challenging situation.

Dalton as starter in 2025 isn't waving the white flag, IMO. It's just acknowledging that we have to start attempting to build a franchise. 

That said, I would never be giving out $20+ mil contracts for older QB's(Flacco, Dalton, etc). That ship has sailed. 

[kungfoodude]

1 minute ago, strato said:

I guess bottom line is we need to give Canales a shot at His QB. However they find it. 

Ideally we would sign an undervalued vet that Canales knows what he is getting, and start looking hard for one we can grab at good value and groom.

And for me it is okay to burn a pick on a miss just don't cripple your future. Hitting on your other picks should allow for a long shot every so often. 

Gambling in the first three rounds just makes the building effort longer. So you have to weigh that into the equation. Ultimately, you want to get to a situation where those picks net you at least one starter/starting caliber player and two very good rotational players(at LEAST) almost every year. That can get us back on track.

So if you are having to just take a raw gamble in those rounds, versus a guy that can help you win games....I don't think we are in a good spot to be able to afford to do that. Definitely not year after year.

[strato]

I mean, Flacco is more 'over' than Dalton seems to me I just wouldn't mess with him. 

And if Bryce is the starter in 2025, well....  let's just say that at that point I wouldn't care what they thought about QBs. 

 

edit: as far as setting things back... well that's been done already. Nothing is fixed there, and you are back to square one.

If you do it right the time is minimal and well spent. 

Edited 1 hour ago by strato

[Navy_football]

1 minute ago, kungfoodude said:

I mean, someone has to start. If we are rolling out Brycd for 17 games in 2025, I suppose that means we will get to watch the rebuilding process all over again.

You can try and get another veteran QB in free agency but they will also have a salary attached. 

If you want to take a gamble on another young and bust QB, that's fine but that also likely leads to more rebuilding after the 2025 season. Those guys so rarely pan out.

So what is left? Draft a QB? Sure, maybe. But this isn't an impressive QB draft on paper and they are going to be walking into a challenging situation.

Dalton as starter in 2025 isn't waving the white flag, IMO. It's just acknowledging that we have to start attempting to build a franchise. 

That said, I would never be giving out $20+ mil contracts for older QB's(Flacco, Dalton, etc). That ship has sailed. 

I don't think they'll take a 1st round QB. So any drafted player would be a later round project. I think bringing Dalton back for $5M-ish again would be fine. But he was brought in to be a backup on that contract. I don't believe they could convince him to come back at backup salary again. And he just isn't worth $10M+ at this stage in his career. We were already starting to see him break down after starting 3 games. 

[ChibCU]

15 hours ago, CamWhoaaCam said:

That's cool but just know we aren't winning anything until we solve the elephant in the room.

 

Franchise QB

 

We've won three games this year. Or are you referring to the Super Bowl? The one where only 1 of the 32 teams wins each year? You're the "fan" who will be perpetually unhappy until the Panthers make it over the Super Bowl hump.

[CamWhoaaCam]

Just now, ChibCU said:

We've won three games this year. Or are you referring to the Super Bowl? The one where only 1 of the 32 teams wins each year? You're the "fan" who will be perpetually unhappy until the Panthers make it over the Super Bowl hump.

The sad part is you're proud of this.

 

Tepper has changed the standard. Losing every year is fine as long as we win a few games. Pathetic!

[kungfoodude]

3 minutes ago, Navy_football said:

I don't think they'll take a 1st round QB. So any drafted player would be a later round project. I think bringing Dalton back for $5M-ish again would be fine. But he was brought in to be a backup on that contract. I don't believe they could convince him to come back at backup salary again. And he just isn't worth $10M+ at this stage in his career. We were already starting to see him break down after starting 3 games. 

I wouldn't particularly care if he was on a fairly incentive laden $8-10ish mil contract. Short term, certainly. That's about what a veteran guy like him would net on the open market, I suspect. 

I am not ready to say he was "breaking down." He generally was playing well as an individual, but our team was definitely not. I would like to see him with this momentum being built and the changing of WR roles.

TBH, whether it is Dalton or Bryce for the rest of the season, we need to be establishing ourselves as a ground and pound football team. Especially if Brooks turns out to be even a slightly above average RB.

[ChibCU]

5 minutes ago, CamWhoaaCam said:

The sad part is you're proud of this.

 

Tepper has changed the standard. Losing every year is fine as long as we win a few games. Pathetic!

How do you deduce that I'm "proud" of it?

I'm just a guy that watches a group of people throw and run around with a ball. They aren't my children. Why would I be proud of it anyway. Maybe you should get a more grounded perspective that is better for your mental health?