Canales still not sold on Bryce?

[mrcompletely11]

14 minutes ago, CRA said:

you don't get to play the 27th and 29th worst run Ds most weeks in the NFL. 

this week Bryce will go back to looking like a middle schooler.  KC is 3rd vs the run.   Which means it will be a couple hours of check downs and sacks. 

The Titans had the #1 rushing attack a few years ago and got the #1 seed and then they were promptly smoked in the playoffs.

[Joe Bear]

47 minutes ago, Doc Holiday said:

Look, after your Dan Morgan thread I’m pretty sure you’re 12. Hailing 126 yards as anything other than abysmal is nothing shy of being ridiculous.

Save the insults for someone else. At the very least, get better at them.

Young's best-case scenario is a middling game manager (game managers, if you didn't know, don't put up Mahomes numbers) and when the run game is working well, Young doesn't need to do much to win. I prefer winning to sexy passing numbers in losses, but maybe you feel differently.

[Joe Bear]

40 minutes ago, CRA said:

you don't get to play the 27th and 29th worst run Ds most weeks in the NFL. 

this week Bryce will go back to looking like a middle schooler.  KC is 3rd vs the run.   Which means it will be a couple hours of check downs and sacks. 

Yeah, I'd probably bet on it. My point was if you're moving the ball on the ground, it's retarded to whine about there not being a ton of passing yardage. It's bitching just to bitch. Young will give people plenty of fodder for that on merit; making it up because he didn't throw for 20 yards (when Hubbard ran for 20) is stupid.

[Doc Holiday]

7 minutes ago, Joe Bear said:

Save the insults for someone else. At the very least, get better at them.

Young's best-case scenario is a middling game manager (game managers, if you didn't know, don't put up Mahomes numbers) and when the run game is working well, Young doesn't need to do much to win. I prefer winning to sexy passing numbers in losses, but maybe you feel differently.

I could do better, those that know, know.

You’re just not worth the effort. a crybaby reactionary thread to the Johnson trade and then hounding every poster personally that disagreed with you said everything. You’re just childish, nothing more needs to be said.

Ps. How many yards does Johnson have with the Ravens again? 6 yards through two games?

[CRA]

10 minutes ago, Joe Bear said:

Yeah, I'd probably bet on it. My point was if you're moving the ball on the ground, it's retarded to whine about there not being a ton of passing yardage. It's bitching just to bitch. Young will give people plenty of fodder for that on merit; making it up because he didn't throw for 20 yards (when Hubbard ran for 20) is stupid.

well, it's not like we witnesses some freakshow rushing outing though like we have in our history. 

We had a total of 306 total yards.  You really need to get a lot more from the pass game off a rushing day like that.  

[Icege]

What was the yardage that Bryce was supposed to throw for when the team is up 10-0 at the half thanks to Chuba's 93 rushing yards?

Genuinely curious as to why people think that a team winning on the ground needs to abandon the run.

[CRA]

9 minutes ago, Icege said:

What was the yardage that Bryce was supposed to throw for when the team is up 10-0 at the half thanks to Chuba's 93 rushing yards?

Genuinely curious as to why people think that a team winning on the ground needs to abandon the run.

I don't think they needed to abandon the run.  We essentially have to try to win in spite of our QB.  Who isn't a NFL starting QB.   I don't think this game represents Bryce being good or showing growth.  We played a bad team, minimized him and it worked out.  That's basically our shot at winning games. 

 

[Icege]

3 minutes ago, CRA said:

I don't think they needed to abandon the run.  We essentially have to try to win in spite of our QB.  Who isn't a NFL starting QB.   I don't think this game represents Bryce being good or showing growth.  We played a bad team, minimized him and it worked out

That's one way to look at it, but the common complaint has been that he threw for only 126yds in a win. With that being the case, what was the stat line that people wanted to see from a game where the run was doing work?

Edited Tuesday at 03:48 PM by Icege

[CRA]

1 minute ago, Icege said:

That's one way to look at it, but the common complaint has been that he threw for only 126yds in a win. With that being the case, what was the stat line that people wanted to see from a game where the run was doing work?

well, Bryce not losing games for us and not asked to be a big part of the O.....is how we should be trying to win.  

so it depends what convo you want to have.  How the Panthers should try to win games without a starting caliber QB or do you want to have a Bryce Young convo.  To me, that are different convo and you talk about the game much differently. 

If Bryce/Canales were both average at their jobs.....well, Bryce has a much better stat line in a game like that.  I mean, go look what NFL QBs in the top 5-15 do when the run game is really working well.  You generally end up w/ a strong offensive day.  Which we didn't have. 

[Icege]

6 minutes ago, CRA said:

well, Bryce not losing games for us and not asked to be a big part of the O.....is how we should be trying to win.  

so it depends what convo you want to have.  How the Panthers should try to win games without a starting caliber QB or do you want to have a Bryce Young convo.  To me, that are different convo and you talk about the game much differently. 

If Bryce/Canales were both average at their jobs.....well, Bryce has a much better stat line in a game like that.  I mean, go look what NFL QBs in the top 5-15 do when the run game is really working well.  You generally end up w/ a strong offensive day.  Which we didn't have. 

The convo that I am trying to have is that in a game where the opponent could not stop the run what is the appropriate passing yardage for the QB?

I've seen plenty of folks denigrate the stat line and understand that nothing in this universe will ever get them to be okay with Bryce because of his physical attributes, but I'm not interested in changing minds. I just want to know what the threshold for passing yardage was for a QB who's run game was dominating. If the number is too low then what would make it right?

Otherwise, we are drawing subjective conclusions (ie: winning in spite of Bryce) rather than objective ones.

[frankw]

3 minutes ago, Icege said:

The convo that I am trying to have is that in a game where the opponent could not stop the run what is the appropriate passing yardage for the QB?

I've seen plenty of folks denigrate the stat line and understand that nothing in this universe will ever get them to be okay with Bryce because of his physical attributes, but I'm not interested in changing minds. I just want to know what the threshold for passing yardage was for a QB who's run game was dominating. If the number is too low then what would make it right?

Otherwise, we are drawing subjective conclusions (ie: winning in spite of Bryce) rather than objective ones.

This isn't about one game this is about the entire body of work. His limitations as a passer in a passing league are plainly evident.

Bryce Young barely has more passing yards in 23 games than undrafted Kyle Allen did in 13 games.

You are no more objective on this matter than anyone else. Just as you were with Teddy Bridgewater. You spent most of camp trying to run off anyone critical of Bryce. Give the holier than thou a rest already.

[Navy_football]

I think we're being a little harsh with the judgment towards Bryce right now. He is definitely showing growth. Just wish he could have shown this level of confidence last season. But to be fair, the oline and weapons were horrible for a rookie QB. So from here on out we should be able to see if the real Bryce Young can be an NFL franchise QB. 

Also can't forget he's playing with 3 rookies as his primary targets. The 7th WR taken off the board, a 4th round TE, and an UDFA WR. On paper, that's not a great scenario, particularly for a 2nd year QB. 

Take away a couple of drops and a silly illegal formation, and Bryce would have around 175 yards and 2 TDs Sunday. Here are some other passing numbers against the Giants this season:

Burrows - 208 yds

Hurts - 114 yds

Daniels - 209 yards and 226 yards

Darnold - 208 yards

Watson - 196 yards

Dak - 221 yards

[mrcompletely11]

9 minutes ago, Navy_football said:

I think we're being a little harsh with the judgment towards Bryce right now. He is definitely showing growth. Just wish he could have shown this level of confidence last season. But to be fair, the oline and weapons were horrible for a rookie QB. So from here on out we should be able to see if the real Bryce Young can be an NFL franchise QB. 

Also can't forget he's playing with 3 rookies as his primary targets. The 7th WR taken off the board, a 4th round TE, and an UDFA WR. On paper, that's not a great scenario, particularly for a 2nd year QB. 

Take away a couple of drops and a silly illegal formation, and Bryce would have around 175 yards and 2 TDs Sunday. Here are some other passing numbers against the Giants this season:

Burrows - 208 yds

Hurts - 114 yds

Daniels - 209 yards and 226 yards

Darnold - 208 yards

Watson - 196 yards

Dak - 221 yards

A)again growth is relative to where he was.  He was basically the worst starting qb in the history of the modern nfl last year and through 2 games this season.  Has he improved from that?  Yeah sure but he is still the worst qb in the nfl right now

 

B) for fugs sake please stop playing the what if game.  The ebbs and flows are penalites and dropped passes are part of it, you dont get credit for that.  And if you do you need to factor in the poo throws he gets away with

[ProcessBlue2]

Well he's probably only got one more QB switch before he loses credibility. He's not endorsing Bryce in case Bryce goes out there in the next game or two and has a performance like earlier in the season. 

I think he will ride with Bryce until he has a horrible game and then make his final switch then.