Why so many teams are switching to the 3-4 and what it means for the Panthers

[PantherProfessor]

good read.

the biggest weakness in this theory is a soft defense that allows the team to trail by multiple scores later in the games. running the ball takes time off the clock, but also makes drives to score require more time.

this is why you need a decent QB to close that gap when needed. this is the same reason why in 2003 Jake led the league in 4th quarter comebacks and wins; he had to. the system worked as designed then, and can do so again with even more success if the pieces fit.

[Kurb]

Fiz is so cute when he uses his powers for good.

[DaCityKats]

nice read asshole lmao.

[mmmbeans]

i only clicked it once.

[Khyber53]

Very well written and you make some good points.

The spread offense is often derided by pro coaches publicly, but they are adopting it quite a bit. And Fiz is exactly right, they've felt they had to to make the most of both the rule changes and the college product they end up working with.

Also remember that those over the middle passes our 4-3 encourages aren't just chances at interceptions (most of which we make near the sidelines, strangely enough) but they are also slower plays to develop giving our D-line more time to develop penetration. The plays often also require that a TE or RB move in to clear out the middle of the field to make some space for the bigger play, removing one more potential blocker on the offensive side.

And as a note on our offensive success against the 3-4s... we've been greatly helped by having monstrous tackles, blocking tight ends, one of the best blocking fullbacks and running backs who will do more than chip a linebacker.

[Snake]

This is def the most epic post of the off-season.

[Jangler]

I'm not going to lie Fiz I usually hate you, but this is a great post

Nice write up.

And proof if you employ an old dog long enough, eventually he'll come back in style.

nice writeup

Nice write up Fiz.

ahhhh now thats the old Fiz I know and love

Nice post, Fiz. First worthwhile read I've had on here in a LONG time.

I was beginning to wonder what happened to Fiz.

good read.

Fiz is so cute when he uses his powers for good.

nice read asshole lmao.

Very well written and you make some good points.

The spread offense is often derided by pro coaches publicly, but they are adopting it quite a bit. And Fiz is exactly right, they've felt they had to to make the most of both the rule changes and the college product they end up working with.

This is def the most epic post of the off-season.

You have all been set up, I hope you brought the lube, cuz you know Fiz won't.

[thefuzz]

Go down by seven or even ten and see how well we do against a 3-4 D.

Running the ball and playing prevent D is cool, but only when you have the lead. Say what you will, but it's a QB driven league, and you need a really good one to consistently make the dance.

[Snake]

You have all been set up, I hope you brought the lube, cuz you know Fiz won't.

I knew there would be a time to use this.

Oh and if anyone is wondering I have not updated to windows 7 yet. :biggrin:

[scpanther22]

Geno Atkins is the perfect example of this...

He will fall because he has no place in a 3-4..I hope the panther pick him up.

[panthers55]

The spread offense is run by a number of teams and has been for years long before Urban Meyer was at Florida. He may be one of the latest to run it and gets lots of exposure because of The Golden Calf of Bristol but he is hardly the originator or even the best innovator of the spread offense. It was originated by Randy Russell in 1927 for his boy's team which is where the term Mighty Mights originated in Texas. In 1952 TCU coaching legend wrote a book entitled The Spread offense is Not New. The father of the modern Spread offense is generally credited to Glenn Ellison and was termed the Run and Shoot. This is the offense run by June Jones when he coached the Atlanta Falcons in the 90s before he went to Hawaii. Even last year I would say that Houston and Texas Tech ran better spread flex schemes than Florida did. They get the exposure in the SEC.

There are several versions of it typically called the Spread- Flex, the Run and Shoot, the Spread Option, the Pistol Offense, etc. Even the Wildcat used by the Panthers in 2006 and now by Miami is a version of the spread offense. Here are some general articles for those that care.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spread_offense

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Offensive_philosophy_(American_football)#The_Spread

http://www.spreadoffense.com/

Why are they so popular? Because they don't require a great quarterback to run them who can read defenses, use quick tempo passing which is easier to complete, and college defenses aren't very good at stopping them.

If the spread offense had anything to do with teams employing a 3-4 look than most college teams would be going to it but they aren't. Why not? Because it is hard to find high school players big or strong enough to play a 3-4 nose tackle position or even a 3-4 DE position. Most colleges run a version of the 4-3 with many going to a 4-4. In fact the limitation on most 3-4 defenses in the NFL is a lack of good 3-4 nose tackles coming out of college even after having 4 more years to bulk up. In addition a 3-4 takes time in college to teach particularly the linebackers and secondary. Plus most 3-4 linebackers in the NFL were actually 4-3 DEs in college. Many teams go to the 3-4 in the NFL because it is easily to scout and to find smaller DEs who will fit in NFL schemes as 3-4 linebackers. The problem with the 4-3 is finding 4-3 DEs. Many DEs in college aren't talented enough to play DE in a 4-3 at the pro level.

The concept of DEs coming around the edge and DTs shooting the gap has been around for decades and isn't a result of the spread offense. Any pass defense relies on pressuring the quarterback. In fact pressuring the quarterback by blitzing for example isn't a primary weapon to neutralize the spread offense since the spread offense rolls out, throws screens and short timing routes which are primary tools to beat the blitz. And remember that blitzing is a primary tool of the 3-4. Plus DTs shooting the gaps is a function of a 4-3 not a 3-4. The concept of college defensive coordinators using faster smaller linemen is because they are more available and the increase in passing in general not any particular scheme. It is interesting that this trend has increased at colleges as well as the pros despite the rules in college not favoring the offense as much as it does in the NFL.

There is no doubt that increased emphais on passing in the pros has been a function of new rule changes favoring the offense although I doubt that Polian should be given undue credit since a majority of the owners have to agree with any rule change. If they believed the rules favored one team over another they could easily defeat it needing only 6 votes to defeat it if I remember correctly. I think they all agree that scoring points increased TV revenue and makes it more exciting and that is why the offensive changes have occurred. Safety concerns are most often cited by the league for quarterback protection issues and rightly so.

Are pro teams going to a 3-4 to take advantage of the talent coming out of college. Yes, but not because of the spread offense. It is as I noted above, there are tons of DEs in college that can be converted to OLBs in a 3-4. 4-3 DEs are much harder to find and develop. Increases in speed and athleticism are halmarks of all college athletes not a trend to defend a particular scheme in college. In fact I would argue that more colleges are going to a spread offense because more high schools are using it so there are more guys coming to college familiar with it. Plus as noted above, it doesn't take extremely talented athletes to run it.

And the 3-4 isn't new either. The 3-4 was designed by Bud Wilkerson in the 1940s at the University of Oklahoma. Chuck Fairbanks imported it into the NFL. The first team to win the Super bowl with the 3-4 was the Miami Dolphins in 1972. Both teams in Super bowl XV used the 3-4 Philly and Oakland with Oakland coming out on top. (Painful memory for me). By the mid 90s it was waning in importance. It has re-emerged in the last 10 years with now 12 of the 32 teams currently running it exclusively. Other teams like Arizona run a hybrid version and most teams have used it as one time or another.

I will add more after dinner.

[Guest silver82blade]

i don't see how you figure it's easier to run on a 3-4 than a 4-3. logically it should make sense, but aren't some of the best run defenses a 3-4 with huge nose tackles?

[Proudiddy]

good post fiz

[pstall]

There is an offense that often gets overlooked that quietly, except for smart coaches, that has influenced the "spread" and Wildcat moreso than many others.