Dave Canales is one and done.... part 2.

[TarHeel69]

Only read the title.  Not a smart move.  Give Canales three years.  Draft his own players.  Pick is own DC (Saleh) and build the whole roster with his own vision.  I'm not sold he is a bad coach.  We, as fans, need patience. 

[frankw]

The biggest thing that bothers me with Canales is he is regularly getting outcoached and we specifically hired him for his offensive prowess. On the flip side while he is being outcoached on his side of the ball there is lack of accountability on the defensive side of the ball and it isn't getting resolved because Canales is hands off. Evero at this point seems to be begging for the Panthers to fire him. On the whole I don't think Canales is a very good head coach. The very good young head coaches have their teams prepared in all phases. Canales barely has the one phase that is supposed to be his bread and better prepared on gamedays let alone the rest. All the positive vibes and throwing rays of sunshine have worn off. The new car smell is gone. I cannot at this point say he is a clear upgrade over Matt Rhule. And I do not like acknowledging that.

But as for right now it would be best to see what transpires in 2025 and if things aren't improving then Canales and Morgan are fired together. The last thing we should want to do is hire yet another head coach and force a GM on them who might end up getting canned anyways.

But regardless. The honeymoon is over and the gloves are off now.

[methodtoll]

28 minutes ago, Sean Payton's Vicodin said:

yea he sucks. canales fanboys of 2024 = bryce fanboys of 2023. just blind faith for no reason

Spoken like a true Browns fan there

[App Panther]

8 minutes ago, electro's horse said:

So? Has Mike tomlin ever had a high first round pick? Andy Reid? Has sean mcvay ever even had a draft pick?

besides, that looming high first rounder should be earmarked for defense. 

The two coaches you mentioned did not inherit poo shows.

[electro's horse]

5 minutes ago, BIGH2001 said:

Answer the first question. What reputable coach will come here if we fire another one after a single season?

They had plenty of interviews with reputable coaches last cycle after firing reich mid season before deciding on Canales. We’ll never know the workings of those interviews or what the employment structure looked like of course. 

I don’t agree with the implication that 5 coaches in 3 years is manageable but 6 in four is beyond the pale. Are you asking me to name specific coaches?

So hold on to him for an extra season, win 2 games again next year, and then people like you would say we won’t hire anyone reputable if we fire 3 coaches in four years. They’re just numbers that don’t have inherent meaning. 

[electro's horse]

Just now, App Panther said:

The two coaches you mentioned did not inherit poo shows.

The pre Andy Reid chiefs were so bad players were killing themselves in the parking lot. It was the definition of a poo show. 

im more saying that its not written anywhere a coach has to get a high draft pick before he can be evaluated. 

does a high first spent on a defensive end change make Canales coach better?

[electro's horse]

5 minutes ago, BIGH2001 said:

 It was reasonable to think that he could be salvaged with improved weapons. Instead he got worse and his limitations are the same as they were before. How is that Canales’s fault?

Canales whole thing was qbs doing well with him, both in Seattle and Tampa. That was always nonsense, but the sword cuts both ways. Bryce had gotten worse despite an improved line and better receivers….so what changed? 

I suspect Bryce phoned it in this offseason and knows this for him, but we don’t know that yet. But at the end of the day, Canales was hired to fix Bryce. Bryce has gotten worse. Those two dots are not difficult to connect. 

and again, what was wrong with the defense today?

[Gapanthersfan]

Canales is in way over his head with the worst boss in the NFL. The team is lost because he is lost. From the first preseason game to now, I can’t tell you a single aspect that has improved. He might (likely not) be a good x and o kind of guy, but that’s about where it ends.

I still hold firm on my belief that all this dawg talk rings hollow. Boss man is more of a declawed cat person. He’s scared of dawgs. 

[BIGH2001]

6 minutes ago, electro's horse said:

Canales whole thing was qbs doing well with him, both in Seattle and Tampa. That was always nonsense, but the sword cuts both ways. Bryce had gotten worse despite an improved line and better receivers….so what changed? 

I suspect Bryce phoned it in this offseason and knows this for him, but we don’t know that yet. But at the end of the day, Canales was hired to fix Bryce. Bryce has gotten worse. Those two dots are not difficult to connect. 

and again, what was wrong with the defense today?

Bo Nix threw for almost 300 yards and 3 TDs. Denver did whatever they wanted when they threw the ball and if not for a couple of fumbles they probably score 42 points. The defense is historically bad. Thats not his fault this season. 
 

You can’t argue Bryce isn’t an NFL player on one hand and then on the other blame Canales for not “fixing” him. He can’t be fixed, it doesn’t matter who the coach is. 

[chbright]

10 minutes ago, electro's horse said:

Canales whole thing was qbs doing well with him, both in Seattle and Tampa. That was always nonsense, but the sword cuts both ways. Bryce had gotten worse despite an improved line and better receivers….so what changed? 

I suspect Bryce phoned it in this offseason and knows this for him, but we don’t know that yet. But at the end of the day, Canales was hired to fix Bryce. Bryce has gotten worse. Those two dots are not difficult to connect. 

and again, what was wrong with the defense today?

Defense is a bunch of guys off the street practice squad? Don't think it saves Evero or Canales

it all really starts with Morgan and Tepper on the coach/roster anyways. 

the offense did look functional for 2.5 games with an old ass Dalton. 3.5 if we count the seattle game last year. then again, not really needing to teach that old dog any tricks. my 1 pause is that we didn't give Joe Brady enough time and he does look better in Buffalo than his predecessors. that's not to say Canales must get more time.

guess I'm numb to keeping or firing Canales. At this time, I can see it fall either way based on performance and past track records with Tepper.

still likely won't keep people from wanting the job because there are so few of them. so another turnover of the staff wouldn't move the needle IMO on people not wanting to take the HC role. 

 

[electro's horse]

Just now, BIGH2001 said:

Bo Nix threw for almost 300 yards and 3 TDs. Denver did whatever they wanted when they threw the ball and if not for a couple of fumbles they probably score 42 points. The defense is historically bad. Thats not his fault this season. 
 

You can’t argue Bryce isn’t an NFL player on one hand and then on the other blame Canales for not “fixing” him. He can’t be fixed, it doesn’t matter who the coach is. 

The broncos didn’t take the lead until 6:51 in the second quarter. Between the panthers scoring a td on the short field and that, the panthers offense didn’t get a first down. No one is claiming the defense is good, just that today they weren’t the issue. 

I can point out a coach has failed to do something he was hired to do, regardless of whether or not it’s possible. I agree he’s unfixable but no one put a gun to Canales head and made him take this job. 

At this point an argument needs to be made to keep him around, and so far that’s mostly “well the defense is bad too and it’ll look bad to fire another coach and he has t had a high first round draft pick yet.”

either he can coach or he can’t and none of those arguments address that issue. He’s no longer a hotshit nfl coordinator; he’s a miserable disaster coaching one of the worst teams in nfl history. 

[electro's horse]

3 minutes ago, chbright said:

my 1 pause is that we didn't give Joe Brady enough time and he does look better in Buffalo than his predecessors. that's not to say Canales must get more time.

 

 

Brady is actually a very good comparison. 

he was a coordinator at New Orleans, one year playcaller at LSU, and was completely not ready to be an nfl offensive coordinator. He went to Buffalo as a quality control coach (basically telling players to get away from the sideline) and works his way up. 

That’s what Canales needs to do. 

[ForJimmy]

We were a complete cluster when he got here. When he got here we were the worst team in the league who just drafted Young and Mingo in the top of the previous draft. We had no 1st and still have no 2nd and our cap situation wasn’t great. Yeah he was probably offered a HC job a year too early but you have to give him some time. This isn’t a quick fix. This current draft class is showing a little promise, let’s see if they can stack another solid one next draft. 

[electro's horse]

3 minutes ago, ForJimmy said:

We were a complete cluster when he got here. When he got here we were the worst team in the league who just drafted Young and Mingo in the top of the previous draft. We had no 1st and still have no 2nd and our cap situation wasn’t great. Yeah he was probably offered a HC job a year too early but you have to give him some time. This isn’t a quick fix. This current draft class is showing a little promise, let’s see if they can stack another solid one next draft. 

The best looking rookie was waived from the roster and placed on the PS

Edited October 28 by electro's horse