Pssssstttt.... Hey Tepper ..

[SOJA]

5 hours ago, Paa Langfart said:

There is no way Frank Reich wanted a midget qb.

my working theory which fits with the timeline is (I have posted this before):

When Reich took the job the plan was to trade up to 2 for Stroud. This was known in NFL circles that Carolina wanted him. See Allbright even BEFORE the trade up saying we liked stroud. Reich is hired everyone on board. 

Houston for whatever reason balks at Chicago's trade offers and suddenly Tepper thinks he's a big boy and why not just trade up to 1. 

Vegas still has the Panthers as heavy favorites to draft Stroud because again, that was the original plan. The panthers start thinking to themselves.....well now that we can draft Bryce should we? Tepper falls in love because Bryce says all the right things at dinner (he's a good kid with a good work ethic). Tepper steps in and says we have to draft Bryce. 

Fitterer will do anything Tepper wants because he wants to keep being GM, Reich reluctantly agrees because it's not that crazy to think he could work with Bryce. Tepper gets his way thinking he has outsmarted everyone. 

Flash forward to now. 

Also for the record I have wanted Stroud since the Rose Bowl game against Utah the year before his draft

[SOJA]

Here's another theory I have. I don't think Tepper liked Stroud. I think he rubbed him the wrong way probably bc CJ is a confident guy who didn't have the aww jeez shucks attitude. I honestly think if we hadn't taken Bryce Tepper would had them take Richardson. the only proof I have of this is that Sheena reported we told richardson's people to look at housing in Charlotte. Why tell your third prospect that?

[kungfoodude]

1 hour ago, Gapanthersfan said:

Every year the pundits seem to get their jollies over whatever new evaluation tool they cook up. They all seem to have a spin on whatever cognitive dimension they want to evaluate…

problem is football a game of giant gladiators whose sole purpose is to dominate and break the will of their opponent as quickly as possible. 

If you’re selling the farm, hopefully, you choose someone who looks like a football player. 

I’m not convinced that everyone has their own board. It’s all a big echo chamber. They all use the same phrases and buzzwords. It’s all a big collective with detractors being shunned. 

If you read a lot of the "anonymous" scout/exec quotes over the years, you will see that there is often pretty varying opinions on even the 1st round guys. 

I think there is commonly dissent in the ranks of most organizations but how they all handle that varies quite widely.

Here.....all ways are the Queens ways.

[Gapanthersfan]

41 minutes ago, SOJA said:

my working theory which fits with the timeline is (I have posted this before):

When Reich took the job the plan was to trade up to 2 for Stroud. This was known in NFL circles that Carolina wanted him. See Allbright even BEFORE the trade up saying we liked stroud. Reich is hired everyone on board. 

Houston for whatever reason balks at Chicago's trade offers and suddenly Tepper thinks he's a big boy and why not just trade up to 1. 

Vegas still has the Panthers as heavy favorites to draft Stroud because again, that was the original plan. The panthers start thinking to themselves.....well now that we can draft Bryce should we? Tepper falls in love because Bryce says all the right things at dinner (he's a good kid with a good work ethic). Tepper steps in and says we have to draft Bryce. 

Fitterer will do anything Tepper wants because he wants to keep being GM, Reich reluctantly agrees because it's not that crazy to think he could work with Bryce. Tepper gets his way thinking he has outsmarted everyone. 

Flash forward to now. 

Also for the record I have wanted Stroud since the Rose Bowl game against Utah the year before his draft

Frank really wanted this to be his swan song. His chance to come back to where he started. He was probably dreaming up plays for Stroud after Tep promised that he had his pick of his dude. You can’t convince me that Frank came here with the intention of coaching Bryce.

Frank saw that Bryce just didn’t have it after the first few days of camp and it’s a wrap from there. 

[SOJA]

1 hour ago, Gapanthersfan said:

Frank really wanted this to be his swan song. His chance to come back to where he started. He was probably dreaming up plays for Stroud after Tep promised that he had his pick of his dude. You can’t convince me that Frank came here with the intention of coaching Bryce.

Frank saw that Bryce just didn’t have it after the first few days of camp and it’s a wrap from there. 

I agree with this, Frank just looked defeated by week like 6. His heart wasn't in it anymore, it never really was for Bryce. When things went south I think he just kept thinking: I didn't even really want this but I'll stick to the company line because I'm a professional. 

I *really* hope Reich comes out one day and says what happens but he strikes me as someone who has a lot of pride and doesn't want to throw Fitterer under the bus too. 

[AU-panther]

On 10/21/2024 at 12:08 PM, mrcompletely11 said:

so if you believe that, that they truly had him ranked that high, then you have to acknowledge that many people on here are way more knowledgeable about qb scouting then some of these "professionals".  Or maybe just maybe its all a racket of people feeding supposed info for favors and whatnot.  I mean remember the kiper/clausen debacle.

 

And one thing to remember is that these scouts dont see teams big board.  they could be telling the scout whatever they want but their board could be completely different.  I mean if you believe reports numerous teams had bryce completely off their board due to size

So the big time media football draft sources and the Panthers all had Bryce Young high on their draft boards, but every other team knew he was terrible and had him ranked low???? Come on now.  Also, some of these sites actually do a really good job of predicating the top players so although they might not have access to every teams  big board, their list turns to be very accurate.

 

As far as fans knowing better than scouts it happens.  Let's be honest it's not an exact science.  In reality, everyone is wrong more than they are right.  Some of these fans that were so sure about Stroud were the same that were so sure about Fields.   

Were there some scouts that didn't like Young, I'm sure, but here again its not crazy to think he was the top QB on a lot of team's boards.  Fans scout based on stats, measurables, and usually YouTube highlight tape.  Based on that Stroud felt like a no brainer.  Throw in the game against GA and Stroud really looked good.  Unfortunately for us scouts watch all the games.  Young had some really good tape.  The fact teams thought that high of him at that size tells you his tape was really good.

Also, I do agree with you somewhat that sometimes fans are as good as teams at drafting.  Just look at the results, teams aren't great.  I think at times you could throw darts and be about as good.  With that being said I don't think fans are as good as they think they are, it's always easy to be correct in hindsight.

 

 

[ForJimmy]

3 minutes ago, AU-panther said:

So the big time media football draft sources and the Panthers all had Bryce Young high on their draft boards, but every other team knew he was terrible and had him ranked low???? Come on now.  Also, some of these sites actually do a really good job of predicating the top players so although they might not have access to every teams  big board, their list turns to be very accurate.

 

As far as fans knowing better than scouts it happens.  Let's be honest it's not an exact science.  In reality, everyone is wrong more than they are right.  Some of these fans that were so sure about Stroud were the same that were so sure about Fields.   

Were there some scouts that didn't like Young, I'm sure, but here again its not crazy to think he was the top QB on a lot of team's boards.  Fans scout based on stats, measurables, and usually YouTube highlight tape.  Based on that Stroud felt like a no brainer.  Throw in the game against GA and Stroud really looked good.  Unfortunately for us scouts watch all the games.  Young had some really good tape.  The fact teams thought that high of him at that size tells you his tape was really good.

Also, I do agree with you somewhat that sometimes fans are as good as teams at drafting.  Just look at the results, teams aren't great.  I think at times you could throw darts and be about as good.  With that being said I don't think fans are as good as they think they are, it's always easy to be correct in hindsight.

 

 

Young was the top QB on most boards.  Luke said most GMs would draft him one, the Texans HC said they had Bryce and Stroud as 1a and 1b and he wouldn't say who he had ranked higher (which means it wasn't his current QB).  He was constantly ranked QB1 more times than not.  Damn near every other draft was spot on with this (I think the Baker one was a little bit surprising).  Stroud just happened to be a fan favorite that turned out to be a great QB so people want to change the whole narrative.  

[Beast_3000]

On 10/21/2024 at 12:18 PM, CanadianCat said:

I dont get this take.. I get that people here hate Tepper, but BY was the #1 or #2 on everyone's board.. So its not like we stretched to draft him. 

There is also nothing new about a 1st round QB failing. We took who most people said was the best prospect and he wasn't. Nothing new under the sun on that. 

No he wasn’t! Yes Bryce Young was high on tons of boards, but there were a lot of former players and analyst that had major concerns about how he projected at the NFL level.  I’m not ragging on you, but you BY apologist have to stop. Heck 60 % of this board went quiet before the draft because we did not see BY as the better prospect than Stroud. We also knew we had no vote with the front office. 

The one intangible that BY has is intelligence. He’s not tall, he’s not athletic, he doesn’t have a big arm. It’s laughable that this organization saw him as #1 overall. 

 

[SmokinwithWilly]

19 minutes ago, AU-panther said:

 I don't think fans are as good as they think they are, it's always easy to be correct in hindsight.

 

 

Sad part is, with a majority of the major moves since Tepper took over, the fans have been right more than our FO. It's not hindsight. We called it then, and we're pissed now because if we could see it, there's no way a professional shouldn't have. 

[pantherclaw]

On 10/21/2024 at 8:45 AM, thennek said:

Tepper accomplished his goal of making sure the Panthers were no longer mediocre.  It will take years to become mediocre again.  Even outside of the football team/players, he has been terrible.  We cannot forget the Rock Hill disaster.  

Everyone was tired of being mediocre.  

Wonder how long it'll be before we're even competitive again. 

[3838]

This is why we have Young..

Michelle Yepper 

 

Edited 2 hours ago by 3838

[Jon Snow]

27 minutes ago, pantherclaw said:

Everyone was tired of being mediocre.  

Wonder how long it'll be before we're even competitive again. 

Until Tepper stops calling the shots. Nothing changes otherwise. 

[strato]

22 hours ago, Gapanthersfan said:

I could see that being the case. 

Refuses to put a grass field in. Refused to keep the coach they wanted. Drafted a huge failure at QB and made everybody play with him.

Couple of things that aren't positives.

But Bruce just sucks, Tepper or no Tepper.

 

And what was that up there about if they missed on Bryce? Hell no I don't forgive them it was as fuging obvious as anything ever has been football wise.

If I am in charge I am firing whoever thinks it is a good idea, before it can happen. 

[CPF4LIFE]

20 hours ago, Gapanthersfan said:

Frank really wanted this to be his swan song. His chance to come back to where he started. He was probably dreaming up plays for Stroud after Tep promised that he had his pick of his dude. You can’t convince me that Frank came here with the intention of coaching Bryce.

Frank saw that Bryce just didn’t have it after the first few days of camp and it’s a wrap from there. 

I think this was the same for Canales this year. Bryce got to start the the first 2 games to show if truly progressed and he looked significantly worse. He never showed he was better than Dalton in camp.