Chuba Hubbard......

[Mage]

1 hour ago, kungfoodude said:

See, now you are changing your story from "down all game."

This is just your personal bias.

Lol.  You can't even respond to any of the points I've been making.  Nobody is changing any story.  I misspoke.  It happens.   At the end of the day, the Panthers had a good run/pass split when the game was still even.  It was only after the Falcons kept scoring every drive that the Panthers got away from it, and even then, they ran the ball 5 out of their first 6 plays to open the 4th quarter.  

How about actually respond to some of the points made?  And personal bias?  What are you talking about?  Everything I've said has been based on facts.  Teams who give up a lot of points don't run the ball a lot.  Is this something you don't think is true?  If so, then prove it.  Give me some data that shows that teams across the league run at the same rate regardless of the score or the amount of points they allow.  I'll be waiting.

I already gave you a list of the top 10 rushing teams and how 6 of the 10 rank in the top 12 in points allowed, and 3 of the teams not in the top 12 have QBs who run on called drop-back passes.  Care to refute any of that?  

Edited 2 hours ago by Mage

[kungfoodude]

4 minutes ago, Mage said:

Lol.  You can't even respond to any of the points I've been making.  Nobody is changing any story.  I misspoke.  It happens.   At the end of the day, the Panthers had a good run/pass split when the game was still even.  It was only after the Falcons kept scoring every drive that the Panthers got away from it, and even then, they ran the ball 5 out of their first 6 plays to open the 4th quarter.  

How about actually respond to some of the points made?  And personal bias?  What are you talking about?  Everything I've said has been based on facts.  Teams who give up a lot of points don't run the ball a lot.  Is this something you don't think is true?  If so, then prove it.  Give me some data that shows that teams across the league run at the same rate regardless of the score or the amount of points they allow.  I'll be waiting.

I already gave you a list of the top 10 rushing teams and how 6 of the 10 rank in the top 12 in points allowed, and 3 of the teams not in the top 12 have QBs who run on called drop-back passes.  Care to refute any of that?  

You have changed your "facts" multiple times across this thread. To what end, I have no idea.

It's a very simple concept I keep stating that you just keep replying with inaccurate scenarios not related to our game. 

You take advantage of an opponents weakness, especially when....it's already working. 

I can't make it any more simple for you, my man. Feel free to watch our game from Sunday and you will see what I mean.

[Mage]

13 minutes ago, kungfoodude said:

You have changed your "facts" multiple times across this thread. To what end, I have no idea.

It's a very simple concept I keep stating that you just keep replying with inaccurate scenarios not related to our game. 

You take advantage of an opponents weakness, especially when....it's already working. 

I can't make it any more simple for you, my man. Feel free to watch our game from Sunday and you will see what I mean.

Example?  You are just saying stuff without any supporting evidence.  Anyone can do that.  Outside of me mistakenly saying the Falcons had the lead the entire game, what other "facts" have I changed?

Don't bother responding if you are just going to say stuff without anything to back it up, as I have done.

And again... Hubbard had 18 carries.  Why are we acting like that is an miniscule amount?  

And don't talk to me about "simple concepts".  When you can't comprehend that teams who are dead last in points allowed tend to be near the bottom in rush attempts.  Because... of course they are.  It is hard to run the ball a lot without a mobile QB when you are giving up a lot of points.  This is football 101.

But again, feel free to prove me wrong with some data.  

Edited 1 hour ago by Mage

[Mage]

'23 Commanders were last in points allowed.  32nd in rush attempts

'22 Bears were last in points allowed.  2nd in rush attempts, but this is because they had Justin Fields.  They were 32nd in pass attempts

'21 Jets were last in points allowed.  32nd in rush attempts

'20 Lions were last in points allowed.  30th in rush attempts

'19 Dolphins were last in points allowed.  32nd in rush attempts

'18 Raiders were last in points allowed.  23nd in rush attempts

'17 Texans were last in points allowed.  11th in rush attempts

'16 49ers were last in points allowed.  5th in rush attempts, but guess who their QB was?  A mobile guy.  Colin Kaepernick.

'15 Saints were last in points allowed.  20th in rush attempts.

'14 Raiders were last in points allowed.  32nd in rush attempts.

Again, this is common sense stuff.  When you are bottom in the league in points allowed, you tend to not run the ball a lot unless you have a running QB.  Don't talk to me about "simple concepts" when you can't understand why a team who gave up 38 points didn't run the ball more than 24 times.  

The fact of the matter, which I have been consistent about saying throughout this thread, is expecting Hubbard to get 20+ carries a game is a ridiculous expectation when the defense is allowing 33 PPG.  The Panthers are running the ball about as much as any team and coach in their situation would.  And I can continue to go back decades and decades if you need more evidence to support that.  

But again, show me what you have that disapproves what I'm saying.  That teams should run the ball regardless of the score or how their defense is performing.  What data do you have to support that?

Edited 1 hour ago by Mage

[csx]

If you can't stop the opponent running more helps. This is football 101

[kungfoodude]

13 minutes ago, Mage said:

Example?  You are just saying stuff without any supporting evidence.  Anyone can do that.  Outside of me mistakenly saying the Falcons had the lead the entire game, what other "facts" have I changed?

Don't bother responding if you are just going to say stuff without anything to back it up, as I have done.

And again... Hubbard had 18 carries.  Why are we acting like that is an miniscule amount?  

And don't talk to me about "simple concepts".  When you can't comprehend that teams who are dead last in points allowed tend to be near the bottom in rush attempts.  Because... of course they are.  It is hard to run the ball a lot without a mobile QB when you are giving up a lot of points.  This is football 101.

But again, feel free to prove me wrong with some data.  

Now it's about QB mobility. That funny.

Look man, you do you. 

I would encourage you to occasionally tune into our games once in a while. You should be able to see the blantantly obvious.

[Mage]

Last point I'll make - the average team runs the ball about 27 times a game.  So the Panthers only ran the ball 3 times fewer than the average team does, and this was in a game they lost by 18 points.

But yeah, we "abandoned" the run.  

[kungfoodude]

Just now, csx said:

If you can't stop the opponent running more helps. This is football 101

I mean....we have lived through these eras multiple times. How soon we forget.

[Mage]

3 minutes ago, kungfoodude said:

Now it's about QB mobility. That funny.

Look man, you do you. 

I would encourage you to occasionally tune into our games once in a while. You should be able to see the blantantly obvious.

Again, you can't even respond to a single one of my points.  You can try and act smart all you want, but you know you are wrong.

And if you think my post is about QB mobility, then your reading skills are about as strong as your football knowledge.  The point is that if you don't have a mobile QB and you are giving up a lot of points, you will likely be in the bottom of the league in rush attempts.  Again, unless you care to try and prove me wrong on that.  But you know you can't.

Edited 1 hour ago by Mage

[Mage]

6 minutes ago, csx said:

If you can't stop the opponent running more helps. This is football 101

How would running the ball more make our defense better on a per-play basis?  All it would do is shorten the game and give us fewer possessions.  The opposition is still going to score at the same rate.  Maybe we only allow 28 PPG as opposed to 33 PPG, but then we're only scoring 17 PPG.  It is the same thing.

Again, this is why teams who are dead last in points allowed tend to not run the ball.  It is maddening having to explain this to people on a football forum.  

Did running the ball a lot help the 2022 Bears, who went 3-14?  Did it help the 2016 49ers, who went 2-14?  They both ran the ball a lot and still gave up a lot of points.  Why?  Because running the ball more doesn't make your defense better.  It isn't like the Panthers lost the time of possession to the Falcons by a wide margin.  It was like a one minute difference.

 

Edited 1 hour ago by Mage

[kungfoodude]

1 minute ago, Mage said:

Again, you can't even respond to a single one of my points.  You can try and act smart all you want, but you know you are wrong.

You have repsonded to literally every single thing that I have said with either wholly unrelated "facts", scenarios that had zero to do with our game Sunday, blantantly lying about the game itself to support your "facts", etc, etc.

And you want me to go on fact hunts for...what exactly? 

If you have overwhelming data showing that it's a far more winning strategy to pass the the ball as much as possible with a poor defense or to ignore the obvious weaknesses of an opponent, I mean I am all ears.

[Mage]

15 minutes ago, kungfoodude said:

You have repsonded to literally every single thing that I have said with either wholly unrelated "facts", scenarios that had zero to do with our game Sunday, blantantly lying about the game itself to support your "facts", etc, etc.

And you want me to go on fact hunts for...what exactly? 

If you have overwhelming data showing that it's a far more winning strategy to pass the the ball as much as possible with a poor defense or to ignore the obvious weaknesses of an opponent, I mean I am all ears.

“Pass as much as possible”

NFL teams average 32 pass attempts a game. Dalton threw it 38 times, slightly above average but certainly not out of the norm and definitely not “as much as possible,” especially for a team that again gives up a lot of points.

But I am sorry for expecting the thread-starter to have facts to defend their points. 

Edited 1 hour ago by Mage

[ForJimmy]

32 minutes ago, csx said:

If you can't stop the opponent running more helps. This is football 101

Until you get behind.  Opposing teams will love to have a nice lead and us milk the clock for them.  Makes their job easier.  The problem is our offense isn't nearly good enough for shootouts either.  It's just a mess all around.  

[strato]

2 minutes ago, ForJimmy said:

Until you get behind.  Opposing teams will love to have a nice lead and us milk the clock for them.  Makes their job easier.  The problem is our offense isn't nearly good enough for shootouts either.  It's just a mess all around.  

I would temper that with our defense isn't good enough for shootouts either, more than our offense even. 

They are shoot downs, in cold blood. If we score 30 we aren't winning. That's about horrible.

Dalton, the WR lineup he came into, the OL that was together, we could score points. We had no WR depth really, that really fuged us.