What if we got a wide receiver instead of Jonathan Stewart in the 2008 draft

[88 Bronco]

what you guys forget is that we are only going to be able to keep these guys together for so long. did you notice that teams with the best offenses have elite passing games?

[bleys]

it doesn't matter. they're going to draft 2 wide receivers this year and fix the problem, or i'm gonna cry.

get a tissue ready.. this FO hasn't drafted 1 WR that has amounted to anything. suddenly it's going to happen this year?

and if it does happen this year.. why did it take 8 years for them to draft a good receiver? We have lost playoffs games because our only receiver worth a poo has been Smitty.. now he's on the downturn of his career and the FO finally makes something happen?

sorry, but I don't see how this doesn't frustrate the poo out of people... being positive has absolutely nothing to do with ignoring this fact and accepting "the way it is" is a horrible excuse to bury your head in the sand..

positive is really the wrong word anyhow.. that's not even what this discussion is about.. it's simply about a fact that exists.

[AnalyzeThIs#28]

STEWART is a F'ing BEAST!

[bleys]

With John Fox and a run first team.

Stud Running back > Stud Wide Reciever

As long as Fox is running the show, #2 running back is more important than a #2 reciever.

It amazes me that fans dont know how things are ran here.

I'd love to have Desean Jackson too, but with our team and style I would still rather have J-stew.

Plus, Delhomme could handoff better than he could pass.

Stewart was a great pick up.. granted, we could have went with Ray Rice and been just as good as far as value goes. But Stewart is in fact a beast.

however, just because a #2 back is important.... doesn't mean a #2 WR is not important.

you need receivers and backs...

I understand your point. I am kind of trailing off from your point, because it seems to me that Fox believes a #2 has never been important. Before Stewart was even drafted.. for years we've needed one, but apparently Smitty is the only receiver we need on the field..

[pantherclaw]

First of all...there is no point to even play the what if game. The past is the past. Receiver wasn't even a top 2 need. If we hadn't drafted stewart...we would have gone oline.

[faultlessjoint]

I still don't understand why everyone is so critical of our WR's. I would definitely attribute our lack of WR production to QB play, play calling, and overall offensive philosophy, well before I would blame the receivers themselves.

Honestly, I feel there is a good chance DJ could turn out to be a stud, or that Moose is still a legit threat, or that Rosario and Barnidge could be 500+ yard 5+ TD TEs. But I really have no idea due to the aforementioned reasons.

[bleys]

I still don't understand why everyone is so critical of our WR's. I would definitely attribute our lack of WR production to QB play, play calling, and overall offensive philosophy, well before I would blame the receivers themselves.

Honestly, I feel there is a good chance DJ could turn out to be a stud, or that Moose is still a legit threat, or that Rosario and Barnidge could be 500+ yard 5+ TD TEs. But I really have no idea due to the aforementioned reasons.

people, being me, aren't critical of just the past 2 years WR situation. that would be short sighted.. a legitimate #2 WR has been a need for years. Not only that, but in 8 years- you plan ahead and draft/develop a receiver when others leave.

Jake could have been the issue why all our receivers have sucked. but then again, Smitty has been great w him at the helm. So even if you say Jake targets Smitty alone (the stats point out he is targeted no more than any other average #1)..

so then if you say Smitty is just that great.. well, I agree. however, all the WRs we drafted are no longer on NFL teams (or barely making the squads if so)..

therefore, the QB, IMO, would not have been the major problem. (yes, a problem, but not the reason why our WRs can't make NFL teams)

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Barnidge and Rosario could be threats.. however, you are forgetting that our system has been more of a reason they have been held back.

I can see Barnidge having an 800 yard season, but with or without Delhomme, chances are slim due to our system...

Also, anytime we use TE's to fill our #2 WR, we are ignoring/covering up the problem.. not answering it.

(#2 WR does not equal 2nd most in yards, but the #2 WR on the depth chart. we have guys set in place to spread the field. without a #2 WR, that same TE is getting more coverage focused on them, in turn hurting the #1 and TE.. there is a reason NFL teams have legit #2 options)

[panthers55]

people, being me, aren't critical of just the past 2 years WR situation. that would be short sighted.. a legitimate #2 WR has been a need for years. Not only that, but in 8 years- you plan ahead and draft/develop a receiver when others leave.

Jake could have been the issue why all our receivers have sucked. but then again, Smitty has been great w him at the helm. So even if you say Jake targets Smitty alone (the stats point out he is targeted no more than any other average #1)..

so then if you say Smitty is just that great.. well, I agree. however, all the WRs we drafted are no longer on NFL teams (or barely making the squads if so)..

therefore, the QB, IMO, would not have been the major problem. (yes, a problem, but not the reason why our WRs can't make NFL teams)

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Barnidge and Rosario could be threats.. however, you are forgetting that our system has been more of a reason they have been held back.

I can see Barnidge having an 800 yard season, but with or without Delhomme, chances are slim due to our system...

Also, anytime we use TE's to fill our #2 WR, we are ignoring/covering up the problem.. not answering it. (#2 WR =/= 2nd most in yards, but the #2 WR on the depth chart. we have guys set in place to spread the field.)

We have brought in wide receivers and they have all looked bad. Whether it was Robinson, Colbert, Carter, Jarrett, or current guys like Moore and Jackson they have all looked bad. Either we are poor at picking them or poor developing them or both. I think it primarily a scheme problem. When you run on first and second down most of the time you can only pass on third dowm when teams expect it and have the coverage to stop it. We have been too predictable and vanilla in our schemes and packages. I am sure that Desean Jackson wouldn't have flourished in our system like he did in Philly. With Moore at quarterback we looked less anemic so maybe there is hope. Otherwise Davidson will be shown the door if Fox gets the boot.

[bleys]

We have brought in wide receivers and they have all looked bad. Whether it was Robinson, Colbert, Carter, Jarrett, or current guys like Moore and Jackson they have all looked bad. Either we are poor at picking them or poor developing them or both. I think it primarily a scheme problem. When you run on first and second down most of the time you can only pass on third dowm when teams expect it and have the coverage to stop it. We have been too predictable and vanilla in our schemes and packages. I am sure that Desean Jackson wouldn't have flourished in our system like he did in Philly. With Moore at quarterback we looked less anemic so maybe there is hope. Otherwise Davidson will be shown the door if Fox gets the boot.

"we have brought in WR's who were a bust" is a little different than "we brought in good receivers who looked bad."

We brought in Keyshawn, he was a solid #2 with 800+ yards. He was no threat and at the end of his career, however, he still put up solid numbers (wherever they came from)

We brought Moose back in and he was solid with 800+ yards. He was/is at the end of his career, but found those yards somewhere...

The receivers we have drafted have been no good.. I agree with you, we are bad at picking them and developing.. however, I don't think we can point the blame on our run 1st scheme as I just have shown 2 players brought in who put up at least decent to solid numbers.

The players we have drafted could not do that except for '04 when Colbert had 1 good year.

I blame our ability to pick them and develop them. point at one more than the other, doesn't matter to me, but scheme has worked well for Moose coming back and Keyshawn. even though they have not been real threats, they put up numbers somehow.

And if we had Desean Jackson, we would be very well off... JMO though considering he can get separation, run routes fairly well, and catch the ball. If Keyshawn and Moose did it, I cannot fathom how Jackson would not be even better... Matter of fact, we need a Jackson to let Smitty do his thing and take pressure off him...

The idea with all this focus on getting a #2 is for a Desean Jackson to come in.. To get anything less is to go against this whole discussion of a #2, after all, Smitty wants the pressure taken off of him.

[Chabaca2]

Would much rather have Stewart. We could have had Jerry Rice in his prime the last 2 years and it wouldn't have mattered. Delhomme couldn't have gotten anyone the ball on a consistent basis.

agree bro

[bleys]

actually, P55, after re-reading some of your post... I see your point.. however, don't think it helps me with my frustration, lol..

I get what your saying.. we need to change up when we run and pass a little more often. Jackson also wouldn't have been as successful since Phillly passes 90% of the time and we pass 40%(?)

regardless though, that doesn't explain why 2 receivers drafted by other teams/coaches have succeeded in this system(even if it's at the end of their careers) and all our draft picks suck.

[panthers55]

actually, P55, after re-reading some of your post... I see your point.. however, don't think it helps me with my frustration, lol..

I get what your saying.. we need to change up when we run and pass a little more often. Jackson also wouldn't have been as successful since Phillly passes 90% of the time and we pass 40%(?)

regardless though, that doesn't explain why 2 receivers drafted by other teams/coaches have succeeded in this system(even if it's at the end of their careers) and all our draft picks suck.

Actually Moose was drafted by us in 1996- he was a second rounder out of Michigan State. Keyshawn had a decent year but honestly he wasn't that big of a help. In the end we have developed exactly 3 receivers I can think of- Moose, Smith and Jeffers. Everyone else has been not very good.

Run first schemes rarely create many great receivers and almost never 2 on one team. Teams that can pass well usually can develop a running game easier than the other way around. And the best teams are balanced.

My biggest gripe about Davidson has been that he does not do the things he said he was going to when he came here. Like stretch the field and explore mismatches. I know some folks blame Fox for all this but just like Meeks was allowed to run the defense because he did well, Davidson would be able to run the offense if he did it well. Our running game was good but the passing game was not. In fact in the last 3 years our passing game hasn't been better than 19th. Compare that to Philly who has been no lower than 10th during that span and it is clear that we know how to run but not how to pass. And teams that take away our running game beat us.

It will take both good receivers and a good scheme in order for our passing game to excel. Right now outside of Smith we got neither.

[bleys]

Actually Moose was drafted by us in 1996- he was a second rounder out of Michigan State. Keyshawn had a decent year but honestly he wasn't that big of a help. In the end we have developed exactly 3 receivers I can think of- Moose, Smith and Jeffers. Everyone else has been not very good.

Run first schemes rarely create many great receivers and almost never 2 on one team. Teams that can pass well usually can develop a running game easier than the other way around. And the best teams are balanced.

My biggest gripe about Davidson has been that he does not do the things he said he was going to when he came here. Like stretch the field and explore mismatches. I know some folks blame Fox for all this but just like Meeks was allowed to run the defense because he did well, Davidson would be able to run the offense if he did it well. Our running game was good but the passing game was not. In fact in the last 3 years our passing game hasn't been better than 19th. Compare that to Philly who has been no lower than 10th during that span and it is clear that we know how to run but not how to pass. And teams that take away our running game beat us.

It will take both good receivers and a good scheme in order for our passing game to excel. Right now outside of Smith we got neither.

lol, I know Moose was drafted by the Panthers.. I'm referring to Fox and Co's draftees.. Smitty and Moose were not drafted by them, and I'm only referring to the track record that Fox and Co has when people put higher hopes on drafting a solid #2 when it has never happened, nor should they expect it to this year..

and I agree with all of your 2nd paragraph.. the thing is when you lose in the playoffs 2 times due to lack of a passing game and 2 mediocre seasons in between and #2 was a part of that... it's time to make some changes..

if you have options at #1 receivers and Smitty is even on your ass about it, I think it's time to take a chance on someone..

we can create all the reasons in the world why we cannot do something or why we are limited, but champions make poo happen... and for a fan base that hates how conservative Fox is, it's ashame to see them thinking just like him..

[DaveThePanther2008]

What if we drafted Joey Harrington instead of Julius Peppers.

Doesn't really matter now does it. We can't change the past.

We could have had Brandon Jacobs instead of Eric Shelton

We could have had Marcus Colston instead of Jeff King

We could have had Eddie George instead of Tim Biakabatuka

Just think who we could of had had we not traded for Jeff Lewis.

How about we address the future instead of the PAST!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!