Panthers run ONE play on repeat

[LinvilleGorge]

Just now, rayzor said:

Option 3....Reich didn't have a clue what to do, especially with a rookie QB. It wasn't that he wanted to draft a different QB. It's that he wanted a vet.

I think he was in over his head even in Indy and barely managed to hang in because of the established QBs he had to work with. He knew what to do with vet QBs looking for a second chance because that's who he was as a pro. And the (limited) success he had as a player himself transferred on to his players.

He didn't really have to reinvent much in Indy like he was going to have to do here.

He was a likeable guy, but he wasn't enough as a leader as was needed for the cast of coaches and personalities he had here. To pull that off you'd need to be the biggest and strongest personality in the room and he never was.

It was just a bad fit for a weak leader and head coach. I just don't think anyone except that for that cokehead in Indy knew just how weak Reich was.

Possibly. I just have to think that the Panthers were open with him during the interview process about being very interested to making a move on a rookie QB in the draft. Maybe they weren't open about aggressively looking to move up? Maybe Reich thought he'd also be able to get a vet stop gap? I don't know.

I don't think he's as wildly incompetent as Panthers fans want to make him out to be though. I just think everything about last year's organization was a mismatched clusterfug and was destined for disastrous results.

[CRA]

1 hour ago, AU-panther said:

Or he got the QB that he wanted and he was just overrated as a coach because he had a good QB(luck) or a good OC. 

But that would run counter to a lot of basic logic.  Frank Reich largely had an ideal QB he had worked with…and Reich world people were beating that drum loudly during the draft process that CJ Stroud fit what Frank would want/need. 

And reporting also was signaling there was a split in house and Tepper wanted Young. We ended up with Young.  

[rayzor]

37 minutes ago, LinvilleGorge said:

Possibly. I just have to think that the Panthers were open with him during the interview process about being very interested to making a move on a rookie QB in the draft. Maybe they weren't open about aggressively looking to move up? Maybe Reich thought he'd also be able to get a vet stop gap? I don't know.

I don't think he's as wildly incompetent as Panthers fans want to make him out to be though. I just think everything about last year's organization was a mismatched clusterfug and was destined for disastrous results.

He was probably too caught up in the idea of getting the gig that he couldn't say no and felt he could probably deal with it.

Panthers had a plan and needed a HC with pro experience. He needed a job so he could be validated and was willing to step into a situation he didn't know would be too much for him.

Clusterfug is the perfect description of it all, though. It was a disaster that no one could have seen coming much like Siefert. There is no reason to believe it would have gone so epically wrong.

Some might have predicted failure for certain reasons, but no one could have seen this failing so badly. Anyone who says they call it only see failure in everything anyways. Much in the way some people always predict doom in every situation... eventually they will be right, but it's not because of anything in they actually knew.

Reich wasn't what we thought he was. Bryce wasn't what we thought he was. That coaching staff wasn't what we thought it was. Nothing was as good as we hoped.

I think we are far better set up for success this time, but that doesn't matter because  thought we were set up for it last time.

Will it work? Some may think they know. We'll just have to  watch and hope it does.

[LinvilleGorge]

5 minutes ago, rayzor said:

He was probably too caught up in the idea of getting the gig that he couldn't say no and felt he could probably deal with it.

Panthers had a plan and needed a HC with pro experience. He needed a job so he could be validated and was willing to step into a situation he didn't know would be too much for him.

Clusterfug is the perfect description of it all, though. It was a disaster that no one could have seen coming much like Siefert. There is no reason to believe it would have gone so epically wrong.

Some might have predicted failure for certain reasons, but no one could have seen this failing so badly. Anyone who says they call it only see failure in everything anyways. Much in the way some people always predict doom in every situation... eventually they will be right, but it's not because of anything in they actually knew.

Reich wasn't what we thought he was. Bryce wasn't what we thought he was. That coaching staff wasn't what we thought it was. Nothing was as good as we hoped.

I think we are far better set up for success this time, but that doesn't matter because  thought we were set up for it last time.

Will it work? Some may think they know. We'll just have to  watch and hope it does.

I just hope Tepper has more patience with Canales. He has legit NFL experience but he's a first time HC. There also needs to be a realization that if Bryce doesn't look significantly better this year it's time to move on at QB.

[Jon Snow]

I've said this same poo for at least before the season was over. It was FUBAR from the jump. It took me some time before I could believe what I was seeing. It was so bad it looked deliberate. I've never seen it go so wrong for one team for as long as I can remember at least. I'm not sure it could get any worse than it was with that group. 

[strato]

Well, I think Reich would have been a lot better if he got to pick. I have no hard evidence just don’t feel he would have selected Bryce. He is still getting paid and probably wouldn’t say that anyway, publicly, out of courtesy to Bryce. It isn’t his fault. 

I keep thinking Reich was blind sided by Young, his limitations when he arrived, and hampered by this Brown component and here come the too many cooks. 

I expect better mostly because Canales seems fundamentally very sound and he has a lot of experience with Russell Wilson, who is probably my successful Bryce comp where I could see a path. And the WRs that enable deep rainbow jump ball QB. 

And Canales has no illusions about what he has to work with, from the interview, and won't have wait until May to figure it out. Should see a better offensive plan, and better OL execution. That’s a low bar though. What we won’t know is if Canales can put it all together in a way that works. Or somewhat works. 

[Jon Snow]

1 minute ago, strato said:

Well, I think Reich would have been a lot better if he got to pick. I have no hard evidence just don’t feel he would have selected Bryce. He is still getting paid and probably wouldn’t say that anyway, publicly, out of courtesy to Bryce. It isn’t his fault. 

I keep thinking Reich was blind sided by Young, his limitations when he arrived, and hampered by this Brown component and here come the too many cooks. 

I expect better mostly because Canales seems fundamentally very sound and he has a lot of experience with Russell Wilson, who is probably my successful Bryce comp where I could see a path. And the WRs that enable deep rainbow jump ball QB. 

And Canales has no illusions about what he has to work with, from the interview, and won't have wait until May to figure it out. Should see a better offensive plan, and better OL execution. That’s a low bar though. What we won’t know is if Canales can put it all together in a way that works. Or somewhat works. 

They were not blindsided by anything. They knew everything about all of those qb's. To say he was blindsided is just ridiculous. He spent all his time before the draft reviewing tape on all of them. Met in-person with all of them and had them in for workouts. How on earth would he not know what Young could or could not do? No, he knew what he was getting. He just couldn't build an offense around what he had. That is on him.

[Tbe]

2 hours ago, LinvilleGorge said:

I don't think he's as wildly incompetent as Panthers fans want to make him out to be though. I just think everything about last year's organization was a mismatched clusterfug and was destined for disastrous results.

Im not so sure. Read the comments in that video. One or two colts fans chimed and said they saw the same thing with Reich. Said he isn’t head coach material.

That’s not the first time I’ve heard that. Frank seemed to crumble towards the end in Indy and those issues continued here.

[LinvilleGorge]

25 minutes ago, Jon Snow said:

I'm not sure it could get any worse than it was with that group. 

That's kinda what I thought when Rhule got fired but then Tepper was like

I just hope that we've actually found true rock bottom this time and we're ready to trend upwards.

[MHS831]

Here is one explanation of Bryce--He has never been the underdog--aways played with a lead, always had the best team, best OL, and usually, the best WRs.   Since high school.

Now imagine a bully who punches you in the arm every time he walks by you.  At first, you walk by with confidence and it catches you off guard.  Then you start flinching and taking side steps to avoid the hit.  He still hits you.  This happens for an entire year.  Now think of what you would do if you walked by him and he didn't hit you.  You would still dodge, duck, dip, and dodge, and people would look at you like you were an idiot. 

Point: even when Bryce had a clean pocket, he was not confident and he prepared to be hit.  This guy talks about him being out of rhythm etc.  Then he still blames Bryce when he demonstrates that there was no separation and the routes were predictable.  In addition to that,  he mentions that Bryce often had LESS than 2 seconds to throw before getting pressure.  So the Defense knows you have to throw because you are behind--they know what play you are going to run--since they can cover you in man they can rush 7, play man under with cover 1 or 2 support over the top---vs. your 5 OL and a RB who can't block.  Our TEs were not open.  Bozeman decided to suck hard, and we had 9 different players start at both G spots.  Campen sucked, folks--was saying it all year. 

So Bryce flenched on the rare occasion that he was protected for more that 2 seconds.  What does flinching look like?  Feet out of position (Cam had the same issue--the brain tells the feet to run), timing off (second guessing due to previous forced errors) etc.

Bryce needs to go back to feeling confident in the pocket.  I hope he is not traumatized by 2023.  He has to be second guessing his ability--like you are.  Self-fulfilling prophecy. 

[LinvilleGorge]

19 minutes ago, Jon Snow said:

He just couldn't build an offense around what he had. That is on him.

I have deep concern that the answer might be both. Reich did a terrible job of catering to Bryce while Bryce just flat out didn't look like he had starting NFL talent.

[pantherj]

Anyone could clearly see right out of the gate that our offensive play calling was horrendous. Anyone. The fan base was expecting secret plays that we were holing back during preseason to catch the opposition by surprise. That didn't happen. We got old recycled plays from the early 2000's that were embarrassing and didn't even come close to working. Then to make matters worse, we KEPT calling the plays that didn't work and looked awful OVER AND OVER again for weeks. Team after team knew what was coming, and what was coming was idiotic. The quadruple deep hook route was the worst of it because it led to a sack of bad pass 100% of the time. We were not call plays to set up the defense, but rather we were calling plays in a vacuum as though the previous failed plays didn't happen. Didn't matter what the opposing defense was doing, we just kept calling mediocre 00's plays that no one else was running. No one got open. Then, like a blind squirrel finding a nut, a play would work by accident, and Young would throw a turkey to nowhere, or not even notice guys were open. Young was a nightmare. Weak, confused, and rolling out the right to throw a turkey to the sidelines or nowhere. Over and over and over again. Opposing safeties were confusing Young with motion and by baiting him, but the worst part was his noodle arm. Overcranking deep passes to mars that would have been TDs with a better QB was soul stealing to see.

What now? We're just trying to not have a disastrous 24' season. Just hope for improvement from Young, and good play calling. Maybe we can get 4 or 5 wins. Keep your expectations low, and if Young becomes a star you can be thrilled. The odds are low.    

[LinvilleGorge]

Just now, pantherj said:

Anyone could clearly see right out of the gate that our offensive play calling was horrendous. Anyone. The fan base was expecting secret plays that we were holing back during preseason to catch the opposition by surprise. That didn't happen. We got old recycled plays from the early 2000's that were embarrassing and didn't even come close to working. Then to make matters worse, we KEPT calling the plays that didn't work and looked awful OVER AND OVER again for weeks. Team after team knew what was coming, and what was coming was idiotic. The quadruple deep hook route was the worst of it because it led to a sack of bad pass 100% of the time. We were not call plays to set up the defense, but rather we were calling plays in a vacuum as though the previous failed plays didn't happen. Didn't matter what the opposing defense was doing, we just kept calling mediocre 00's plays that no one else was running. No one got open. Then, like a blind squirrel finding a nut, a play would work by accident, and Young would throw a turkey to nowhere, or not even notice guys were open. Young was a nightmare. Weak, confused, and rolling out the right to throw a turkey to the sidelines or nowhere. Over and over and over again. Opposing safeties were confusing Young with motion and by baiting him, but the worst part was his noodle arm. Overcranking deep passes to mars that would have been TDs with a better QB was soul stealing to see.

What now? We're just trying to not have a disastrous 24' season. Just hope for improvement from Young, and good play calling. Maybe we can get 4 or 5 wins. Keep your expectations low, and if Young becomes a star you can be thrilled. The odds are low.    

Pretty much. I'm basically treating Bryce as a rookie again this coming season in that I have no stats expectations, no wins expectations, I'm just looking for him to pass the eye test. Just show me that you have the talent to be a legit NFL QB.

[pantherj]

Just now, LinvilleGorge said:

Pretty much. I'm basically treating Bryce as a rookie again this coming season in that I have no stats expectations, no wins expectations, I'm just looking for him to pass the eye test. Just show me that you have the talent to be a legit NFL QB.

We all know the NFL is set up to make it easy to pass the ball and score TDs. This season is make or break for Young imo. We need to be moving the ball through the air and score passing TDs and having fun. If it feels like a miracle to complete a medium to deep pass, or a passing TD, then your QB is not good. He has this season, and then we need to look for a QB in the 2025 draft if he poops the bed like Amber Heard. This is it.