Canales "I'd like to take the pressure off the quarterback to be a part of what the offense is doing rather than a feature of it"

[CanadianCat]

2 hours ago, BrianS said:

No we didn't.  The separation of our WR's was largely equivalent to some very highly rated receivers like Justin Jefferson, CeeDee Lamb, Jordan Addison, Stefon Diggs and Rashid Shaheed.  One of our problems was that our QB didn't view that separation as "open", when in fact it was "NFL open".

Man I watched every game and The QB School on Youtube and yes, BY left some throws out there, but it was a combo of so many things. Bad pass blocking, WR not getting open, Chark dropping everything and poor play design. 

I think better play calling will clean up a lot of this... and getting Chark some stickem. 

[rayzor]

5 minutes ago, CRA said:

my best guess is Canales is largely just a players coach.  I'd safely say a better present day playcaller than Frank Reich too.  But I don't think he is some offensive guru.   Which probably is what an anomoly like Bryce Young actually needs to have a shot at panning out. 

i kind of don't think he needs to be a offensive guru. he just needs to find something that will work with who we've got. 

we all know that even with bryce not playing like we think he should have, he was in a poo situation with 2 coaches from 2 different schemes trying to create an offense that was dissimilar to anything they had run before and for most of the year having that patchwork offense with no cohesion called by a dinosaur who repeated half of the things he said thinking it made more of an impact. 

plus, who was coaching bryce? how many voices and ideas did he have thrown at him? 

plus, whatever "scheme" we ran wasn't something that made the OLs job easier. i think a lot of what happened with the downturn in the OL last year was due to a badly designed offense (and a poo ton of injuries). also the WRs were crap aside from thielen. 

i know that this looks like a laundry list of excuses, but it's a serious clusterf*ck of a situation for any QB, especially a rookie. it would mess with anyone. 

if we can get those other issues addressed and then have just one voice coaching up bryce (and ever young QB needs coaching up, regardless of where they were drafted), i think we could have something there. 

i don't expect a quick and dramatic turnaround that gets us in the playoffs, but i would expect bryce to play much better than he did last year with just the external things getting corrected. 

[NAS]

2 minutes ago, LinvilleGorge said:

I mean, what's he supposed to say right now though? He knows the organization isn't moving on from this guy one year removed from that trade up and spending #1 overall on him. He knows Bryce isn't gonna carry his offense and he's going to have to try to scheme around his shortcomings. I mean, it is what it is. It seems to me like trying to manage expectations and downplaying the QB position is probably his best bet right now. I'm just hoping that they use this year to determine if they can make it work and if not they suck it up and move on. Not from another coaching staff but from Bryce.

I agree, I don't think he has a choice at this time.  Just saying, the expectations have been reset from a "force multiplier" to a "game manager".  Let's hope he can be as good as Purdy I guess

[LinvilleGorge]

1 minute ago, NAS said:

I agree, I don't think he has a choice at this time.  Just saying, the expectations have been reset from a "force multiplier" to a "game manager".  Let's hope he can be as good as Purdy I guess

Yep. That's just the reality of where we are. We went from talking about having a Drew Brees to just hoping he's salvageable.

[CanadianCat]

2 minutes ago, LinvilleGorge said:

Yep. That's just the reality of where we are. We went from talking about having a Drew Brees to just hoping he's salvageable.

Honestly I think thats so over blown. BY was the best QB in high school and college for a reason. He doesnt forget how to play. He had a bad season and was put into the worst NFL situation available. We cleaned house and now he has a year of experience under his belt. We have a coach that has a track record of 'fixing' QB's and building a system to work with BY's skills. 

I think he will surprise a lot of people this season. 

[Jay Roosevelt]

This is the correct approach. Whether it actually works or not, who knows.

Most successful NFL offenses do operate this way. Even in KC, as great as Mahomes is he's only asked to make the game-changing plays he's known for a handful of times per game. The rest of the time the scheme is designed to take pressure off of him. The same is true of Tua in Miami, Goff in Detroit, Stafford in Los Angeles, Stroud in Houston, etc.

The days of lining up and saying "our guys are better than your guys" and counting on better play and execution alone to win is long gone; at least on offense. This was my biggest issue with Frank Reich's offense; it took that outdated approach and when you have the issues we do on the OL and at WR that's bound to end in disaster.

Canales seems to be the opposite of this. Evidence (Geno Smith and Baker Mayfield's performances under him) appears to suggest it's a successful approach.

We'll see.

[CRA]

11 minutes ago, rayzor said:

i kind of don't think he needs to be a offensive guru. he just needs to find something that will work with who we've got. 

we all know that even with bryce not playing like we think he should have, he was in a poo situation with 2 coaches from 2 different schemes trying to create an offense that was dissimilar to anything they had run before and for most of the year having that patchwork offense with no cohesion called by a dinosaur who repeated half of the things he said thinking it made more of an impact. 

plus, who was coaching bryce? how many voices and ideas did he have thrown at him? 

plus, whatever "scheme" we ran wasn't something that made the OLs job easier. i think a lot of what happened with the downturn in the OL last year was due to a badly designed offense (and a poo ton of injuries). also the WRs were crap aside from thielen. 

i know that this looks like a laundry list of excuses, but it's a serious clusterf*ck of a situation for any QB, especially a rookie. it would mess with anyone. 

if we can get those other issues addressed and then have just one voice coaching up bryce (and ever young QB needs coaching up, regardless of where they were drafted), i think we could have something there. 

i don't expect a quick and dramatic turnaround that gets us in the playoffs, but i would expect bryce to play much better than he did last year with just the external things getting corrected. 

and I'll still argue, Theilen wasn't actually good.  He was a slow savvy vet playing the slot we force feed.....that basically gave you none of the upside you really would be looking for there.   

if you look at yards per catch by actual WRs.....it was checkdown down city overall on the year.   You have to get to like WR # 60+ in terms of yardage on the year to find someone getting less per catch. 

Adam Thielen can't be our #1 focal point in the passing game IMO. 

[LinvilleGorge]

3 minutes ago, CanadianCat said:

Honestly I think thats so over blown. BY was the best QB in high school and college for a reason. He doesnt forget how to play. He had a bad season and was put into the worst NFL situation available. We cleaned house and now he has a year of experience under his belt. We have a coach that has a track record of 'fixing' QB's and building a system to work with BY's skills. 

I think he will surprise a lot of people this season. 

Stop. Hanging the hat on Bryce in HS and college has to stop. This isn't college and it sure as hell isn't HS. Sports history is chock full of guys who were great at one level and failed to translate at the next level. 5 star college recruits bust. 1st round NFL draft picks bust. It happens. It's really damn hard projecting talent to a higher level of competition.

[LinvilleGorge]

2 minutes ago, CRA said:

and I'll still argue, Theilen wasn't actually good.  He was a slow savvy vet playing the slot we force feed.....that basically gave you none of the upside you really would be looking for there.   

if you look at yards per catch by actual WRs.....it was checkdown down city overall on the year.   You have to get to like WR # 60+ in terms of yardage on the year to find someone getting less per catch. 

Adam Thielen can't be our #1 focal point in the passing game IMO. 

I think he was exactly what we hoped he'd be. It's just that everyone else was a lot less than what we hoped they'd be.

[CanadianCat]

2 minutes ago, LinvilleGorge said:

Stop. Hanging the hat on Bryce in HS and college has to stop. This isn't college and it sure as hell isn't HS. Sports history is chock full of guys who were great at one level and failed to translate at the next level. 5 star college recruits bust. 1st round NFL draft picks bust. It happens. It's really damn hard projecting talent to a higher level of competition.

Im willing to stick with my theory for 1 more season. 

[CRA]

15 minutes ago, CanadianCat said:

Honestly I think thats so over blown. BY was the best QB in high school and college for a reason. He doesnt forget how to play. He had a bad season and was put into the worst NFL situation available. We cleaned house and now he has a year of experience under his belt. We have a coach that has a track record of 'fixing' QB's and building a system to work with BY's skills. 

I think he will surprise a lot of people this season. 

I don't believe Bryce Young was the best QB in college.  I think he played for the best team/roster/coach in college.  Which can lead to great or even the best statistical season. 

no coach is going to change the fact he is a physical anomaly at the position in the NFL.  

 

 

[ForJimmy]

Just now, CRA said:

I don't believe Bryce Young was the best QB in college.  I think he played for the best team/roster/coach in college.

no coach is going to change the fact he is a physical anomaly at the position in the NFL.  

 

 

Who do you think was the best QB in college? 

[CRA]

10 minutes ago, ForJimmy said:

Who do you think was the best QB in college? 

well, I can't recall a single season in recent history where I viewed an Alabama QB as the best actual QB in college football.   They have all been set up for stats and production as a by-product of having the best roster in football generally year over year. 

I'm not sure I have a concrete answer for who I think was the best on the spot.  I'd have to think about it.   There are tons of guys and it wouldn't just be who was leaving for the NFL.    

going into the draft, I was always clear that IMO Bryce Young had the lowest ceiling of any of the top 4 QBs that were talked about.  He didn't have the skill set IMO to excel in the NFL.  I thought his floor might of been higher.  Which might still be true in a good situation vs some of them. 

[CRA]

22 minutes ago, ForJimmy said:

Who do you think was the best QB in college? 

well, upon reflection I'd probably give him the nod in 2021 if I am being fair.  I wouldn't in 2022.  His last season is largely what was sticking in my head. 

but that's probably the only season in recent history where I would ever give the nod to a Bama QB.