15 year season ticket holder... I won't be renewing

[RayRedd]

6 hours ago, IndyPanther said:

10 hours ago, RayRedd said:

That's part of the "revenues" he mentioned. 

I already included that in the $30 million. Green Bay is publicly owned, so has to share their profits. In 2022, they made $35 million. Because of revenue sharing, every team should make a very similar amount. So the Panthers should have made roughly the same or slightly less after revenue sharing.

Remains chump change for Tepper...

[RayRedd]

2 hours ago, Seltzer said:

This is now a hemorrhaging of legit fans (i.e. PSL owners, etc.) who were the backbone of this fanbase both in terms of fan support but also financial support.

The number of listings (or lack thereof) on the PSL marketplace in no way supports your assertion.

PSL for-sale listings are down about 40% vs. this time last year, and are at the absolute lows in the last 30 months.

1,150 seats for sale in a 75,000 seat stadium in not even a blip on the radar -- just another reason Tepper will never move the team, PSL holders never bail!!

 

 

 

[SmokinwithWilly]

4 minutes ago, RayRedd said:

The number of listings (or lack thereof) on the PSL marketplace in no way supports your assertion.

PSL for-sale listings are down about 40% vs. this time last year, and are at the absolute lows in the last 30 months.

1,150 seats for sale in a 75,000 seat stadium in not even a blip on the radar -- just another reason Tepper will never move the team, PSL holders never bail!!

 

 

 

It's debatable how many PSL holders are legit fans. Many corporations buy PSLs or season tickets to a sports team because they're great for write offs and also good to hand out to potential or current clients. 

[RayRedd]

3 minutes ago, SmokinwithWilly said:

It's debatable how many PSL holders are legit fans. Many corporations buy PSLs or season tickets to a sports team because they're great for write offs and also good to hand out to potential or current clients. 

From a business operations perspective the delineation between "legit fans" and any other kind of "fan" is irrelevant -- cash is cash.

Bottom line, 98% of the seats controlled by PSL holders remain current and paid up. 

[SmokinwithWilly]

5 minutes ago, RayRedd said:

From a business operations perspective the delineation between "legit fans" and any other kind of "fan" is irrelevant -- cash is cash.

Bottom line, 98% of the seats controlled by PSL holders remain current and paid up. 

There is a huge difference between having a customer and a loyal customer. Loyal customers value your product and are willing to pay more than the average person to consume that product. Finding and keeping your repeat business is crucial. As a business owner, a 1 time customer is nice but that's not the customer I'm after. I want the repeat customer who's going to buy not only one product, but multiple products, year after year. 

[raleigh-panther]

10 minutes ago, RayRedd said:

From a business operations perspective the delineation between "legit fans" and any other kind of "fan" is irrelevant -- cash is cash.

Bottom line, 98% of the seats controlled by PSL holders remain current and paid up. 

It is True a  large % are owned by PSL owners     That, of course, was JR’s methodology still in place. 

The other numbers you quoted, I doubt seriously that it includes the PSLs turned in before they expire as they go back to the team …the team will then try and move them to brokers   There is really no way to know what is what unless you data mine every website where they are sold 

If they do not fix this current situation of having no hope of even scoring a TD thus meaning PSL owners can’t sell those tickets for close to face value, many things will change. 

[RayRedd]

8 minutes ago, SmokinwithWilly said:

There is a huge difference between having a customer and a loyal customer.

Loyal customers value your product and are willing to pay more than the average person to consume that product.

Finding and keeping your repeat business is crucial.

As a business owner, a 1 time customer is nice but that's not the customer I'm after. 

You are 100% correct .

The "customer" you are describing is a prototypical PSL- owner.  

The original poster is an exception, in fact the opposite of the rule. 

PSL owners are literally THE most "loyal customer" in the history of customers!!

Don't mistake the whining of a few as a trend that's going broadly change the course of behavior for Panthers ticket holders/buyers.

[RayRedd]

13 minutes ago, raleigh-panther said:

If they do not fix this current situation of having no hope of even scoring a TD thus meaning PSL owners can’t sell those tickets for close to face value, many things will change. 

 

There has never been a major dislocation within the PSL ownership base.

Are you predicting tens-of-thousands of PSL owners will walk away from their tickets with no compensation whatsoever in the near-term?

Let us know when things change...

 

 

[SmokinwithWilly]

9 minutes ago, RayRedd said:

You are 100% correct .

The "customer" you are describing is a prototypical PSL- owner.  

The original poster is an exception, in fact the opposite of the rule. 

PSL owners are literally THE most "loyal customer" in the history of customers!!

Don't mistake the whining of a few as a trend that's going broadly change the course of behavior for Panthers ticket holders/buyers.

I think the ones he's referring to are those that buy PSLs as fans and just write the check regardless of what the product has been. Now it's to the point that it's getting really hard to write that check when this is the product being put on the field. No money wasted on merchandise or being spent on overpriced stale beer and gas station food at the stadium. The fan that had that money to spend is now finding other places to use it that provide a better return on investment. There's probably not a huge % of them left, but they're leaving to be replaced by the corporate PSL who really doesn't care what the end product is as long as they can write it off on their taxes and maybe get a playoff game once in a while. 

[RayRedd]

22 minutes ago, SmokinwithWilly said:

I think the ones he's referring to are those that buy PSLs as fans and just write the check regardless of what the product has been. Now it's to the point that it's getting really hard to write that check when this is the product being put on the field. No money wasted on merchandise or being spent on overpriced stale beer and gas station food at the stadium. The fan that had that money to spend is now finding other places to use it that provide a better return on investment. There's probably not a huge % of them left, but they're leaving to be replaced by the corporate PSL who really doesn't care what the end product is as long as they can write it off on their taxes and maybe get a playoff game once in a while. 

LOL...disagree.

OP is the exception, not the rule.  

"Stale beer and gas station food"...really?

Don't let your personal animus  stand in the way of logical analysis of the business environment/opportunities for the Panthers -- the team is doing just fine and any expectations for that changing any time soon are misplaced .

[SeizeTheDave]

26 minutes ago, SmokinwithWilly said:

I think the ones he's referring to are those that buy PSLs as fans and just write the check regardless of what the product has been. Now it's to the point that it's getting really hard to write that check when this is the product being put on the field. No money wasted on merchandise or being spent on overpriced stale beer and gas station food at the stadium. The fan that had that money to spend is now finding other places to use it that provide a better return on investment. There's probably not a huge % of them left, but they're leaving to be replaced by the corporate PSL who really doesn't care what the end product is as long as they can write it off on their taxes and maybe get a playoff game once in a while. 

This, 100%, is where I am. It’s just not worth the money or time anymore.

[beo]

Oh damn, good to see that SizzleBuzz is still alive and well! Was wondering where that guy went. 

[raleigh-panther]

58 minutes ago, RayRedd said:

 

There has never been a major dislocation within the PSL ownership base.

Are you predicting tens-of-thousands of PSL owners will walk away from their tickets with no compensation whatsoever in the near-term?

Let us know when things change.

…wow…not sure who you are but a bit on the  smug side in response aren't you ?  I  didn’t predict anything   

you might be surprised how disengaged PSL holders  are from David Tepper, how much they dislike him (and further, his grand plans for the future stadium renovations (ie, gauging the interest of PSL holders like myself for very expensive options via a survey I received today) .

Just in case you are a buddy of the Panthers org, you can tell him he best fix that product on the field if he expects anyone to cough up that kind of money for  a team that can’t score a TD and the worst record of any sports franchise over 5 years

so trust me, there is a lot of extreme unhappiness right now, more than enough to make people walk away  and we are ‘loyal’  when the ticket values hold their face value.  Now,   we can’t even give them away. 

i have the ticket office calling me all the time about buying PSLs in my row from others who have gotten out.   I’m not calling them. Those were not advertised So, if you are under the Illusion  this is some hot commodity with blind loyalty,  it isn’t 

On PSL availability,  my point is simply it is very difficult to tell how many PSLs are available at any point in time given   the variables (term limit, method of sale, or  transfer,  or turn in or the motives.  All you know is xx number are designated for PSLs and they will show in varying states.

I’ve owned mine for 24 years.  I will be turning them in a year early.  I don’t need the situation made worse  with gas, food, lodging and worst of all, wasting  of my time.
 

[SmokinwithWilly]

1 hour ago, RayRedd said:

LOL...disagree.

OP is the exception, not the rule.  

"Stale beer and gas station food"...really?

Don't let your personal animus  stand in the way of logical analysis of the business environment/opportunities for the Panthers -- the team is doing just fine and any expectations for that changing any time soon are misplaced .

Yes. The food and beer is mediocre at best compared to other sports venues. If the Panthers didn't get a share of the profits, Tepper would be in a hot mess and he would be in the red. Who is his marketing department targeting? Who is beating down the doors to license the worst franchise across all sports for the last 5 years? Panthers gear is on the clearance rack in thrift shops because no one wants it. This franchise is a joke. The Panthers have zero marketability right now except for maybe pepto.

When watching the Panthers gives you nausea, heartburn, idegestion, upset stomach, diarrhea.