Bills run game (and why we're absolutely awful schematically)

[toldozer]

9 hours ago, lightsout said:

Watching this Bills offense work, and man it is night and day. Forgetting the talent they have at RB, and across the board really, they do some very simple but effective things up front.

There isn't a question of who has who. They're running iso, fb lead ups, and some power. They're running the exact offense we need to be running but with good blocking and guys executing at a high level.

 

When I think about our own run game, it's almost entirely zone. Nothing wrong with zone...except when there is. You see, a lot of zone blocking depends on communication amongst the line. Each man needs to know what their responsibilities are, but then also what the man to either side of them will be doing so they know how to scale. A guard expecting a chip from his tackle will take a softer bucket step so he gets a bit more drive, depending on the chip to help get his hips around. When the tackle thinks he's free running second level instead....you get runs blown up at the line. 

Our best runs this season have been off of an iso and, iirc, a trap. Designed to be simple, you have a specific man you must block in a specific way. No guess work, just know the damn play and execute.

We have linemen we can't trust to get their assignments sorted out for inside zone and stretch work. Ron was awful at a lot, but his offenses always had basic concepts reigning supreme. Iso, power, blast/belly, trap. Our run game misses this, and the reason we do it is to set up the rpo....which we don't run really. Bryce hasn't had a single rpo called that I can remember. So we're giving a zone look in the run game to mask our rpo later and doing fuging nothing with either.

Just a fun aside while you're watching two functional offenses.

You realize we're very limited on what we can run out of shotgun right?  

[Waldo]

18 minutes ago, toldozer said:

You realize we're very limited on what we can run out of shotgun right?  

Their answer was to run RPOs. I eagerly await those results. /s

No over the top ability and shotgun & pistol only equals a really hard time run successfully, even if the oline wasn't having a huge regression.

[Mr. Scot]

We don't have the right kind of linemen to run a zone scheme, especially on the left, but we're trying to do it anyway.

[lightsout]

1 hour ago, toldozer said:

You realize we're very limited on what we can run out of shotgun right?  

 

I get the snarkiness here and love it but it makes me mad because you can run folds, you can run iso and power, you can run everything except tosses with the same timing and momentum as you can from under center and yet we keep doing stupid poo lol

[TheBigKat]

The Bills window effectively closed when they took Dalton Kincaid over CMC

 

Kincaid is a great pick but CMC would have gotten them over the hump

[NorthTryon]

3 hours ago, Mr. Scot said:

We don't have the right kind of linemen to run a zone scheme, especially on the left, but we're trying to do it anyway.

I wonder why this hasn't been brought up more. We drafted/signed a bunch of road graders and want them to be dancing bears in a zone scheme. I guarantee with Ickey bearing down run play after run play, these linebacker sized DEs wouldn't just run around him on passing downs. I can guarantee cause we saw it last year. 

Why don't you think they are running close to the same scheme? I mean it worked with PJ at QB and he's almost exact same height as Bryce. I just don't get it. 

[Mr. Scot]

1 minute ago, NorthTryon said:

I wonder why this hasn't been brought up more. We drafted/signed a bunch of road graders and want them to be dancing bears in a zone scheme. I guarantee with Ickey bearing down run play after run play, these linebacker sized DEs wouldn't just run around him on passing downs. I can guarantee cause we saw it last year. 

Why don't you think they are running close to the same scheme? I mean it worked with PJ at QB and he's almost exact same height as Bryce. I just don't get it. 

It's been brought up by several analysts and someone (Sheena Quick I think) asked a question about it in Reich's most recent press conference. His response was that they had no intention of going "smashmouth".

Whether it's come up internally or not though, no idea.

I do know that Diana Russini said Panthers brass are trying to get Reich to run something closer to Young's college offense (more RPOs and such).

[lightsout]

Pro-I still works as a base offense. I know it isn't as flashy as the spread everybody went to, but with edge players trending smaller and faster, you'd have a field day smashing them in the face with power.

RPO is a neat gimmick...that generates as many illegal man down field penalties as it does big gains.

[Daeavorn]

We will need multiple drafts to get the personnel to run a spread offense. Good lord if that is the plan we are so boned.

[Mr. Scot]

2 minutes ago, Daeavorn said:

We will need multiple drafts to get the personnel to run a spread offense. Good lord if that is the plan we are so boned.

Or we could just change the scheme...

[Daeavorn]

6 minutes ago, Mr. Scot said:

Or we could just change the scheme...

Yes i agree and this is my preference.

But if Tepper is pushing the spread offense stuff then...

[toldozer]

6 hours ago, lightsout said:

 

I get the snarkiness here and love it but it makes me mad because you can run folds, you can run iso and power, you can run everything except tosses with the same timing and momentum as you can from under center and yet we keep doing stupid poo lol

I'm not being snarky. We 100% picked the wrong qb based on our oline personnel.  I don't know how people that get paid money to evaluate talent couldn't see that

[lightsout]

13 minutes ago, toldozer said:

I'm not being snarky. We 100% picked the wrong qb based on our oline personnel.  I don't know how people that get paid money to evaluate talent couldn't see that

 

CJ would be just as bad with all else being equal. No rookie QB can succeed with what we have been doing and who we've been doing it with. Dalton looked decent because Dalton is multi time pro bowler. 

[toldozer]

3 minutes ago, lightsout said:

 

CJ would be just as bad with all else being equal. No rookie QB can succeed with what we have been doing and who we've been doing it with. Dalton looked decent because Dalton is multi time pro bowler. 

We wouldn't be running everything out of the gun with stroud so all things wouldn't be equal