REPORT: Panthers turned down trade offers for Brian Burns from at least 5 teams

[WhoKnows]

8 hours ago, DaveThePanther2008 said:

Here's my take.

We were obviously looking to get a QB in the 2023 draft.  We traded CMC for far less than what he was worth.  Had we held onto CMC and traded Burns we would have had two first rounders we could have used in the Young trade and maybe save our 2024 first round pick (which now appears to be a top 3 pick) and kept Moore.  These two weapons would have given Young something to work with.   

With Young already in house our top pick in 2024 would have netted us several 1st round picks to the right team.  I think to make matters worse is that Burns wants top dollar for a DE that isn't top tier DE money. I love Burns and he makes some good plays. However, he's not caliber of a Bosa. I think we knew last year that Burns was going to be a holdout and not sign an extension when Bosa was up for contract.  It would have saved us from the headache. 

They say hindsight is 2020 but if you are going to gut your offense of your best players for draft picks, why not use some of the defensive talent and reboot the entire team.  In the long run I think we traded the wrong player in 2022. 

I’ve said the same thing as well. We traded CMC too soon and for too less. Had we known about the Burns value to the Rams, maybe we make that deal and are able to just use their picks and still have Young, CMC, Moore and our 2024 1st.

As a rebuilding franchise, which IMHO we have not done well, you’ve got to sacrifice some players. Stafford was Detroit’s best player. Tunsil and Fitzpatrick were Miami’s beat guys. Same with Ramsey and the Jags. What the teams (who rebuild properly) realize is that you need volume of good draft picks so you can draft Tua and Waddle and throw a first at Tyreke Hill.

Fitterer has been half adding stuff and as soon as he turned down the game changing rebuild offer, he lost his leverage with a lack of extension in place and forced himself to say no to every trade that now makes him like a fool for getting way less.

[WhoKnows]

Also, just to be clear, I’m glad we didn’t do a Commanders fire sale. We had our amazing offer last year.

[kungfoodude]

56 minutes ago, WhoKnows said:

I’ve said the same thing as well. We traded CMC too soon and for too less. Had we known about the Burns value to the Rams, maybe we make that deal and are able to just use their picks and still have Young, CMC, Moore and our 2024 1st.

As a rebuilding franchise, which IMHO we have not done well, you’ve got to sacrifice some players. Stafford was Detroit’s best player. Tunsil and Fitzpatrick were Miami’s beat guys. Same with Ramsey and the Jags. What the teams (who rebuild properly) realize is that you need volume of good draft picks so you can draft Tua and Waddle and throw a first at Tyreke Hill.

Fitterer has been half adding stuff and as soon as he turned down the game changing rebuild offer, he lost his leverage with a lack of extension in place and forced himself to say no to every trade that now makes him like a fool for getting way less.

The haul on CMC was fantastic, regardless of what we did to squander the picks.

It would have been very unwise to try a waiting game on an NFL RB. Not sure if you have noticed but that market is very, very poor.

[lightsout]

I wish I could afford All 22 so I could go snap by snap, so YouTube highlights will have to do.

 

 

 

First snap we see from Burns is a boot away from him. 

Second snap, he gets absolutely worked and forced to his inside knee. 

Third snap, quick hitter, no conclusions to draw.

Fourth snap, works/gets worked way too far upfield. About 9 yards deep before he tries to pivot and spin out, and doesn't.

5: coverage

6: doesn't allow himself to go upfield too far, got handled by his lone blocker.

7: goal line, allows himself to get washed inside. Granted it appears we were selling out for the sneak or an A gap hit, so this may have been on the call rather than the performance. 

8: decent off the line. Doesn't get home but it's a quick hitter. If this is a 5-7 step drop, he might get there. 

9: sack. He gets isolated to the RB who can't pass pro well and Burns is good enough that a bad pass protecting RB isn't gonna stop him. We showed 6, brought 4....and they didn't slide protection to his side. Now this can be a mistake by the offense...or a "fug it, it's supposed to be a quick hitter, Burns won't get there even if we ignore him". Who knows? My guess is the shown blitz made them protect inside and Burns had a free run to the backfield with the RB being the only speed bump. Good play by Burns regardless.

10: dropped in coverage

11: comes off the edge, then tries to bend inside because he couldn't beat the tackle, which allows Stroud outside, which leads to a first down throw and catch. If Burns stays edge, this doesn't happen. 

12: they ran trap at him. He gets a tad too far upfield but he's a good athlete, adjusts, goes around the pulling blocker looking for him, and has a chance to stop the play in the backfield. Misses the tackle. EVERY level of football I've ever seen talked about, when you have trap coming at you, you "wrong arm" (use your outside arm to rip through the blocker, as they want you outside, so you go inside to disrupt the play) and disrupt, maybe make the tackle, or you force them to bounce where pursuit is naturally coming. This is bad football by Burns on a play where he was relying on his athleticism and forgot tackle fundamentals. RB spins, stays inside, and gets a big gain. Burns had two ways to prevent this (wrong arm it or make the play he had a chance at) and failed. This is a Burns-caused play.

13: they run boot again but the effort from Burns is fuging awful off the line. Like I'd chew a high school kid for that kind of effort. Just piss poor.

14: busted play where the backside corner should've made the play, but again Burns is catching at the line instead of attacking and closing off. Literally just watched the play. Now, yes it went opposite side of the field, but all OL movement says this was coming to his side. He's not maintaining outside leverage, he has nobody blocking him. He is just flat footed at the line looking down the line. Piss poor.

15: another bad run play by Burns in the RedZone. He's not outside contain this play, the corner is. He does good initially and then tries to get upfield...which allows him to get washed out, RB cuts it inside and gets it to the 1. Burns stays down pressure, keeps his outside arm free, he can force it wide and pursue. This is bad, and it's on Burns once again because his play literally created the hole. Stay down pressure there and then it's the LB/S fault for not filling properly and getting downhill.

16: there was a missed goal line play that was a sneak, so we're skipping and going to the next play he's in which is where he gets disrupted by the TE delay route and bounced in and blocked. Nothing of note.

17: a play I can't tell if it's Burns or not but if it is...oof. bad.

18: arguably gets held, regardless gets a bit too deep here. 

 

There are 30 snaps not seen here that Burns is on the field for, but none of those made the highlight video I watched. So just over 1/3 of his snaps were on there and the above is....not great. His lone sack could've been anybody that can be a RB 1-on-1 to the QB and the rest is expected play from and DE/OLB or bad. 

Not conclusive, no, but I focus my watching of Panthers games on our guys, not the opposing QB. Burns is lacking severely for me. But I'm not coach or GM so who the fug am I?

Edited November 5, 2023 by lightsout

[mc52beast]

Would like to know if the Cons offered anything and what it was if they did. Would Fitty trade Burns to someone in the South? 

[Rocky Davis]

Burns relies solely on his God given talent, if he had any motivation to improve or study tape he would probably be the best Edge in the NFL.  Instead he's an above average Edge.

[RJK]

Atlanta out of pocket 

[Gipetto]

you guys really don't know how hard it is to get a generational pass rusher.

[mrcompletely11]

Just now, Gipetto said:

you guys really don't know how hard it is to get a generational pass rusher.

Burns is a generational pass rusher or am I missing the sarcasm?

[Toomers]

4 minutes ago, Gipetto said:

you guys really don't know how hard it is to get a generational pass rusher.

[Cam's New Arm]

14 minutes ago, Gipetto said:

you guys really don't know how hard it is to get a generational pass rusher.

 

[Johnstonny]

21 hours ago, TheBigKat said:

But yet we refuse to pay him

 

 poo or get off the pot 

....the panther way is to get nothing for him...watch..

[Bama Panther]

27 minutes ago, Gipetto said:

you guys really don't know how hard it is to get a generational pass rusher.

It must be. Panthers haven’t had one since Peppers. 

[Johnstonny]

15 hours ago, Bama Panther said:

Many people make the argument that you need a QB on a rookie deal to be able to field a competitive team. The reason they make this argument is that having a rookie deal for a typically highly compensated position frees up money to spend elsewhere. 

The same holds true for a DE as well. A DE on a rookie deal frees up money to spend elsewhere. While Burns has value, I don’t personally believe he has $30M+ per year value (and I don’t think five teams trying to trade for him shows he has that value either, as we don’t know what type of contract they would offer him).

In the case of arguing Fitterer made a mistake not taking the Rams deal last year, you have to look at the return value. Absent the Bryce trade, it would have been two more players (likely at highly compensated positions) on rookie deals.

That trade would have potentially led to three traditionally highly compensated positions on rookie deals with a fifth year option for each. That is too much value to turn down, despite the unknown of who the first round picks would have netted. 

Another interesting consideration is that one of those firsts could have likely been used in the trade for #1, thereby saving DJ Moore and giving Bryce a #1 WR. 

...thats how it shoulda played out with a GM that has logical thinking.