How long are you willing to give Bryce the benefit of the doubt

[DeAngelo Beason]

I have such confidence that he's a bust (and knew he would be one before he was drafted) that I don't find it to be a worthwhile mental exercise to even consider the hypothetical.

[Pejorative Miscreant]

I think the verdict is still out on Bryce and I dont think I can make a clear "judgement" until some of the stuff around him is cleaned up.  Not saying he should have perfection but the offense, play calling and scripting we have done for Bryce clouds the picture in my opinion.  I would say I need a full season to start forming an educated opinion and another one to see if it is validated. 

[rebelrouser]

We are stuck with him for three years minimum. Gave up too much to get him. 

[PghPanther]

2 hours ago, Varking said:

Young should be given two full seasons at least. 

That is if he doesn't get crushed into IR from some 300lb D lineman running through the Panther swiss cheese make shift Oline............

He's the wrong horse in the wrong race..............

[mrcompletely11]

21 minutes ago, joemac said:

I still dont understand why everybody is so down in the dumps over Bryce.  Has he set the league on fire in 4 starts?  No....however, he has statistically improved every start so far.  He has 5 TD passes and 4 INTs in 4 starts. Hes completing 64% of his passes, and has 750 yards in 4 games played.  If we extrapolate those numbers out for 16 games we get - 64%/3000 yards/20 TDs/16 INTs.... Which seems pretty freaking spot on for most #1 pick QBs who come into less than great teams. And I think we're going to see the TDs and yards start to increase.  Still think he will throw a lot of picks, but that is, frankly OK with me for his rookie year.  I expect his stats at the end of the year to look something like:

65%

3300 yards

25 TDs

17 INTs

QBR - 28

YPA - 5.2

Add to the fact that he simply doesnt look the part, he has no discernible traits, he is not athletic and his arm strength is extremely debatable.

 

Sure there are ways to spin this as you did above but for me the eyeball test tells me he just isnt it

[Waldo]

6 minutes ago, PghPanther said:

That is if he doesn't get crushed into IR from some 300lb D lineman running through the Panther swiss cheese make shift Oline............

He's the wrong horse in the wrong race..............

QBs are so protected now, Bryce really doesn't run much anyways and he goes down if he is slightly touched. On the flip side every DC knows they can rush the speed from the outside and he wont step up or rush up the gut and he loses vision. No need for the kinds of hits Cam took for years so I'm not sure we will see one anytime soon with him. It just doesn't take that kind of effort to bring Bryce down.

[MasterAwesome]

9 hours ago, Knaakedup said:

Also, if he NEEDS it to be perfect around him to succeed, then that’s not the definition of a franchise QB I really want to build around. 

I agree that a QB who needs everything to be perfect around him to succeed is not a franchise guy.  But is any part of his supporting cast even "average"?  Can we even confidently say that?  Seems to be 0 for 3 on o-line, receiving corps, and coaching for anyone watching the games.  I feel like the "everything perfect" argument is a pretty big strawman.  How about we just simply start with one good group around him and see how that goes?  Surely there's a reasonable middle ground between everything being bad and everything being perfect.

I also get the "not flashing" argument although I'd say that's a pretty subjective and unreliable metric to hone in on.  Personally I've seen some impressive "capital A Anticipation" throws (to borrow from my YouTube QB School courses) that I've been encouraged by.  Is that enough?  Hell no, but I'd at least qualify those as flashes, personally.  If you or others don't, then that's perfectly understandable, hence the "subjective" characterization of what constitutes flashing.

[Knaakedup]

3 minutes ago, MasterAwesome said:

I agree that a QB who needs everything to be perfect around him to succeed is not a franchise guy.  But is any part of his supporting cast even "average"?  Can we even confidently say that?  Seems to be 0 for 3 on o-line, receiving corps, and coaching for anyone watching the games.  I feel like the "everything perfect" argument is a pretty big strawman.  How about we just simply start with one good group around him and see how that goes?  Surely there's a reasonable middle ground between everything being bad and everything being perfect.

I also get the "not flashing" argument although I'd say that's a pretty subjective and unreliable metric to hone in on.  Personally I've seen some impressive "capital A Anticipation" throws (to borrow from my YouTube QB School courses) that I've been encouraged by.  Is that enough?  Hell no, but I'd at least qualify those as flashes, personally.  If you or others don't, then that's perfectly understandable, hence the "subjective" characterization of what constitutes flashing.

This is a fair response. Maybe my expectations are just a tad unrealistic due to Cam and watching other QBs in the league. 

And you're right, there has been a few throws that would have been TDs (looking at you poo for hands, Ian Thomas), but he can't catch the ball himself. 

I think my main gripe is not so much Bryce, I am good with seeing how he pans out the next year or two, but for the love of God, get a creative and younger coaching staff to build and offense around him. 

You put Bryce in a scheme like Miami runs (I'm not saying we need a Tyreek, etc.), but all that motion, pre-snap movement to keep the defense honest, and creativity would probably take a load off his shoulders and allow that "super brain" of his to make some good poo happen. Reich and co. were probably the absolute worst option available to us for this situation. 

[TheWiz]

He shouldnt have been the number #1 pick. Doesnt mean he wont be successful. Doesnt mean we wont eventually get it right. But we should not have mortgaged our future for him. 

It feels like he throws the ball away.... alot. I am however pleasantly surprised that given his size that he has been pretty wise with the hits he takes and getting rid of the football. 

So I'm not down on him. But what we gave up for him.... We're not seeing it. 

[OldhamA]

7 hours ago, Jackie Lee said:

Look up Brees rushing on youtube, Bryce can't do that. They aren't the same size 

There's a picture of them stood next to each other - Brees has a clear 2 inches on him. So not only is he bigger, but he's more athletic - and he had a RIDICULOUSLY accurate arm.

All throughout the Draft process I was telling people that Young's only path to success was to be Brees-lite - the problem is he's shown already that half of the throws an NFL QB needs to make are off the table for him.

For everyone saying he's got 2-3 years to prove it - if we get a new GM (and I hope to god a new HC) I think he's literally fighting for his NFL life now. He doesn't look like he even belongs out there 90% of the time. 

[OldhamA]

7 hours ago, GoobyPls said:

He’s a much better athlete than Brees 

Show your working out.

[CPF4LIFE]

48 minutes ago, Waldo said:

QBs are so protected now, Bryce really doesn't run much anyways and he goes down if he is slightly touched. On the flip side every DC knows they can rush the speed from the outside and he wont step up or rush up the gut and he loses vision. No need for the kinds of hits Cam took for years so I'm not sure we will see one anytime soon with him. It just doesn't take that kind of effort to bring Bryce down.

And this is why im not buying all the vitriol for the o line. Have they been good as last year? No...but they have been good enough for an adequate qb to succeed. What do you expect and nfl offensive line to do when they have a qb that dropbacks 15 yards in the pocket right in the lane of rushers and cant step up in the pocket to avoid them because his vision gets clouded downfield then he has to bring the ball down and maneuver which adds up to way to long for a o line to block. Its a recipe for disaster and no O line is gonna look good with a qb doing these things all game. But I guess the people that think they know football will get it one day.

[djp14]

3 minutes ago, OldhamA said:

For everyone saying he's got 2-3 years to prove it - if we get a new GM (and I hope to god a new HC) I think he's literally fighting for his NFL life now.

He'll get at least a couple of years based on what we gave up to get him. 

What happens with Fitterer and Reich is irrelevant.

[CPF4LIFE]

3 minutes ago, djp14 said:

He'll get at least a couple of years based on what we gave up to get him. 

What happens with Fitterer and Reich is irrelevant.

Then if thats the case then you damn sure better be worried about who will be replacing gm and coach because Bryce will be a absolute topic of discussion with whoever tepper hires next. It will come down to who is willing to hitch their wagon to him and who isnt. The right/best coach may not be willing to unless he can get his own guy soon and the wrong coach would just be doing it for a job which ultimately ends up a waste of time for everybody.