It was a terrible trade but not because of Bryce

[NAS]

This is a bad trade but not because Bryce was the #1 pick it’s because of one reason

WE WERE NEVER A QB AWAY FROM BEING A PLAYOFF CONTENDER like we were led to believe by the idiots Tepper and Fitt

Compare it to the 49ers Trey Lance trade,   who truly were and could still muster competitive season even when their trade up for Trey Lance was a total bust.

Bryce Young will not bust but it was stupid to trade away his #1 receiver and next year’s first when it’s going to be another top 5 pick.
 

That’s why it’s a bad trade and it would be a bad trade even if  Stroud was the pick. Stroud in this offense may have mustered a 1-4 record instead of 0-5 and ultimately it’s a different conversation if he should have been the pick instead.

Edited October 9, 2023 by NAS

[mrcompletely11]

4 minutes ago, NAS said:

This is a bad trade but not because Bryce was the #1 pick it’s because of one reason

WE WERE NEVER A QB AWAY FROM BEING A PLAYOFF CONTENDER like we were led to believe by the idiots Tepper and Fitt

Compare it to the 49ers Trey Lance trade,   who truly were and could still muster competitive season even when their trade up for Trey Lance was a total bust.

Bryce Young will not bust but it was stupid to trade away his #1 receiver and next year’s first when it’s going to be another top 5 pick.
 

That’s why it’s a bad trade and it would be a bad trade even if  Stroud was the pick. Stroud in this offense may have mustered a 1-4 record instead of 0-5 and ultimately it’s a different conversation if he should have been the pick instead.

if only someone had brought this up at the time.............

[LinvilleGorge]

If we had Stroud and he was rewriting rookie record books no one would be saying this. There's never a bad time to land a franchise QB.

[tukafan21]

Eh, I don't really agree with this, well at least depending on your definition of "playoff contender"

If you mean it as "a QB away from being legitimate contenders once you get to the playoffs" then sure, you're right.

But I think we were a QB away from contending for a playoff spot after last season.  That's exactly when you make the move to go get your QB, as even if you don't make the playoffs in that first season with them, you're still supposed to be right on the edge and then moving forward you become legitimate SB contenders as the QB gains experience. 

I think our biggest problem (outside of how awful Bryce has been) has been the coaching staff, they took a team right on the edge of being solid and made them significantly worse.

We were 7-10 last year and in theory, we brought back the same starter or upgraded the starter at all 22 starting positions outside of WR #1, and even then, we upgraded our WR as a whole compared to last season.

Yes, injuries have hurt us, particularly on defense, but when you do all that to a 7-10 team, there is no reason to then be THIS bad, outside of the coaches doing something terribly wrong.

Case and point... where in the flying fug has Chinn been?

The guy is a legitimate player, he flies all over the field and makes plays, but we only put him out there for 1/3rd of the snaps because this staff can't figure out how to use him properly.  I'm not saying the lack of Chinn's usage is the reason we're losing, but it's just one glaring example of how the coaches don't seem to know what they're doing.

I hated the trade before the pick, I hated the trade after the pick, and I hate the trade now that we're seeing it play out.

But none of that changes my feelings that we were a solid QB away from contending for the NFC South and we bet on the wrong staff and QB to get the job done.

Edited October 9, 2023 by tukafan21

[Cpt slay a ho]

I mean when have these trades worked historically ? 

Can’t believe we got finessed doing something that’s proven to fail more times than pass 
 

[tukafan21]

6 minutes ago, Cpt slay a ho said:

I mean when have these trades worked historically ? 

Can’t believe we got finessed doing something that’s proven to fail more times than pass 
 

They haven't and I pointed that out on here many times before we made the trade.

A big trade up to take a QB has never worked as far as I'm aware, main reason is because if the available QB's were THAT good, the team who finished with the #1 pick would take that QB and trade their current QB instead of trading away the pick, like the Colts did with Luck/Manning.

So teams are trading away far too many assets, whether they be picks or players, to take a prospect who wouldn't be the top QB taken in most years.

It's a bad recipe that doesn't work out

And before anyone points out the Mahomes trade, that is VERY different.  First is that they didn't really give up a haul, they only gave up a 3rd and a future first to move up 17 spots in the draft, that's kinda a steal.  Then Mahomes was anything but a can't miss prospect who landed with a team that was already contending in the AFC, with an elite coach, WR, and TE already in place while then letting him sit and learn for a year.

The closest to it working out would probably be the RG3 trade, which really only failed because their coaches were dumb enough to play him in the playoffs on an already injured knee and it ended up ruining his career when he totally tore it up.  So who knows how that would have played out, but when the closest time a trade like this has worked out is when the player won ROY and then fell off a cliff due to injuries, it's not something teams should keep trying to do.

Edited October 9, 2023 by tukafan21

[Proudiddy]

De Nile isn't just a river in Egypt.

[45catfan]

27 minutes ago, NAS said:

This is a bad trade but not because Bryce was the #1 pick it’s because of one reason

WE WERE NEVER A QB AWAY FROM BEING A PLAYOFF CONTENDER like we were led to believe by the idiots Tepper and Fitt

Compare it to the 49ers Trey Lance trade,   who truly were and could still muster competitive season even when their trade up for Trey Lance was a total bust.

Bryce Young will not bust but it was stupid to trade away his #1 receiver and next year’s first when it’s going to be another top 5 pick.
 

That’s why it’s a bad trade and it would be a bad trade even if  Stroud was the pick. Stroud in this offense may have mustered a 1-4 record instead of 0-5 and ultimately it’s a different conversation if he should have been the pick instead.

BUT WE HAVE TO GET OUR QB THIS DRAFT...NO MATTER WHAT!!!!

Me:

 

Edited October 9, 2023 by 45catfan

[kungfoodude]

22 minutes ago, LinvilleGorge said:

If we had Stroud and he was rewriting rookie record books no one would be saying this. There's never a bad time to land a franchise QB.

It's also likely Stroud would be floundering in this DOA offense with paltry weapons.

TBH, I highly doubt Stroud would be looking nearly as good here. He is probably the best of the bunch but that will only go so far with what we are doing.

[NAS]

22 minutes ago, LinvilleGorge said:

If we had Stroud and he was rewriting rookie record books no one would be saying this. There's never a bad time to land a franchise QB.

If you think Stroud would do anything more than marginally better than Bryce in this offense, you're just being a prisoner of the moment regarding his fit in Houston which is a much better coached team.

[Varking]

The trade was a bust because of what was given, not what was gained. 
 

Panthers got Bryce Young. 

Bears got a #1 WR, used the pick swap to gain a first round Left Tackle Wright, used the other pick for their #2 corner in Stevenson, have a 2024 pick from the eagles and a round 2 2025 from us. 
 

That pick from us could be Caleb Williams or Marvin Harrison Jr. or they could flip it for even more picks if it’s the first overall pick. 
 

But I’m not mad we went with Bryce. The reason I hate the trade is we could have given up Brown, Burns or DJ and our franchise said “so we are going with a young QB at 1…. Let’s not move our defenders to keep our best weapon to support him, let’s trade away DJ Moore”. 
 

If Fields doesn’t continue developing then they have ammo to go after Williams or Maye while also having DJ Moore on their roster… 

[Varking]

1 minute ago, NAS said:

If you think Stroud would do anything more than marginally better than Bryce in this offense, you're just being a prisoner of the moment regarding his fit in Houston which is a much better coached team.

I fully believe Stroud would be operating the offense here better than Bryce because I also believe the offense was designed by Reich with Stroud in mind before it became clear we were going for Bryce. 
 

Stroud is a better player right now. That doesn’t mean he’ll be better in three years still but right now he absolutely would have helped get more wins than Bryce so far. 

[NAS]

1 minute ago, Varking said:

I fully believe Stroud would be operating the offense here better than Bryce because I also believe the offense was designed by Reich with Stroud in mind before it became clear we were going for Bryce. 
 

Stroud is a better player right now. That doesn’t mean he’ll be better in three years still but right now he absolutely would have helped get more wins than Bryce so far. 

Can’t disagree with him being better, he’s balling right now. But I don’t think he would look very good behind this offensive line and these receivers. I think we would see more completions downfield but he wouldn’t have enough time to do it very often.

[LinvilleGorge]

5 minutes ago, NAS said:

If you think Stroud would do anything more than marginally better than Bryce in this offense, you're just being a prisoner of the moment regarding his fit in Houston which is a much better coached team.

I think rookie Stroud is quite a bit better than current Dalton and Dalton looked quite a bit better than Bryce, so...