How many times are you going to let John Fox fool you?

[Kevin Greene]

If he had pulled Jake 11 weeks ago we would be in the Playoffs. He gets this team up to play every week. I just cant dismiss that. The only thing JR needs to do is to make sure Jake is not the starter next year IMO. I know he doesn't get involved in how Fox runs the team, But I think this one time he should.

He needs to make sure Jake doesn't start by showing Fox the door.

[enolagay38]

I think Fox is a good coach. He does a good job motivating a team through adversity. His biggest fault this year was believing he could ressurect Jake. Even after many of us fans knew Jake was done, Fox still believed it could happen. Delhomme played just well enough against Arizona, Atlanta, and even New Orleans to keep that dream alive for him. Unfortunately, that was not to be. I think he truly believed Jake gave us the best opportunity to win. He was wrong, but I highly doubt he gets fired for it.

[magnus]

I've never guaranteed he would be fired. I have predicted it though. I still stand by that prediction.

and given how much of a hissy you've thrown because the team had the nerve to win, I'm sure this will end well for you

[Jangler]

He needs to make sure Jake doesn't start by showing Fox the door.

Reality Koolaid says Fox will be back...

[Sam Mills Fan]

and given how much of a hissy you've thrown because the team had the nerve to win, I'm sure this will end well for you

I love nothing more than the Panthers winning. What I have a problem with are idiot bandwagon fans that change their minds on whether Fox should be back based on if we won or lost that week.

[SorthNarolina]

Those who are saying "quit your bitching", aren't facing the music. We have been very inconsistent over fox's tenure and often under perform. It's so ironic that we view fox as a great coach for pulling the team out of a disaster he engineered. When it comes down to it he's been mediocre more times than not.

I think he is a good coach and we might possibly benefit from keeping him around. But he's hanging by a thread, our inconsistency is unnacceptable. Just because he's always able to pull us from outright horrible seasons, doesn't make him an elite coach.

Fox has NO idea how to keep a good team motivated, they have to embarrass themselves for a season before they themselves decide they're tired of being laughed at. We never fire on all cyllinders.

BUT when it comes right down to it I don't know what's best for the team, JR knows a lot more than I do. Whatever decision he makes I have total confidence in. I'm just really tired of never knowing what we're going to get.

I don't think he should be fired unless we know we can get somebody better.

We'll probably go to the playoffs next season and maybe the SB if we get hot. It's the 2011 hangover that's going to piss me off.

[enolagay38]

If we were embarrassed, he would be gone. Even in the bad years, we have never approached 1-15 embarrassing under Fox. I think JR can handle mediocre every other year. But, as evidenced by Seifert, he can't handle embarrassing.

[CAVSS]

Player Att Comp YdsComp % Yds/Att TD TD % INT INT % Long Sck Sack/Lost Rating

Jake Delhomme 321 178 2015 55.5 6.3 8 2.5 18 5.6 52 23 187 59.4

Matt Moore 115 71 891 61.7 7.7 7 6.1 2 1.7 66 7 65 98.9

Josh McCown 6 1 2 16.7 0.3 0 0.0 0 0.0 2 1 6 39.6

Please look closely at these numbers. Then recall that Moore was our #3 QB after Fox's evaluations.

Sorry for some reason the numbers won't stay in position after I post them so they require a little deciphering.

Or go here http://www.nfl.com/teams/carolinapanthers/statistics?team=CAR

[pantherj]

I think our QB lineup for 2010 will be:

Moore

Jake

McCown

Fox probably hesitated to pull Jake because of his belief that Moore would go through 'growing pains' due to his inexperience. I would have benched Jake in the Bills game, and for the rest of the season.

[davos]

God bless John Fox. All it takes for him to look great to a lot of fans is to have 3 winning seasons in 8 years. DAT CONSISTENCY!!

consistently inconsistent

[Jangler]

If we were embarrassed, he would be gone. Even in the bad years, we have never approached 1-15 embarrassing under Fox. I think JR can handle mediocre every other year. But, as evidenced by Seifert, he can't handle embarrassing.

I agree, Jake's finger saved Fox' job. No way around that fact.

[BIGH2001]

The "consistency" we had before Fox came in was amazing. Maybe you spoiled brats would like to go back to that. After all, you are absolutely entitled to a SB contender every year.

[rayzor]

NFC teams with 3 winning seasons (just like the panthers) since 2002:

falcons (3 playoff trips)

bears (2 playoff trips)

chiefs (2 playoff appearances)

saints (1 soon to be 2 playoff appearances)

NFC teams with more winning seasons:

cowboys (6 - 3 playoff trips)

packers (5 - 4 playoff appearances)

vikings (4 - 2 playoff appearances)

giants (4 could be 5 soon - 5 playoff appearances)

eagles (6 - 5 playoff appearances)

seahawks (5 - 4 playoff appearances)

bucs (4 - 3 playoff appearances)

the overall winning record is nice but when you put it into perspective....only 3 winning seasons since 2002...it doesn't look all that great.

sure, having 3 winning seasons is pretty good but when you look at the number of winning seasons you find that there are only 5 teams in the NFC with less winning seasons than the panthers since 2002.

only 5 teams with less winning seasons than the panthers. are you impressed?

there are 3 teams with the 3 trips to the playoffs since 2002. there are 4 teams with 4 or more trips. call me picky, but i'd rather be in that group that has been 4 or more times. you know what? we could have been. in 2006 and this year, there is little reason why we shouldn't have gone. sure you can blame this year on injuries some but there are some personnel changes that could have made that record better. if mccown hadn't been on IR and if they hadn't clung so tightly to jake as the starter...we could have had more. if they had gotten smith some more help at WR, we could have had more.

what was the excuse in '06, though?

here's the thing about fox: he loves gaining momentum and then trying to coast. he'll build speed up to try and get to a point where he can let off the gas and hope he's built up enough speed so that he can reach the finish line in front of most the others he's competing with.

the major problem with that is that he can't sustain momentum. he can't build on what he does.

you see it in games where he's built up a solid lead and then they take their foot off the gas and hope that the lead they created was enough to get them the lead.

you see it in their game defensive game strategy and management. bend but don't break? have a defense thats juuuuuust strong enough keep the other team from winning....most of the time.

you see it in their choice for QB. get someone who is going to do just good enough to detract some attention from the run game. also, where do they try and get their QBs? from on top the scrap heap. sure, we traded for mcown but guess where he was headed if they didn't make the trade? he was going to be released. where is the dedication to excellence? where is the striving to get one of the best at the position like they do with RB and other positions? it's just not there.

you see it in their goals for every season. break the season up into 4 sections and try to win 3 out of four. sure, thats 75% but when you are talking 3 out of 4, you're talking about trying to be juuuust good enough to get by.

you see it going from season to season. they get to 11-5 or 12-4 and a playoff spot? lets not mess with anything. you try to improve and you might just mess things up by tinkering so lets just hold back a little. lets just try and hope that we got enough stuff right last year that it carries through to this year.

if they achieve success, they expect what they did to be enough to get them through. their response to poor management of the playoff game against the cardinals? we did things the same way we did the last time we played them. it worked then, it should work again. (massive paraphrase but whatever...)

if the team wants to be consistently the best, they need to have someone that is going to push them constantly. someone who is going to push them to be the best...to dominate on all fronts 100% of the time.

we just don't have that with fox. it's sad to me that so many people have found this acceptable. the goals are too low. the aim is too low. expectations are too low. the rate of success is too low.

there is only one real target in the NFL....the Lombardi. Fox just hasn't shown he can put the team in position to get it nearly enough.

[rayzor]

The "consistency" we had before Fox came in was amazing. Maybe you spoiled brats would like to go back to that. After all, you are absolutely entitled to a SB contender every year.

so your goal is to be just better than suck? awesome. you aim low and you should have little problem reaching your goal.