Post Mortem: Game 2

[Mr. Scot]

Just now, davos said:

For having 3 ex-NFL QBs on this staff, one a SB winning OC as HC, an OC that's a McVay disciple/SB winner (and close companion), and a SB-winning HC consulting the offense, it is incredibly disappointing we can barely muster 150 yards in the air, now two games in a row.

What worked against ATL was done even less.  We simply aren't running a competent offense. The lack of response and effective adjustments after game 1 is incredibly concerning.  Furthermore, the lack of nuance to the sequence of playcalls is reminiscent of Foxball.

This would make Matt Stafford look like CJ Beathard.

We don't have guys getting open.

Until we do, the pass game is going to be rough.

[USDepartmentOfSavagery]

Here’s the boomer take I was looking for. The wait and see approach that we tend to see from people born several decades ago. The NFL has changed and passed you by. This isn’t your daddy’s redskins or cowboys. We are 0-2 with a roster that was better than 3/4 the division last year. Talk about that. 

Edited September 19, 2023 by USDepartmentOfSavagery

[Ornias]

1 minute ago, Mr. Scot said:

We don't have guys getting open.

Until we do, the pass game is going to be rough.

Apparently Reich cannot scheme then open either. He should put the clipboard down. Our receivers are barely Jags but rubs and crossing routes work in your favor there. 

[Mr. Scot]

1 minute ago, LinvilleGorge said:

This seems like some type of fandom Stockholm Syndrome induced by years of watching losing football.

Nah.

Matt Rhule may have been stupid to suggest that we needed 5-7 years, but it's equally unrealistic to think everything was going to be fixed in one offseason.

We have elements of the team that are good (defense / OL / special teams) and areas that still need some work (skill positions).

Further work will be done next year.

[davos]

4 minutes ago, Mr. Scot said:

We don't have guys getting open.

Until we do, the pass game is going to be rough.

It's not an end all be all and they have the capability to do so with the right schemes that aren't archaic triangle patterns.  We have Adam Thielen & DJ Chark along with a compeltely viable TE in Hurst.  This is not some incompetent receiving group people keep making it out to be.  TMJ is lost however, I concede.

The play design is not acceptable and there is no rhythm/structure to the call response.  The runs are redundant and they aren't running enough motions or using any sort of pre-snap movements that make modern offenses successful.    

Just look at the Rams right now with Tutu Atwell, a 5th rounder, and an aging Stafford.  You have a good coach, scheme, approach, you'll make it happen.  It's so much about coaching and this is not a good sign out of the gate.  No hard line in the sand (yet) but this is some disgusting football.

Edited September 19, 2023 by davos

[tukafan21]

1 minute ago, Mr. Scot said:

Okay to admit it...if that's the way it works out.

Suggesting that we know it two games into his career is kinda goofy.

If I go and play Russian Roulette and survive, does that mean it was the smart decision to play?

Of course not

His career can work out and it still be a bad trade that ended up working for us, they're not mutually exclusive.  

There were just far too many risks with Young to give up everything we gave up to get him.  He only has 1 elite trait and that's the mental side of things, which is also the one thing that you can coach up in anyone.  You can't coach up physical traits and he doesn't posses any elite QB physical traits, and it's shown in these 2 games, badly.

Like I said, I'm still going to hope his career works out for us, I'm not giving up on him as a player, he still has potential, but the trade was horrible when you take all factors into consideration.  

Admitting that doesn't make you a bad fan, it makes you just a person who can objectively look at a situation regardless of your fandom.

[Moonraker]

Bryce hasn't looked good but the entire offense is putrid. It's hard to look at just 1 man and point your finger. I would have rather seen us take Stroud or AR, but it's too late for that now. If he's going to be successful, it's going to be the Drew Brees timing and pick you apart playstyle with the occasional deep bomb when people overcommit (in my opinion). I honestly don't know what our offensive system is, but we need players who can accommodate that playstyle if we are going to see him and the offense succeed. 

[Mr. Scot]

Just now, Ornias said:

Apparently Reich cannot scheme then open either. He should put the clipboard down. Our receivers are barely Jags but rubs and crossing routes work in your favor there. 

To be clear, Reich isn't the only one doing the scheming.

He calls the plays (for the moment) but a pretty good portion of the play design was done by Thomas Brown.

Mind you though, until we have players ready to successfully execute the concepts that are drawn up, none of that matters.

 

[Mr. Scot]

1 minute ago, tukafan21 said:

If I go and play Russian Roulette and survive, does that mean it was the smart decision to play?

Of course not

His career can work out and it still be a bad trade that ended up working for us, they're not mutually exclusive.  

There were just far too many risks with Young to give up everything we gave up to get him.  He only has 1 elite trait and that's the mental side of things, which is also the one thing that you can coach up in anyone.  You can't coach up physical traits and he doesn't posses any elite QB physical traits, and it's shown in these 2 games, badly.

Like I said, I'm still going to hope his career works out for us, I'm not giving up on him as a player, he still has potential, but the trade was horrible when you take all factors into consideration.  

Admitting that doesn't make you a bad fan, it makes you just a person who can objectively look at a situation regardless of your fandom.

Yeah, that's a little dramatic

[MGH1989]

12 minutes ago, tukafan21 said:

We made a bad trade and risked the franchise on the wrong QB, it's okay to admit it.  Refusing to admit it won't change things and make them all better.

We're here now and have to deal with it, but sticking your head in the sand and pretending you're seeing things that give you hope isn't going to help.

None of that is to say Bryce can't end up as a good QB, it's still absurdly too early to say anything remotely like that.

But we traded CMC, Moore, 2023 First, 2024 First, 2025 Second and all we got in return was Bryce Young, DJ Johnson and a 2024 5th round pick (and yes, that's literally all we have left from CMC, Moore and those picks, we used everything from the CMC trade to get Bryce and Johnson except for that 5th).

There's no way to slice it, with how Bryce as looked so far, we gave up entirely too much to take the risk on Bryce working out.

Says it’s a bad trade and then literally says it’s too early to say whether Young will be good or bad.

lmfao wut.

Y’all need to go to bed.

[Mr. Scot]

2 minutes ago, Moonraker said:

Bryce hasn't looked good but the entire offense is putrid. It's hard to look at just 1 man and point your finger. I would have rather seen us take Stroud or AR, but it's too late for that now. If he's going to be successful, it's going to be the Drew Brees timing and pick you apart playstyle with the occasional deep bomb when people overcommit (in my opinion). I honestly don't know what our offensive system is, but we need players who can accommodate that playstyle if we are going to see him and the offense succeed. 

Modified WCO

Over time, it'll probably look fairly similar to what Brees ran, but we ain't there yet.

[CRA]

Said going in to the year…

1. it’s a rebuild.  Not matter the lip service.  It’s about developing Bryce, not winning 

however, also said going in…

2.  Frank is a bad playcaller.  Predictable.  Bad.  He is going to help no one out with it. 

3.  Our skill position talent was way too weak for what they would be doing with Young.  Opposing defenses would make life too hard playing the small ball. 

3.  Miles Sanders was drastically overrated and overpaid off one decent year rushing behind the leagues best OL. 

and that is going to be make developing Young hard.  But you got to judge Bryce post bye week IMO. 

[USDepartmentOfSavagery]

3 minutes ago, Mr. Scot said:

Nah.

Matt Rhule may have been stupid to suggest that we needed 5-7 years, but it's equally unrealistic to think everything was going to be fixed in one offseason.

We have elements of the team that are good (defense / OL / special teams) and areas that still need some work (skill positions).

Further work will be done next year.

So explain what the problem is. You are just making excuses. How has the rest of the division with equally bad rosters, or worse (italics doesn’t make you right) all be collectively undefeated and scoring multiple TDs a game. What is our issue? OL? Supposed to be a strength? This experienced, HOF, coaching staff should be able to scheme open this WR corps with the QB THEY WANTED AMD TEADED UP FOR. 

[davos]

I want one of those all-22 people that spend hours on end with this stuff to make a breakdown after this one.  Even more so than last week to scope this out.  

I'd like to see traced route trees on some of these playcalls in singleback where it was deeping stepping dropbacks.  It was just very, very ugly. 

I saw so little condensed formations, angular running attacks in wide zone, sails routes.  Virtually no daggers.