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Bosa deal done. Burns, are you next?

TheCasillas

By TheCasillas,
in Carolina Panthers

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Toomers Mentor

Toomers

Posted
Posted
9 minutes ago, carpanfan96 said:

I said when we talked the other day that.  it's because of the one year or two years depending on how you judge high level pass rushing. He also has a different job, he plays strong side and is depended on to normally set and hold the edge more than rushing.  He got higher stats last year because of Watt missing time and moving over. 

 

Burns has 4 years of production and 3 years of high level pass rushing. 

Who plays strong side? Highsmith? He had 3.5 sacks when Watt was out. 11 when he was playing. 
 

Burns also has 4 years of below average run defense. Something Highsmith will never have. So if you have to “squint” this hard to try and justify Burns being even a little bit better, how can someone believe he’s worth 10M more. Or 80M more guaranteed? 
 

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tukafan21 Grand Master

tukafan21

Posted
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8 minutes ago, mrcompletely11 said:

So why did we trade cmc then?

Because we were stupid

I still hate that trade, especially after giving Miles a decent contract.

I'd so much rather have given up some more of our own picks in the trade to get Bryce than have the ones from the 49ers to use there.

Just imagine putting CMC in the same backfield as Bryce and having his route running and ability to be a check down guy.  They'd be a perfect match made in heaven together and would dominate the league for the next 3-5 years.

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frankw Grand Master

frankw

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3 minutes ago, panthers55 said:

Damn good question. Looking at how we could have been offensively with him here, I think it was a mistake. But I know they were thinking to get as many picks as they could while he was healthy given his injury concerns. It wasn't all about the money.

Not enough data to answer as of yet. It remains to be seen if he will stay healthy or revert back to being dinged up. He was top 5 in touches last season the 49ers damn sure are getting their investments worth out of him. At one point he had a rushing receiving and passing touchdown. Not even we put him out there for all that. I don't foresee that being a recipe for sustained injury free play for long.

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UnluckyforSome Mentor

UnluckyforSome

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26 minutes ago, frankw said:

Not enough data to answer as of yet. It remains to be seen if he will stay healthy or revert back to being dinged up. He was top 5 in touches last season the 49ers damn sure are getting their investments worth out of him. At one point he had a rushing receiving and passing touchdown. Not even we put him out there for all that. I don't foresee that being a recipe for sustained injury free play for long.

Do you happen to read Peter King's column anymore? If not, he has a line in this week's that goes along the lines of how great it is CMC is finally in a system that can maximize him as a player. If you feel that's a bit of a slight or an insult, you should, since he became the 3rd player to have a 1000/1000 season on one  of our awful 5 win teams. No mention made of that though.

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WhoKnows Veteran

WhoKnows

Posted
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41 minutes ago, tukafan21 said:

You're conflating how business works and operates with "the fans pay the player's salaries so they have a right to complain how it's spent" and they couldn't be further from the truth.  Yes, the salary cap is set based on league revenue, which is based off TV contracts, which yes, are then also based off what the networks will be able to get from advertising money.

But to say "we pay their salaries" when you buy a tube of toothpaste is a significant and rather farcical leap of correlation between the two.

That same Crest commercial is also going to run on Real Housewifes of Atlanta.

Are you saying when you buy that $5 tube of toothpaste, that you're partially paying for Brian Burns' contract as well as paying Betty Joe Sue's contract to be on that show?

Of course not

Brand's budgets for advertising on NFL games is solely set by the number of eyeballs that watch the games, not based on how many tubes of toothpaste the ads sell, because there is no way to ever correlate sales to any TV commercial.  The brands who advertise during NFL aren't mom and pop places, they're global fortune 500 type of companies, the ones who are going to have massive sales regardless of how many football fans buy their products.

You buy a tube of toothpaste from Target, Target bought that toothpaste from a distributor, the distributor bought it from Crest, Crest paid CBS and Fox for commercial time, CBS and FOX paid the NFL for the games, the NFL pays teams the TV revenue, the teams pay players.

If you're seriously trying to say that you buying that tube of toothpaste gives you the right as a fan to complain about how YOUR money is being spent on players, then I think you're the one who doesn't understand how business works.

I'm guessing if P&G spent $0 on NFL advertising, while maybe their sales take a small hit, they'd still be one of the biggest companies in the world.  But they spend it there because they know it has a ton of eyeballs so it's a smart use of their advertising money that they'd be spending to place ads somewhere else instead if not on the NFL.

Your argument about if nobody bought P&G products or if all NFL fans started to only watch soccer aren't real life scenarios.  You were saying that in response to if fans spent $0 or $1 million that it wouldn't change how they spend, but I clearly wasn't saying ALL fans, it was individually.  Your scenario would literally take almost every fan of the sport to just stop watching it, which is just nonsense.

If I go out and buy $10 million of Panthers gear today, or even $100 million, it's affect on what we'll pay our players is literally the exact same thing as me spending absolutely nothing.  Because teams want to be competitive, so they spend based on what the cap is, not how much merchandise sales they have.  This isn't European Soccer to where those merchandise sales are what allow you to purchase players from other teams, where they don't have salary caps but caps on what you can spend based on what you bring in.

And all that is set at multitudes of levels away from NFL fan's individual spending on products advertised during games.

Sorry, but you’re wrong. If you actually think P&G doesn’t know which marketing channels work and which ones don’t and they just advertise wherever, you are missing the boat. Heck, if you stream now the ads that you get are targeted based on what shows you watch. There is a ridiculous amount of data out there on you and all of us NFL fans. That’s why advertisers continue to pay outrageous amounts for spots during the Super Bowl.

It’s a lot more than just eyeballs nowadays, but again NFL fans absolutely are at the start of the ball of money rolling from us to advertisers to networks to NFL to revenue sharing with players. It’s just that simple and it has nothing to do with if there is a salary cap or not. It is only about the fact that NFL fans do provide the money for franchises to do what they want. That’s the opposite of when people say it’s not our money because these NFL owners aren’t paying players out of their pockets, it’s coming from the NFL revenue sharing.

Also, cherry picking one fan’s spend is far more nonsense than using an example of all NFL fans becoming Soccer fans. My example illustrates the fact that without fan’s spending/watching games, there is no revenue to share with players. The people I am replying to basically think you as a fan should just shut up and let the big boys do what they want and don’t criticize.

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CRA Grand Master

CRA

Posted
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1 hour ago, frankw said:

You either pay to play or you go back to throwing darts at the draft board hoping and praying you get a stud. In the meantime that new pass rusher will also take time to develop. While that's going on the team will probably not be winning much. Thus resulting in the squandering of our current core. When looking at it from that angle if we sell Burns why not just sell off the rest of the defensive pieces too?

Again, Reddick, Chubb, Von Miller…

you can get great pass rushers for 40-60 guaranteed.  All recent deals. 

paying Burns 120+ guaranteed is just bad business 

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Martin Grand Master

Martin

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1 hour ago, Toomers said:

Who plays strong side? Highsmith? He had 3.5 sacks when Watt was out. 11 when he was playing. 
 

Burns also has 4 years of below average run defense. Something Highsmith will never have. So if you have to “squint” this hard to try and justify Burns being even a little bit better, how can someone believe he’s worth 10M more. Or 80M more guaranteed? 
 

So you are saying Highsmith did much better when Watt got all of the attention, but not as good when Watt was out? Am I reading that right? If so you could also assume Burns would blow those numbers out if the water playing opposite Watt. So you’re kind of making the opposite argument you were thinking, right?

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SmokinwithWilly Grand Master

SmokinwithWilly

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4 minutes ago, CRA said:

Again, Reddick, Chubb, Von Miller…

you can get great pass rushers for 40-60 guaranteed.  All recent deals. 

paying Burns 120+ guaranteed is just bad business 

At some point these contracts are going to end just like the ones did for rookies. It's not feasible to pay less than 20% of your players 80+% of your salary cap and expect to be a perennial playoff contender. 

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