Was Chark a mistake?

[Ricky Prickles]

9 minutes ago, CRA said:

PFF deemed Sanders the worst receiving RB in the entire NFL last year.  Not volume but play.

He ranked near the worst of all RBs as a receiver two years before that.  His sophomore year that he also was paired with Duce. 

Sanders isn't proven to be a bailout option for a QB the last several years in the pass game.  To date, he had a rookie season that never matched up with the rest of his career. 

I thought that is the whole reason we signed him instead of just signing back Foreman? I saw others on here say he would be so much better in the receiving game than Foreman. 

[tukafan21]

2 minutes ago, Jon Snow said:

It doesn't matter if you target him, he has to want to come here. Besides, you cannot run your offense that way. You cannot tie up a chunk of cap in an aging receiver that you will have to focus your offense on. That doesn't help Youngs development at all. That's backwards thinking. 

The contract Hopkins signed with the Titans has him as less than $4 towards the cap this year, that's not a big chunk of cap, in fact, it's less cap this season than Chark is costing us.  Yes, I understand the future cap implications, particularly in year #2 (15 million cap hit), but that could have been rectified by using a little more cap this year instead.

I also don't think we'd have needed to focus on Hopkins to the point that it would be a detriment to Bryce's development, he's not a diva in the way a Diggs or Tyreek is.  Yes, he was visibly upset last year with their young QB's after Kyler went down, but it was because they were throwing garbage passes his way, something Bryce wouldn't be doing.

[CRA]

4 minutes ago, tukafan21 said:

I actually think we have really good bail out options for Bryce this year.

Thielen is pretty much what you'd create in a lab for a bailout option for a rookie QB.  A guy who made his career out of being someone who does the little things right as opposed to relies on his natural talent.

Hurst will also be a nice safety valve option, and I think Mingo and Shenault will be good in those roles as well, as guys Bryce can check it down to and hope they break tackles to pick up yards.

It's the outside WR position that concerns me this year

Theilen is a reliable vet on the backside of his career.  I'd equate him more to the Panthers bringing in Jeremy Shockey for Cam.   

It's probably poor language.  But I'm talking about a stud that can it happen for them.  Not require the perfect throws.  That was 89 for Cam.  Cam could be imperfect and 89 could make up the difference. 

and you pretty much have to scheme up Shenault.  I would imagine that would largely be true early in Mingo's time too.  He is more athlete than polished WR coming in and probably won't be ultra reliable to do what he is supposed to do. 

I'm not overly worried about the outside factor if Chark is healthy.  He can get vertical.  I do worry about if he can't suit up.  Think opposing defenses will really clamp down on us.  No one else is scary going vertical and I would think defenses would really have an easy time making life hard on a rookie QB. 

[ForJimmy]

29 minutes ago, tukafan21 said:

Unless Mingo absolutely breaks out for a 1k type of rookie season, then yes, that would make it a disastrous deal because of the other side of the equation.

As I've said, in a vacuum, the contract we gave Chark wasn't a bad one.  The problem is that the money and roster/depth chart spot would have been better spent on someone more likely to play in more games.

If this was year 3 or 4 of Bryce, it's a totally different story, but this year has 1 goal above all others, and it's the development of Bryce.  To do that, he needs his weapons on the field, and we already have a questionable WR room, to have the top depth chart guy be someone with his injury history was never a good idea.

If we had our 2nd round rookie WR have a breakout year then the Chark deal is "disastrous"?  I'm so confused.  Like you said Bryce needs weapons on the field, if Mingo plays great then Chark can simply been another weapon for as many games as he can give us.  Same for TMJ, Theilen and any other WR/weapon on the team.  We lost DJ Moore and our staff has tried to bring on as many weapons as possible for Young to have.  The flip side to your argument is what if Mingo needs more time to develop (he wasn't getting great separation on Friday).  Isn't it nice to have a nice vet who is capable of getting separation for Young to throw to until Mingo gets more comfortable playing in the NFL?  

[Jon Snow]

2 minutes ago, tukafan21 said:

The contract Hopkins signed with the Titans has him as less than $4 towards the cap this year, that's not a big chunk of cap, in fact, it's less cap this season than Chark is costing us.  Yes, I understand the future cap implications, particularly in year #2 (15 million cap hit), but that could have been rectified by using a little more cap this year instead.

I also don't think we'd have needed to focus on Hopkins to the point that it would be a detriment to Bryce's development, he's not a diva in the way a Diggs or Tyreek is.  Yes, he was visibly upset last year with their young QB's after Kyler went down, but it was because they were throwing garbage passes his way, something Bryce wouldn't be doing.

The the reasons he wasn't signed, he doesn't want to be here and we dont need him.  End of discussion. 

[DJ feed me moore]

48 minutes ago, Jackie Lee said:

 

it moved

[4Corners]

Jmac

more like JWhack 

[tukafan21]

54 minutes ago, Jackie Lee said:

 

BTW... Am I the only one who wouldn't play Chark week 1 even if he is "ready" to go?

Pretty sure I saw today that he wasn't actually practicing as much as just back on the practice field, but still doing rehab type of work only.  

I'd rather be missing him for week 1 than risk a re-injury that will keep him out for multiple weeks after that.  

Hamstrings and high ankle sprains are two injuries that really tend to linger and keep popping up, rather give it an extra week of recovery with someone with either of those injuries, particularly when it's to start the season.  If it's mid season and a must win type of game, sure, play them, but I'd rather him miss week 1 and be available full go in week 2 than have him in week 1 and then possibly miss the next few weeks.

[jtm]

Players seem to get hurt less in a contract year when they are chasing a bigger pay day.  I'd be willing to bet that either Chark or TMJ stay healthy this year.    

[tukafan21]

6 minutes ago, jtm said:

Players seem to get hurt less in a contract year when they are chasing a bigger pay day.  I'd be willing to bet that either Chark or TMJ stay healthy this year.    

I mean, Chark was in a contract year each of his last 2 seasons and missed 13 and 6 games in each of those two years, so................

[jtm]

6 minutes ago, tukafan21 said:

I mean, Chark was in a contract year each of his last 2 seasons and missed 13 and 6 games in each of those two years, so................

Okay my money is on TMJ to stay healthy then . . . haha. 

[WUnderhill]

Yeah they should have signed Justin Jefferson /s

The team did what it could. They drafted the best WR on their board with their highest pick after #1, signed two former pro bowl WRs in FA, a pass catching TE, and have a 3rd year 2nd round WR they’re high on. I’m not sure what else people want. The only option I’ve seen people talk about is Hopkins, but we really have no idea whether the team looked into him or not and whether he would have considered us (though his public comments suggest not.) People act like free agents just have no say in where they will go and the Panthers get first dibs on every player they want. If you want to say signing Chark was a mistake then why don’t you fill me in on all the great alternatives.

[pantherclaw]

1 hour ago, tukafan21 said:

Yes, I said it was a mistake the second we signed him, he's far too injury prone to make him our top WR option for a rookie QB.  

No problem with the player himself when he's on the field, but the problem is he's never been able to stay on the field.  If he was already on the team, so be it, but to sign him as our #1 outside WR was a big mistake.

Your skewed perception has been addressed. Just because you refuse to accept reality, doesn't mean your perspective is any more correct than it was the first time. 

[panthers320]

13 minutes ago, WUnderhill said:

Yeah they should have signed Justin Jefferson /s

The team did what it could. They drafted the best WR on their board with their highest pick after #1, signed two former pro bowl WRs in FA, a pass catching TE, and have a 3rd year 2nd round WR they’re high on. I’m not sure what else people want. The only option I’ve seen people talk about is Hopkins, but we really have no idea whether the team looked into him or not and whether he would have considered us (though his public comments suggest not.) People act like free agents just have no say in where they will go and the Panthers get first dibs on every player they want. If you want to say signing Chark was a mistake then why don’t you fill me in on all the great alternatives.

Here is a list of WR FA from this year. Remember Hopkins wasnt released until after the draft too so he wasnt available at the start of FA. Not many great options out there. I still like Chark based on contract/potential even if he misses a few games.