DJ Johnson

[NAS]

19 minutes ago, kungfoodude said:

It was basically a Hurney move. Fitterer hasn't established the Hurney track record so I can forgive him for whiffing(if he does) on a guy like Johnson. You just don't want to see that offseason after offseason like Hurney was known for.

 

When we trade away so much draft capital, we can’t afford to draft prospects, let alone trade up for them

[tukafan21]

6 hours ago, jayflip said:

He's a project. I don't prefer drafting projects in the 3rd, especially trading up for em. But we'll see. 
 

TE wasn't a need with Hurst, Thomas and Tommy. 
 

Edge was (still is). Panic move, but it is what it is and we'll just have to see if he starts clicking in year 2. This year will be a bench year for him. Maybe even a mystery injury trip to the IR, as the two undrafted edges seem to be making more initial noise. 

Except he'd be a project who also would be an instant contributor, that's rare to find, I wasn't happy that we didn't take him when we could.

His blocking will put him on the field immediately as essentially an extra OL, they've said he's absolutely dominated the Steelers defense in camp in the run game already and he always was talked about that way in the pre-draft process.

I think his upside at how much of a mismatch he could end up in the passing game was way too great to pass on him when we did, seeing as he'd have immediately got on the field both as a run blocker and as an extra blocker in the passing game to help ensure Bryce stays upright.

[Mr Mojo Risin]

6 hours ago, LinvilleGorge said:

Hated the pick. I hope he proves me wrong.

But I'm always going to be all the way out on 24 year old rookies who are still being drafted as raw prospects because they bounced from position to position in college with their program desperately finding a spot where maybe the athletic traits would click.

To be fair in the grand scheme of things a 24 year old rookie isnt the worst thing in the world. We just need him to hit a window where he's a solid -> good level starter for us for about 4-5 seasons that seems to be about our average on DEs. Even if it takes him a couple seasons to hit that window lets say by age 26/27.

 

Lets take a look at two rotational players that played for us and ended up turning into solid starters for 4-5 years.

Charles Johnson was a 21 year old rookie and took about 3 seasons for him to come into his own (age 24 season) he contributed at a pretty good level for us for about 5 seasons (age 28) and then he fell off.

Mario Addison was a 23 or 24 year old rookie as well. He didn't come into his own as a starter until his age 29 season. Up until this season he was a solid rotational piece at best. He hit his window around age 29 (5 seasons in the NFL up to this point) and lasted at that level for about 4 years until he was 32.

 

Hopefully it doesn't take that long for him to develop into that 4-5 season window with this coaching staff (no guarantee he ever hits a window where he's a solid starter) but they definitely saw something in this kid to trade up for him. Praying it pays off for us.

Edited August 6, 2023 by Mr Mojo Risin

[LinvilleGorge]

51 minutes ago, Mr Mojo Risin said:

To be fair in the grand scheme of things a 24 year old rookie isnt the worst thing in the world. We just need him to hit a window where he's a solid -> good level starter for us for about 4-5 seasons that seems to be about our average on DEs. Even if it takes him a couple seasons to hit that window lets say by age 26/27.

 

Lets take a look at two rotational players that played for us and ended up turning into solid starters for 4-5 years.

Charles Johnson was a 21 year old rookie and took about 3 seasons for him to come into his own (age 24 season) he contributed at a pretty good level for us for about 5 seasons (age 28) and then he fell off.

Mario Addison was a 23 or 24 year old rookie as well. He didn't come into his own as a starter until his age 29 season. Up until this season he was a solid rotational piece at best. He hit his window around age 29 (5 seasons in the NFL up to this point) and lasted at that level for about 4 years until he was 32.

 

Hopefully it doesn't take that long for him to develop into that 4-5 season window with this coaching staff (no guarantee he ever hits a window where he's a solid starter) but they definitely saw something in this kid to trade up for him. Praying it pays off for us.

24 year old rookies shouldn't still be considered raw prospects.

Yeah, Addison finally came into his own... with his 5th NFL team. Good for us. Didn't mean much for the team that drafted him. If Johnson takes a similar path the end result will still be a failed draft pick by us. Addison had more sacks in his final college season than Johnson had in his career. He went from DE to TE to LB. They were moving him all over the place trying to find a spot where his athletic talents could make an impact and it just never really happened.

[Mr Mojo Risin]

13 minutes ago, LinvilleGorge said:

24 year old rookies shouldn't still be considered raw prospects.

Yeah, Addison finally came into his own... with his 5th NFL team. Good for us. Didn't mean much for the team that drafted him. If Johnson takes a similar path the end result will still be a failed draft pick by us. Addison had more sacks in his final college season than Johnson had in his career. He went from DE to TE to LB. They were moving him all over the place trying to find a spot where his athletic talents could make an impact and it just never really happened.

Its hard to predict how precisely an NFL career will end up going for any player. The only correlation I was trying to draw was that even though he's 24 its not like we need 10+ pro bowl years out of the guy. We just need some good/solid starter potential for about 4 or 5 years after he develops (hopefully for us and not another team) and he will have earned his draft slot.

[Panthers Fan 69]

9 hours ago, jayflip said:

He's a project. I don't prefer drafting projects in the 3rd, especially trading up for em. But we'll see. 
 

TE wasn't a need with Hurst, Thomas and Tommy. 
 

Edge was (still is). Panic move, but it is what it is and we'll just have to see if he starts clicking in year 2. This year will be a bench year for him. Maybe even a mystery injury trip to the IR, as the two undrafted edges seem to be making more initial noise. 

Thomas and Tremble ain’t it man. If hurst was that good he wouldn’t keep bouncing around.  We should have taken that TE. 

[LinvilleGorge]

2 minutes ago, Mr Mojo Risin said:

Its hard to predict how precisely an NFL career will end up going for any player. The only correlation I was trying to draw was that even though he's 24 its not like we need 10+ pro bowl years out of the guy. We just need some good/solid starter potential for about 4 or 5 years after he develops (hopefully for us and not another team) and he will have earned his draft slot.

Yeah, the draft is definitely a crap shoot. There will always be steals and busts in every draft class. All in saying is that I'd rather not draft older prospects who are still raw with premium picks. We eventually spent a 3rd and a 4th to draft Johnson. If I'm being honest, a single 5th would've probably been the ceiling of what I'd been willing to spend.

Like I said, hope he proves me wrong. No one will be happier than me if he does.

[Mr Mojo Risin]

29 minutes ago, LinvilleGorge said:

Yeah, the draft is definitely a crap shoot. There will always be steals and busts in every draft class. All in saying is that I'd rather not draft older prospects who are still raw with premium picks. We eventually spent a 3rd and a 4th to draft Johnson. If I'm being honest, a single 5th would've probably been the ceiling of what I'd been willing to spend.

Like I said, hope he proves me wrong. No one will be happier than me if he does.

Totally understand I ultimately feel the same way

[top dawg]

Well, this thread is surprising...

It's simply way too early to even be trying to draw any conclusions about either player. 

[kungfoodude]

10 hours ago, NAS said:

When we trade away so much draft capital, we can’t afford to draft prospects, let alone trade up for them

Yeah, I wasn't a fan of the move at the time and still am not a fan. 

You never know, maybe he pans out. If not, hopefully Fitterer will be smart enough to learn from it unlike Hurney.

[WUnderhill]

I thought we already went through all this back when the draft happened?

[PantherFanInPhilly]

Forgot where/who (so take it with a grain of salt), but I saw on Twitter yesterday someone mention they'd heard from multiple ppl that he's looking pretty bad out there so far. Hopefully he turns out decent enough. 

[Htarnation4.0]

19 hours ago, LinvilleGorge said:

Hated the pick. I hope he proves me wrong.

But I'm always going to be all the way out on 24 year old rookies who are still being drafted as raw prospects because they bounced from position to position in college with their program desperately finding a spot where maybe the athletic traits would click.

 

[45catfan]

Whether the rookie will be a bust is yet to be seen, but one thing is clear, he's not ready now.  That's why we need to sign a stop gap like Justin Houston.  Yes, he's 34, but as a rotational guy, that's completely okay.   We did the same with Jared Allen and worked out fine.

Haynes is too iffy for me.  He's stays dinged up and is undersized that results in him being unable to shed blocks.  He should thrive in this system, but HAS to stay clean.  That's where a proven vet can come in on a 1-2 year deal and give us the time to find/develop that guy opposite Burns.