The Panther's front office doesn't think winning year after year is important.

[Fiz]

You yourself oh disciple of Krugman

you wouldn't know who I'm a disciple of and it's certainly not a sweat shop apologist.

Because of that it can/does, lower the INCENTIVE to win year after year. Why worry about being super competitive when we can slightly sand bag or just not be that urgent to win every year.

you're painting with very broad strokes about a huge number of individuals with unique motivations and desires, individuals you know nothing about, when evidence suggests otherwise.

dumb stupid poo

We can agree to not so much disagree, but simply we look at the glass a bit differently. For me not half full or empty, but who made the glass and how much can it hold for me.

listen you're trying to apply a really broad, stupid, idea that can't be disproved to cover your ass instead of trying to address all the specific examples I gave that eat your OPs lunch.

[rayzor]

I tend to agree. I think you are taking the op and running to the conspiracy bank.

All I'm saying is per my observation, the Panthers give ME the IMPRESSION that winning EVERY year isn't that important.

That's all I'm saying.

lol... what?

dude, i've just been going on what you wrote. now you are saying i'm paying too much attention to what you wrote but not what you meant?

let me get this straight.

you are saying that the panthers aren't dedicated to winning every year, right?

to back up what you said you used their supposed desire to tank every other year so that they could have an easier schedule. i showed that was impossible since the schedule was predetermined years ago.

Kevin Greene mentioned the spending wisely.

Somebody the other day mentioned how the Cardinals despite being a few plays from being the Super Bowl winner still made some pretty big changes.

The Panthers did not.

this also is a wrong assertion. they only brought in 6 "veteran" players in the offseason. two aren't even with the team anymore. the only one that has had any kind of impact is bryant mcfadden who signed a two year deal compared to the rest who only signed one year deals.

they didn't do much in the way of re-signing people either. they only re-signed a few and only two of them were significant deals at all. warner signed a two year deal and adrian wilson signed a five year deal. the rest of the handful of restructurings were only one year deals. they have 20+ contracts that are ending after this year, many of them to key players. having an uncapped year might keep the damage from allowing something like that to a minimum but still they very well could lose some well established vets next year. my guess is that they put things off last year in anticipation of 2010 being uncapped. regardless, they didn't do much last offseason. they did just enough to get them through the year.

Add to that the contracts of Jake/Pep.

Like they teach when you deal with drug addicts, don't believe what they say, believe what they do.

If the Panthers have convinced you that they are committed to winning every year than maybe THAT'S the conspiracy we need to look at.

i don't like a lot of things the team does but, again, this is just one of those things that is just off the deep end.

i don't expect much of this to be accepted by you because you already made up your mind that they aren't committed to winning every year and are willing to make up all kinds of scenarios, regardless of credible evidence, to back that up.

keep trying, though. it's pretty fun to read.

[pstall]

you wouldn't know who I'm a disciple of and it's certainly not a sweat shop apologist.

you're painting with very broad strokes about a huge number of individuals with unique motivations and desires, individuals you know nothing about, when evidence suggests otherwise.

listen you're trying to apply a really broad, stupid, idea that can't be disproved to cover your ass instead of trying to address all the specific examples I gave that eat your OPs lunch.

please..stop fapping to your own photo..its creepy.

fiz i know its extremely difficult for you to give any credit of any sorts. Thats defintely not what I'm after here.

The thrust of the point is this. If you knew no matter what you did on the job, you were still going to get paid that it would not affect your motivation or incentive, then hats off to you.

and with equal, what was that nice scrabble word you used...uh..veracity, you too deflect a counter point.

Load up on where you think your argument fits, minimize the potential where its wrong and hope the other person doesn't try to outlast you.

But despite our econ saber rattling, this team is becoming the Washington Wizards of the NFL. Just enough of interest to keep it going.

[Fiz]

i think pstall is trolling us

there's your out pstall. go

[rayzor]

minor fix - 3 year rotation

well, every four years you'll have played every team in the nfl at least once, for the most party completely independent of influence from your record the preceding season.

this.

[Fiz]

The thrust of the point is this. If you knew no matter what you did on the job, you were still going to get paid that it would not affect your motivation or incentive, then hats off to you.

you're assuming you know the desire and motivations of the people in charge. I can easily point out every single year when the panthers have made serious attempts to win the following season, so basically all you're left with is this little gay truism.

and with equal, what was that nice scrabble word you used...uh..veracity, you too deflect a counter point.

what the fug are you talking about? which counter point? the one I'm addressing for about the third time in this response?

[Fiz]

i wish pstall would go back to trying to present concrete examples instead of trying to fit the laffer curve into Jerry Richardson's box

[Brooklyn Bully]

If JR was ok with being good every other season, I'd want him out of here faster than I want Fox and Jake to be gone.

[House]

OK, Pstall I will swing to the Dark Side with you if you can answer just two questions coherently without including a bunch of conspiracy bs.

If this team is trying to "just keep it interesting enough" every other year, why are they constantly maxed out at the salary cap every single year?

What is the use of spending all that money if you are not even going to worry about being competitive?

Thats a pretty simple question but it is also the biggest problem with your theory. If JR was not worried about being competitive why is he spending 120 million in salary? This would qualify JR as one of the worst businessmen ever.

[pstall]

you're assuming you know the desire and motivations of the people in charge. I can easily point out every single year when the panthers have made serious attempts to win the following season, so basically all you're left with is this little gay truism.

what the f*ck are you talking about? which counter point? the one I'm addressing for about the third time in this response?

let it go man. it seems to be a much bigger deal to you than me.

you dont take the medicine you try to prescribe to others. it ain't no big freakin deal.

I agree. They have made attempts to get better/win however we may define that.

And of course NEITHER of us know the motivations of each person in charge. No kidding Matlock.

Based on last year alone, did the team show the urgency to get better or to build from last year to continue winning? As of right now I think we can both say no.

And as we stated much earlier, no way we can put in truth serum to get ALL of the people in the front office to admit one way or the other.

but per your request...i was trolling. Im a football imbecile that should run all my posts by der fiz before I post.

[Saint J]

[pstall]

OK, Pstall I will swing to the Dark Side with you if you can answer just two questions coherently without including a bunch of conspiracy bs.

If this team is trying to "just keep it interesting enough" every other year, why are they constantly maxed out at the salary cap every single year?

What is the use of spending all that money if you are not even going to worry about being competitive?

Thats a pretty simple question but it is also the biggest problem with your theory. If JR was not worried about being competitive why is he spending 120 million in salary? This would qualify JR as one of the worst businessmen ever.

Oh geez. I had a feeling this would spiral out of control.

I replied to rayzor already on the conspiracy thing. I simply said that this team gives me the impression that they are not that urgent to win year after year. That just seems to have been highlighted to me this past offseason and now as I look back seems to be clear. IMO.

That's not a conspiracy. I'm not saying they are losing on purpose or whatever but from pure dollars and cents and add the tough econ right now, that can make you do things very differently.

I hear ya on the maxed out of the cap. That to me is the traditional budget spending problem. Every company has it. If we don't spend X by the end of the year we don't get to spend that next.

Just because they are at or near max doesn't mean it was wise.

And I never said they did NOT want to be competitive. Quite the contrary. Again, my point is, based on all the conditions, there is MORE incentive for them to just do enough to maintain, while being MORE focused on a profit.

Which after a few posts with rayzor I realized I framed this the wrong way. The post should have been more about which is more important, winning or making a profit. I would say based once again on the financial surroundings, it would have to be profit.

Guys. Don't put words in my mouth or take a few comments and run to who knows where.

[Fiz]

I agree. They have made attempts to get better/win however we may define that.

despite trying to lose every other year

And of course NEITHER of us know the motivations of each person in charge. No kidding Matlock.

but you know that jerry doesn't care to win because of psl revenue

Based on last year alone, did the team show the urgency to get better or to build from last year to continue winning? As of right now I think we can both say no.

you could do that if you just forgot that they locked up their number 1 corner during the season, resigned the third ish best left tackle in the league, and then franchised a guy who they figured was the best available at his position, which I can't really disagree with.

really just three things have gone wrong this year: jake, DT injuries, and Moose getting old. everything can be traced back to that.

i was trolling. Im a football imbecile that should run all my posts by der fiz before I post.

or saint j

[rayzor]

or saint j

what? no love?