What are our chances if Williams, Moore start?

[the butch]

Aight, OP back, here's my take:

We win games on the ground, this is no surprise. We have the best running tandem in the league and I don't think anyone can doubt that. We score running the ball and playing "don't get beat deep" defense. If a team scores then so be it. But they do it slowly. Fox wants to manage the clock and that's what the ground game does. We run the ball and manage the clock and grind wins out.

However, what loses the games for us is the multiple interceptions that Delhomme has consistently put us in in past games. Well, Jake is out and Moore is in. With a collar on Moore and both our running backs playing our defense stand a chance at the ol' field position game. Why? Because even if we don't get first downs consistently, we're NOT turning the ball over.

Moore can spread the ball around effectively from what I can tell. If he can repeat it is another story. Regardless, all the cards are on the table and we know exactly what we're going to be using. Interceptions have lost us at least 3 games this year, and now we have a chance to cut them out completely with safe play calling and a dominant run game (barring any fumbles).

At the end of the day, the safe bet is the Patriots. But then again, it wouldn't be called an upset if it wasn't a safe bet, would it?

[Jaxel]

I don't know where all this Moore is average crap is coming from. He can only look that way when he's not allowed to throw, but the reality is he's put up the same stats and many "star qb's" have in their first 4 games as a starter. Honestly I think he will have a good day, and prove himself, even if we don't win..

[PantherDude]

We have ZERO chance of winning if Jake starts........a DAMN good chance of winning if Moore starts.

But what happend if we lose with Moore against them? Don't make me point the finger at you!! :thumbsup:

Jake was never really more than an avg QB.

Actually, he was more than that in the past. Like the Superbowl run & after until now. He was great the first few years until his worst season in his career this year.

The 09 Jake wasn't average.

Like we didn't know that since this year.

I think w/ Williams the offense will be fine

Fine? That a big question mark. Even with him, few times our offense wasn't fine. And not just on Jake, but others as well.

I think the defense will win or lose this game. What and who they use to defend Welker and Moss will determine if this is a game or not.

The offense could win or lose this game as well. The only way we can win is no mistake from Moore (make no INT. like he didn't against the Bucs & there should be no excuse for what he did), our defense not playing vanilla, & if Double Trouble give the Cheatriots defense a hard time.

[panthers55]

How are we gonna put up 27 points without Williams catching fire?

He will have to run the ball, catch passes out of the backfield and block well for Moore. There is no way the patriots give up 200 yards on the ground combined so it will take a good effort from everyone plus the defense will have to give us short fields and good field position. Wouldn't hurt if the defense got a pick 6 as well. 27 points is alot for our offense so we will definitely have to play a complete game.

[CRA]

He will have to run the ball, catch passes out of the backfield and block well for Moore. There is no way the patriots give up 200 yards on the ground combined so it will take a good effort from everyone plus the defense will have to give us short fields and good field position. Wouldn't hurt if the defense got a pick 6 as well. 27 points is alot for our offense so we will definitely have to play a complete game.

well, in games we have scored at least 27 points in Williams has averaged 134yards by himself.

In the 5 games Carolina has won they avg 188 yards on the ground.

to put up 27 against NE Carolina is gonna have to be near that 200 mark imo. If the ground game doesn't put up the bulk of the points up and work in I just don't see where they will come from.

[Razzy]

We have a chance if Moore starts, a better chance if Williams is back, and absolutely no chance if the playcalling doesn't change.

[OneBadassCat]

Those out routes that we called against the bucs aren't going to work this week. We ran the poo out of those.

[Davidson Deac II]

Moore will likely have a bad game in at least one of our four remaining games. He is a rookie, and will be playing some cold and hostile enviroments (New York and New England) and against two pretty good teams (Minnesota and New Orleans). I just hope Fox doesn't yank him or the fans don't get down on him to much when it happens.

Irt the original question, We have maybe a one in ten chance of winning this weekend.

[CRA]

Moore will likely have a bad game in at least one of our four remaining games. He is a rookie, and will be playing some cold and hostile enviroments (New York and New England) and against two pretty good teams (Minnesota and New Orleans). I just hope Fox doesn't yank him or the fans don't get down on him to much when it happens.

Irt the original question, We have maybe a one in ten chance of winning this weekend.

Moore isn't a rookie, he just doesn't have a lot of game reps. The fans have sat through Jake this year....it would be hard for him to a game like Philly.

[the butch]

Let's continue the debate, does Brady's sore ribs come into play at all? Like I said, Peppers is due...

[panthers55]

well, in games we have scored at least 27 points in Williams has averaged 134yards by himself.

In the 5 games Carolina has won they avg 188 yards on the ground.

to put up 27 against NE Carolina is gonna have to be near that 200 mark imo. If the ground game doesn't put up the bulk of the points up and work in I just don't see where they will come from.

Problem is that New England is only giving up 107 yards on the ground and 217 in the air. If Williams has success in the first quarter they will load the box and make us pass. That could work if Moore mixes things up and is patient with the short pass.

The secret to scoring points is having short fields so that you can score off of a 30 or 40 yard drive. Unfortunately our special teams has been little help and until lately we weren't getting more turnovers.

As for our five wins, only one team was ranked in the top 15 in rushing defense (Arizona-12th), Tampa (31st), Atlanta (23), Washington (24). And how many times have we scored 27 points? 3 times. Arizona, Tampa and Atlanta. Given Jake's issues, we surely ran alot but I think we are going to have to pass effectively and score points that way. And against New England I think we will have to as NE will make Moore beat them.

[Davidson Deac II]

Moore isn't a rookie, he just doesn't have a lot of game reps. The fans have sat through Jake this year....it would be hard for him to a game like Philly.

Yea, rookie was the wrong word. But he is very untested, especially in an enviroment like New England. That being said, if he comes thru the next four games relatively unscathed, he will definitely be battle tested.

[CRA]

Problem is that New England is only giving up 107 yards on the ground and 217 in the air. If Williams has success in the first quarter they will load the box and make us pass. That could work if Moore mixes things up and is patient with the short pass.

The secret to scoring points is having short fields so that you can score off of a 30 or 40 yard drive. Unfortunately our special teams has been little help and until lately we weren't getting more turnovers.

As for our five wins, only one team was ranked in the top 15 in rushing defense (Arizona-12th), Tampa (31st), Atlanta (23), Washington (24). And how many times have we scored 27 points? 3 times. Arizona, Tampa and Atlanta. Given Jake's issues, we surely ran alot but I am not sure we can't pass effectively or score points that way. And against New England I think we will have to.

well, Carolina is going to have to go in like they did against AZ (when they were #1 on run D). They are gonna load up from the start...they won't wait til we have success. Not with that coach and not how obvious what we have to do is.

I get what you are saying and agree.....I just don't see Carolina getting it done in the air or Fox going that way unless getting blown out. Weather could also help everything stay on the ground. If Brady has a bum rib and hurt finger + bad weather......NE might be less effective than normal (even though they are good in the snow). Carolina needs to do things and have success the way you are suggesting....but I think the only realstic things based on what we have seen is an abnormal game on the ground.

That is unless Matt Moore is better than we think......

[panthers55]

well, Carolina is going to have to go in like they did against AZ (when they were #1 on run D). They are gonna load up from the start...they won't wait til we have success. Not with that coach and not how obvious what we have to do is.

I get what you are saying and agree.....I just don't see Carolina getting it done in the air or Fox going that way unless getting blown out. Weather could also help everything stay on the ground. If Brady has a bum rib and hurt finger + bad weather......NE might be less effective than normal (even though they are good in the snow). Carolina needs to do things and have success the way you are suggesting....but I think the only realstic things based on what we have seen is an abnormal game on the ground.

That is unless Matt Moore is better than we think......

Keep in mind that we came out passing in several games this year to set up the run despite Jake's problems. Look at the first drive against Tampa last week. We ran and passed effectively. I expect us to come out throwing on Sunday unless the weather is awful.