Rotoworld blurb on Terrace Marshall: “sneaky” fantasy upside

[Jackie Lee]

Could DW take one of the last 2 spots?

 

[Khyber53]

Man, I wish I was more hopeful for our WR group but let's be real. Every single guy we've got is in a "prove it" position right now and that doesn't bode well.

TMJ is right now going into his third season after being a highly touted draftee. His first two seasons were lackluster at best and even with coaching aside, he hasn't even flashed brilliance much. He's really in a make it or take it home situation this year and his career really hangs in the balance. 

Thielen was just jettisoned from the Vikings for basically being too old, and that's after having a heck of a long career there, as well as being a local legend. He's got a lot to prove that he still has the "it" factor and that he can still make the hard catches and put his excellent route running to good use. He has to somehow prove the Vikings coaching staff wrong in a new town, with a new coach and a brand new rookie QB. That's a mighty tall order to fill.

Chark was lt go at the end of the 2022 season by the Lions after being there for a year on a "prove it" deal. He had 502 yards and three touchdowns there and it just wasn't enough to keep him on the roster. He's just 27, so there's still some hope, but were the Lions right about him? He's on the hook here for $5, but is 500 yds and 3 TDs really worth that much?

Mingo is a rookie, second rounder with some good stats and a lot of praise for his college game. Same as TMJ when he was drafted here. Still, he's a rookie, so it is a definite "prove it"  situation for him, but with some leeway due to how new he will be to the pro game. I'm really hopeful for him, but reality says that he's got a hill to climb this year.

Shenault's looking at a prove it year, too. He's got to prove that he can make catches and be something more than just a gadget player whho can moonlight as a running back. It's neat, but can you show us something else, kid?

Damiere Byrd. Well. Good luck.

We can look at these guys and swoon in the preseason, but truth be told, we need at least two of these guys to  prove that they can be starters in this league at this point in their careers. I don't think any of them can be counted on to be superstars, but maybe they can work something up amongst the group.

If I were an opposing secondary coach with these guys up next on my schedule, I don't think I'd be losing much sleep over it. 

Gosh, I hope I am wrong.

[mrcompletely11]

1 minute ago, Khyber53 said:

Man, I wish I was more hopeful for our WR group but let's be real. Every single guy we've got is in a "prove it" position right now and that doesn't bode well.

TMJ is right now going into his third season after being a highly touted draftee. His first two seasons were lackluster at best and even with coaching aside, he hasn't even flashed brilliance much. He's really in a make it or take it home situation this year and his career really hangs in the balance. 

Thielen was just jettisoned from the Vikings for basically being too old, and that's after having a heck of a long career there, as well as being a local legend. He's got a lot to prove that he still has the "it" factor and that he can still make the hard catches and put his excellent route running to good use. He has to somehow prove the Vikings coaching staff wrong in a new town, with a new coach and a brand new rookie QB. That's a mighty tall order to fill.

Chark was lt go at the end of the 2022 season by the Lions after being there for a year on a "prove it" deal. He had 502 yards and three touchdowns there and it just wasn't enough to keep him on the roster. He's just 27, so there's still some hope, but were the Lions right about him? He's on the hook here for $5, but is 500 yds and 3 TDs really worth that much?

Mingo is a rookie, second rounder with some good stats and a lot of praise for his college game. Same as TMJ when he was drafted here. Still, he's a rookie, so it is a definite "prove it"  situation for him, but with some leeway due to how new he will be to the pro game. I'm really hopeful for him, but reality says that he's got a hill to climb this year.

Shenault's looking at a prove it year, too. He's got to prove that he can make catches and be something more than just a gadget player whho can moonlight as a running back. It's neat, but can you show us something else, kid?

Damiere Byrd. Well. Good luck.

We can look at these guys and swoon in the preseason, but truth be told, we need at least two of these guys to  prove that they can be starters in this league at this point in their careers. I don't think any of them can be counted on to be superstars, but maybe they can work something up amongst the group.

If I were an opposing secondary coach with these guys up next on my schedule, I don't think I'd be losing much sleep over it. 

Gosh, I hope I am wrong.

1. Hopefully TMJ is past his injury stigma and was held back by shoddy qb play and rhule

2. Adam T probably shouldnt be expected to do much of anything outside of leading by example.  33 is old by wr standards

3. Chark is coming off surgery and gets hurt a lot.  Anything we get from him is a bonus IMO

4. With the steriod like development of young wrs these days it wouldnt surprise me to see him make some headway throughout the year and starting by the end

5. Not a fan of Shenault as a wr.  To bulky and not much juice to his game

 

[MasterAwesome]

10 minutes ago, Khyber53 said:

Man, I wish I was more hopeful for our WR group but let's be real. Every single guy we've got is in a "prove it" position right now and that doesn't bode well.

TMJ is right now going into his third season after being a highly touted draftee. His first two seasons were lackluster at best and even with coaching aside, he hasn't even flashed brilliance much. He's really in a make it or take it home situation this year and his career really hangs in the balance. 

Thielen was just jettisoned from the Vikings for basically being too old, and that's after having a heck of a long career there, as well as being a local legend. He's got a lot to prove that he still has the "it" factor and that he can still make the hard catches and put his excellent route running to good use. He has to somehow prove the Vikings coaching staff wrong in a new town, with a new coach and a brand new rookie QB. That's a mighty tall order to fill.

Chark was lt go at the end of the 2022 season by the Lions after being there for a year on a "prove it" deal. He had 502 yards and three touchdowns there and it just wasn't enough to keep him on the roster. He's just 27, so there's still some hope, but were the Lions right about him? He's on the hook here for $5, but is 500 yds and 3 TDs really worth that much?

Mingo is a rookie, second rounder with some good stats and a lot of praise for his college game. Same as TMJ when he was drafted here. Still, he's a rookie, so it is a definite "prove it"  situation for him, but with some leeway due to how new he will be to the pro game. I'm really hopeful for him, but reality says that he's got a hill to climb this year.

Shenault's looking at a prove it year, too. He's got to prove that he can make catches and be something more than just a gadget player whho can moonlight as a running back. It's neat, but can you show us something else, kid?

Damiere Byrd. Well. Good luck.

We can look at these guys and swoon in the preseason, but truth be told, we need at least two of these guys to  prove that they can be starters in this league at this point in their careers. I don't think any of them can be counted on to be superstars, but maybe they can work something up amongst the group.

If I were an opposing secondary coach with these guys up next on my schedule, I don't think I'd be losing much sleep over it. 

Gosh, I hope I am wrong.

I generally see a lot of players in a "prove it" position as a positive.  These are gonna be guys with a chip on their shoulder who have extra motivation to produce as their future prospects are dwindling.  That's why you see a fair amount of players who overachieve during contract years.

[ECHornet]

3 hours ago, CamWhoaaCam said:

If he's good then we don't have to worry about that problem do we?

 

 

It’s not worrisome even if he’s not. 5mil is nothing and worth the risk. 

[poundaway]

We'll see who the WR1 is. 

The thoughts on the D resonated with me.  We are "a couple injuries away from nightmare status".

The D was NOT good last year.  We invested little in it, player wise, and are moving to a new scheme.  We have an offensive minded HC so that is what is getting the love.  D feels like an after thought at ATM.

[frankw]

31 minutes ago, poundaway said:

We'll see who the WR1 is. 

The thoughts on the D resonated with me.  We are "a couple injuries away from nightmare status".

The D was NOT good last year.  We invested little in it, player wise, and are moving to a new scheme.  We have an offensive minded HC so that is what is getting the love.  D feels like an after thought at ATM.

Brian Burns will soon be one of the league's highest paid defenders. And we've paid our new DC who was highly sought after handsomely to oversee the group. That doesn't really sound like an afterthought. I do think the pendulum is swinging more balanced as this team has heavily leaned into a defensive identity over many years. But let's be blunt. What do we have to show for it? Change is not a bad thing. We'll have to see how this approach looks big picture in a year or two.

Edited June 1, 2023 by frankw

[poundaway]

3 hours ago, Icege said:

There was 1,442 total snaps under Matt Rhule's regime and 723 under Steve Wilks'. TMJ was on the field for 30.6% of the snaps under Rhule, 81.3% under Wilks. It is very much so accurate to state that TMJ was "hardly on the field" while Rhule was running the team. 

TMJ's averages per game from his 15 games under Rhule:

• 29.4 snaps (441 total)
• 19.8 routes  (297 total)
• 2.3 targets (34 total)

TMJ's averages per game from his 12 games under Wilks':

• 49 snaps (588 total)
• 22 routes (264 total)
• 3.6 targets (43 total)

To put those numbers into perspective, here are the averages for the other two WRs mentioned under Rhule:

Chosen (22 games)

• 53.9 snaps (1185 total)
• 36.9 routes (812 total)
• 5 targets (110 total)

DJ (20 games)

• 55.6 snaps (1112 total)
• 36.2 routes (723 total)
• 9.1 targets (182 total)

I agree that the coaching and QB situation were a dumpster fire.  

A rookie from the bottom of the second round, coming off an injury in college that sidelined him an entire year where he was WR#3 to begin with, is not going to be a barn burner and take snaps from two 1k NFL WRs out of the gate in a season that itself had  injury.    He was going to be eased in on any team, even DJ's worst season was his rookie and  his yards jumped 50% from rookie to sophomore season.

TMJ's drop rate was over 6% last year.  Hopefully that will improve.

 

[poundaway]

15 minutes ago, frankw said:

Brian Burns will soon be one of the league's highest paid defenders. And we've paid our new DC who was highly sought after handsomely to oversee the group. That doesn't really sound like an afterthought. I do think the pendulum is swinging more balanced as this team has heavily leaned into a defensive identity over many years. But let's be blunt. What do we have to show for it? Change is not a bad thing. We'll have to see how this approach looks big picture in a year or two.

As I said, we have invested little in the D "player-wise".  Yes Evero was a great grab.  We will see how much of Denver D was the players and how much was Evero.

We actually haven't signed a contract with Burns. As I said.  Afterthought. The Brian Burns contract should have been sewed up by now.  He now holds all the cards as we passed up attractive offers.

We didn't draft D until the bottom of the 3rd for, what many analysts and fans here consider to be an older player who "needs development".



 

[stratocatter]

I am expecting what Tepper meant by spending on the D (while at the draft) had to do with paying Burns.  
I don’t understand the strong optimism for the D either, seems like some people are expecting the Steel Curtain. In.the.first.year.of transitioning to the 3-4.
Everyone seems to think these players are interchangeable in some of these positions. I am very wary of what we have inside up the middle, 1st and 2nd level, both. And then the CBs are questionable too, depth wise. At least we probably get to play Baker once. 

[CamWhoaaCam]

2 hours ago, ECHornet said:

It’s not worrisome even if he’s not. 5mil is nothing and worth the risk. 

5 mil is nothing let me borrow 2 mil rich guy...

[ECHornet]

5 hours ago, CamWhoaaCam said:

5 mil is nothing let me borrow 2 mil rich guy...

It’s all relative. I figured that was obvious. 

[WhoKnows]

11 hours ago, Icege said:

There was 1,442 total snaps under Matt Rhule's regime and 723 under Steve Wilks'. TMJ was on the field for 30.6% of the snaps under Rhule, 81.3% under Wilks. It is very much so accurate to state that TMJ was "hardly on the field" while Rhule was running the team. 

TMJ's averages per game from his 15 games under Rhule:

• 29.4 snaps (441 total)
• 19.8 routes  (297 total)
• 2.3 targets (34 total)

TMJ's averages per game from his 12 games under Wilks':

• 49 snaps (588 total)
• 22 routes (264 total)
• 3.6 targets (43 total)

To put those numbers into perspective, here are the averages for the other two WRs mentioned under Rhule:

Chosen (22 games)

• 53.9 snaps (1185 total)
• 36.9 routes (812 total)
• 5 targets (110 total)

DJ (20 games)

• 55.6 snaps (1112 total)
• 36.2 routes (723 total)
• 9.1 targets (182 total)

Under Rhule, TMJ was WR3, behind DJ and Anderson and he played 1 actual game under Rhule in 2022. Anderson was traded one game after Rhule was gone. Who cares, that wasn’t the assertion. Also, your 30% under Rhule is very misleading because of all the missed games. Go to PFR and in 2021, it’s says he got 48% of snaps but he missed 4 games. In 2022, he only had one full game under Rhule.

When TMJ was in the game, he got WR3 snaps (just under half) with Anderson and when he was WR2 without Anderson he got 85%+ except for 1 game. That’s plenty of snaps and not much production. He was playing almost the entire game under Wilks yet he had 3 or less targets in 8 of 11 games.

I stand on my thought that Mingo has a much better shot IMHO to emerge as the top WR than Marshall.

[WhoKnows]

8 hours ago, poundaway said:

We'll see who the WR1 is. 

The thoughts on the D resonated with me.  We are "a couple injuries away from nightmare status".

The D was NOT good last year.  We invested little in it, player wise, and are moving to a new scheme.  We have an offensive minded HC so that is what is getting the love.  D feels like an after thought at ATM.

I got smacked for saying injuries could happen but man, that’s got me worried as heck. We are paper thin and last year we were relatively healthy. We had one key injury at the end of the year with Horn and our pass D fell apart. Our pass rush falls apart without Burns. Our interior DL sucks without Brown. We are one injury away at tackle from Erving being a starter. We already are thin with Corbetts injury and then you are Mays and Erving away from guys I’ve never heard of starting.