Jonathan Mingo

[MHS831]

About trading Moore:
The focus is on spreading the ball around, referring to Bryce as a "point guard."  If multiple players get touches, it takes the focus off one guy--and the need to have a #1 guy.  A lot of secondaries adjust around the #1 CB, #1 WR relationship--theorizing that they will have your #2 or #3 beat them.  Without a clearly identified #1 but with several accomplished, talented WRs on the field, our #2 and #3 will beat them.  I am guessing this leads to more zone?  Seriously---in the past, we have had 3 good WRs--2 good ones and a third down, possession WR.  Now, we have 5 very good WRs (in theory at this point) Chark, Thielen, Shenault, Mingo, Marshall.  Expect to see improvement from Shenault and Marshall.  I honestly think this group could be very special by the end of 2023.

Hurst is a huge factor in this offense.  Last season, our TEs were known for blocking---Thomas and Tremble.  Now we have more of an offensive threat.

[Ricky Prickles]

16 minutes ago, WhoKnows said:

I think we did. We got who we wanted so if they work out, no big deal but it seems that we did overdraft our day 2 guys. Sometimes you can’t trade back and sometimes you panic a bit.

It all comes down to Young. He’s the make or break. I think we had a decent FA run and I like Young a lot. Concerned as most are, but without knowing his true size, loved him as just a football player.

I’m not really impressed with Fitterer as a drafter. 2021 class was honestly bad. 2022 was not good either. Giving up extra picks all over the place due to trades and trade ups, like Corrall and Johnson this year. The fact that we are looking at XFL guys to fill the roster shows you how much draft capital we’ve given up (ignoring Young).

Again, Young makes the mistakes go away but we have to put some weapons around him. Hopefully, Mingo is more Samuel/Moore than Shenault.

I dont think we have seen the best of Shenault yet. Maybe I am wishful thinking (probably am) but I feel like he has a ton of untapped upside to give us.

[ForJimmy]

13 minutes ago, MHS831 said:

About trading Moore:
The focus is on spreading the ball around, referring to Bryce as a "point guard."  If multiple players get touches, it takes the focus off one guy--and the need to have a #1 guy.  A lot of secondaries adjust around the #1 CB, #1 WR relationship--theorizing that they will have your #2 or #3 beat them.  Without a clearly identified #1 but with several accomplished, talented WRs on the field, our #2 and #3 will beat them.  I am guessing this leads to more zone?  Seriously---in the past, we have had 3 good WRs--2 good ones and a third down, possession WR.  Now, we have 5 very good WRs (in theory at this point) Chark, Thielen, Shenault, Mingo, Marshall.  Expect to see improvement from Shenault and Marshall.  I honestly think this group could be very special by the end of 2023.

Hurst is a huge factor in this offense.  Last season, our TEs were known for blocking---Thomas and Tremble.  Now we have more of an offensive threat.

Agreed. Between Thielen, Chark, Hurst, and TMJ/Mingo someone will have a mismatch and Young is the type of QB to find it and exploit it. Sanders has good hands as well for a RB. There isn’t 1 true elite weapon, but several solid ones which might make it harder for the defense to predict the offense honestly. 

[WhoKnows]

22 minutes ago, Ricky Prickles said:

I dont think we have seen the best of Shenault yet. Maybe I am wishful thinking (probably am) but I feel like he has a ton of untapped upside to give us.

If Minho is compared to Deebo then I don’t see both Shenault and Minho thriving. With Thielen, Chark (if healthy), Hurst and a running game, there might not be much to go around for Mingo, TMJ and Shenault. One might step up but certainly not going to be two or all three unless Thielen/Chark get hurt. Don’t forget that Sanders had 50 receptions his rookie year. Philly didn’t use him as much in the passing game the past few seasons but he’s miles (no pun intended) better as a receiver than Foreman and Hubbard.

[hepcat]

47 minutes ago, WhoKnows said:

I think we did. We got who we wanted so if they work out, no big deal but it seems that we did overdraft our day 2 guys. Sometimes you can’t trade back and sometimes you panic a bit.

It all comes down to Young. He’s the make or break. I think we had a decent FA run and I like Young a lot. Concerned as most are, but without knowing his true size, loved him as just a football player.

I’m not really impressed with Fitterer as a drafter. 2021 class was honestly bad. 2022 was not good either. Giving up extra picks all over the place due to trades and trade ups, like Corrall and Johnson this year. The fact that we are looking at XFL guys to fill the roster shows you how much draft capital we’ve given up (ignoring Young).

Again, Young makes the mistakes go away but we have to put some weapons around him. Hopefully, Mingo is more Samuel/Moore than Shenault.

I agree that if they hit on Young the rest of the class won't matter just like the 2011 draft class was maybe the worst in Panthers history if you remove Cam Newton. 

And I agree that Fitterer and co have not been great at drafting. Disagree that 2021 was bad, but it wasn't good either. Most of their draft picks in 2021 have at least played in games and made contributions. Brady Christensen was probably the biggest win out of the group if he keeps developing into a starting guard. But it all goes back to passing on Justin Fields which is how we got where we are today. 

And in 2022 yea trading up for Corral was a desperate move probably perpetuated by Matt Rhule but since we saw Fitterer trade up again for DJ Johnson I don't think we can put his trade up tendencies on Rhule. Fitterer is just impatient and will give up future resources if he likes a guy. It's not a good trait to have for a team that isn't competitive yet and probably needs to be drafting with a wider swatch to find contributors than targeting specific guys on an already loaded roster. 

[rebelrouser]

28 minutes ago, hepcat said:

And in 2022 yea trading up for Corral was a desperate move probably perpetuated by Matt Rhule

Why would Matt Rhule want a developmental qb in his make or break firing year? Someone told him to make that pick. Also, why does Mingo have trouble with vertical separation when he runs a 4.46 40? I agree that Fitterer is a poor drafter with a lot of waster during his tenure.  

[pantherclaw]

1 hour ago, WhoKnows said:

I think we did. We got who we wanted so if they work out, no big deal but it seems that we did overdraft our day 2 guys. Sometimes you can’t trade back and sometimes you panic a bit.

It all comes down to Young. He’s the make or break. I think we had a decent FA run and I like Young a lot. Concerned as most are, but without knowing his true size, loved him as just a football player.

I’m not really impressed with Fitterer as a drafter. 2021 class was honestly bad. 2022 was not good either. Giving up extra picks all over the place due to trades and trade ups, like Corrall and Johnson this year. The fact that we are looking at XFL guys to fill the roster shows you how much draft capital we’ve given up (ignoring Young).

Again, Young makes the mistakes go away but we have to put some weapons around him. Hopefully, Mingo is more Samuel/Moore than Shenault.

Perspective is everything. 

Our front office, including Fitt, only drafted guys that was on their board. Which was a total of 145 players. 

Every single player drafted was one the scouts, and coaches agreed upon and wanted. 

I would like to pause one moment to drop this truth bomb, the entire draft is a gamble.  

Our staff when and got as many of the players that was on THEIR board. 

Not somebody else board. Not some wannt be expert that is behind a fuging desk. 

So not sure how anyone can sit here, weeks after the draft, and claim they made mistakes. Even if some of the picks don't work out, that is the chance every team makes when drafting players. 

While I don't expect all these players.to be stars, it's still not mistakes. It's playing the game,Gamble. 

Welcome to the NFL. 

[WhoKnows]

25 minutes ago, pantherclaw said:

Perspective is everything. 

Our front office, including Fitt, only drafted guys that was on their board. Which was a total of 145 players. 

Every single player drafted was one the scouts, and coaches agreed upon and wanted. 

I would like to pause one moment to drop this truth bomb, the entire draft is a gamble.  

Our staff when and got as many of the players that was on THEIR board. 

Not somebody else board. Not some wannt be expert that is behind a fuging desk. 

So not sure how anyone can sit here, weeks after the draft, and claim they made mistakes. Even if some of the picks don't work out, that is the chance every team makes when drafting players. 

While I don't expect all these players.to be stars, it's still not mistakes. It's playing the game,Gamble. 

Welcome to the NFL. 

The 2021/2022 drafts so far leave a lot to be desired. It’s not a gamble, that’s where you are wrong. It’s an educated risk that Fitt hasn’t been good at yet.

I’ll drop a truth bomb on you, the FO you think is perfect isn’t. You may want to calm down a bit too. Getting way too agitated when people question the team’s actions.

Scary how some people like you act like the team can do no wrong and that fans questioning them is forbidden.

Sorry man, but there’s been a ton of better picks made by this community over the past 5 years than Hurney and Fitterer. Feel free to point out the day 2/day 3 stars that have impacted the team since Hurney 2.0 and Fitt have been drafting. I see Chinn and that’s about it. Maybe their board needs work because when we were at our best, we had a lot of day 2/3 impact players.

[hepcat]

38 minutes ago, rebelrouser said:

Why would Matt Rhule want a developmental qb in his make or break firing year? Someone told him to make that pick. Also, why does Mingo have trouble with vertical separation when he runs a 4.46 40? I agree that Fitterer is a poor drafter with a lot of waster during his tenure.  

Having a rookie QB could have given him a longer leash from getting fired. If he trotted Corral out there and he showed promise it could have bought him more time. Problem is it's a move he should have done from day 1 but he was too stubborn and/or didn't have the ability to develop a QB. 

[WhoKnows]

2 minutes ago, hepcat said:

Having a rookie QB could have given him a longer leash from getting fired. If he trotted Corral out there and he showed promise it could have bought him more time. Problem is it's a move he should have done from day 1 but he was too stubborn and/or didn't have the ability to develop a QB. 

I thought the same about Rhule. I thought he would potentially hook his wagon to a rookie to give himself a longer leash. I think a huge issue with Rhule/Tepper was that day 1, they didn’t think about rebuilding. We half assed acting like we could make the playoffs while saying fans please be patient it will be a long process. Rhule was just completely out of his element and clearly didn’t have an NFL plan. I laid out my tank for Trevor plan but even if we somehow succeeded in getting Lawrence, it would have been like Urban Meyer.

[rebelrouser]

19 minutes ago, hepcat said:

Having a rookie QB could have given him a longer leash from getting fired. If he trotted Corral out there and he showed promise it could have bought him more time. Problem is it's a move he should have done from day 1 but he was too stubborn and/or didn't have the ability to develop a QB. 

I'm not buying it. He was going into year three, and the thought a third round qb was going to buy him more time? Best case scenario for Corral was sit for a year and learn and that was all the more evident w/ Baker Mayfield and Sam Darnold on the roster. 

[Gerry Green]

There has never been a draft that was highly regarded by its fanbase. There are just too many draft nerds nowadays. The nerds pick apart every pick, every move, every non move. Everything.

 

It's easy to criticize from afar. Unless you are sitting in that seat, you have no clue what is going on behind closed doors. Maybe they wanted to do what you wanted them to. Maybe they thought it was a dumb idea. Who outside of that inner circle actually knows?

 

Armchair GMs are rarely wrong. 

[Verge]

4 hours ago, hepcat said:

Did the panthers overdraft all the players they drafted or is that just what the projections are saying 

He was not going to last much longer if we didn't take him.

[Hoenheim]

If this guy ends up being anywhere near as good as AJ Brown or DK Metcalf he's probably going to be best WR we have had since S Smith left besides DJ. And really this guys potential could be a lot greater than what DJ here.

We've been starving for one of those dominant prototypical size WRs for a really long time. Missed really badly on Funchess and Bejmamin and several others. 

He's also got a high chance of having a lot of playing time with pretty much everyone in front of him being injury prone to some degree

Edited May 9, 2023 by Hoenheim