Monday Musings/Post-Draft Thoughts: FA Market, OLB, & TE

[TheCasillas]

5 minutes ago, Buckets said:

CB:

Byron Jones

Shaq Griffin

Bradley Roby 

The Byron Jones that said he can't run or jump anymore due to injuries?

The Shaw Griffin who has only played in 31 out of 53 games in the last three seasons?

Bradley Roby is a backup... he isnt an improvement on our roster.

Edited May 1, 2023 by TheCasillas

[TheCasillas]

21 minutes ago, Growl said:

You’re not looking for a long term player at this point and you’re not forced to pay for that at this point either. 
 

 

there are only 2 CBs that are free agents that could be upgrades.. thats Marcus Peters and Casey Hayward. However, both of them have been struggling with injuries.. so we arent really improving from that front.

Edited May 1, 2023 by TheCasillas

[Bear Hands]

40 minutes ago, Smithers said:

Yannick is far from a balanced pass rusher/run defender.  He sucks against the run - one of the worst in the league

I was just going off grades but we know how those can be a bit misleading.  

[Buckets]

3 minutes ago, TheCasillas said:

there are only 2 CBs that are free agents that could be upgrades.. thats Marcus Peters and Casey Hayward. However, both of them have been struggling with injuries.. so we arent really improving from that front.

our only decent CB is Jaycee

lots of room to improve that position

Darby not a bad option for a season 

[TheCasillas]

Just now, Buckets said:

our only decent CB is Jaycee

lots of room to improve that position

Darby not a bad option for a season 

Im not against Darby.. I wouldnt be surprised if he did sign here. However, the others are not a good add.

[Growl]

7 minutes ago, TheCasillas said:

there are only 2 CBs that are free agents that could be upgrades.. thats Marcus Peters and Casey Hayward. However, both of them have been struggling with injuries.. so we arent really improving from that front.

Your expectations are too unreasonable, there’s plenty of names on that list that could come in and provide a bit of drayton Florence/AJ Bouye type veteran competence 

if the team had drafted someone to develop it would be a different story but at this point you’re just looking for someone who can stabilize the position until you get another try next offseason 

 

[45catfan]

26 minutes ago, jayboogieman said:

You're assuming all the guys eligible to come out do and that all of them live up to the hype, which you know won't happen once people start picking them apart.

You're also assuming Corral is bad because he was a mid round pick in last year's draft. Yeah, the odds are greatly weighed against Corral ever becoming a starter in the NFL. But that doesn't mean he can't become a capable backup, which is all the Panthers should ever need from him providing Young becomes the franchise QB that people hope he is.

You're assuming and I'm assuming.  Some GMs take flyer picks on QBs just about every draft.  I'm not sold on Corral and I'm not putting all my eggs in the Bryce Young basket he stays healthy.  This year we are fine with Dalton and potentially next, but if we are looking for his eventual replacement (as we should) and Corral isn't it, we don't need to wait two years to make that pick.

Edited May 1, 2023 by 45catfan

[TheCasillas]

8 minutes ago, Growl said:

Your expectations are too unreasonable, there’s plenty of names on that list that could come in and provide a bit of drayton Florence/AJ Bouye type veteran competence 

if the team had drafted someone to develop it would be a different story but at this point you’re just looking for someone who can stabilize the position until you get another try next offseason 

 

who are your AJ Bouye/Drayton Florence types? I'll add Ronald Darby to this list. 

[jayboogieman]

1 minute ago, 45catfan said:

Your assuming and I'm assuming.  Some GMs take flyer picks on QBs just about every draft.  I'm not sold on Corral and I'm not putting all my eggs in the Bryce Young basket he stays healthy.  This year we are fine with Dalton and potentially next, but if we are looking for his eventual replacement (as we should) and Corral isn't it, we don't need to wait two years to make that pick.

Good teams and those with established QBs, don't take flyers on QBs every draft. It's a waste of a draft pick in most cases and can tick off the starting QB. Corral will be fine as QB3 unless he becomes a distraction if he makes the roster at all. Eason may jump him since Reich is more familiar with him.

You and your eggs don't really matter. What does is that the team has gone all in on Young and his staying healthy. He has just as much of a chance of having a long, healthy career as any of the other QBs drafted over the weekend. Just because he is smaller than most of them doesn't mean they won't be the ones taking the hits that end their careers instead of Young.

Dalton is a backup and they can worry about replacing him with another vet when the time comes. It's nothing to worry about now or in the future.

[Proudiddy]

Crazy Ngakoue is only 28.  Damn, seems like he's been around a long time now.  I wouldn't have thought he was younger than Floyd.

[Bear Hands]

27 minutes ago, Proudiddy said:

Crazy Ngakoue is only 28.  Damn, seems like he's been around a long time now.  I wouldn't have thought he was younger than Floyd.

Yeah, seems like he did have some iffy games last year run-d wise after diving deeper.  He was an Indy FA get for Reich so they'll know if they want him or not.  

[45catfan]

1 hour ago, jayboogieman said:

Good teams and those with established QBs, don't take flyers on QBs every draft. It's a waste of a draft pick in most cases and can tick off the starting QB. Corral will be fine as QB3 unless he becomes a distraction if he makes the roster at all. Eason may jump him since Reich is more familiar with him.

You and your eggs don't really matter. What does is that the team has gone all in on Young and his staying healthy. He has just as much of a chance of having a long, healthy career as any of the other QBs drafted over the weekend. Just because he is smaller than most of them doesn't mean they won't be the ones taking the hits that end their careers instead of Young.

Dalton is a backup and they can worry about replacing him with another vet when the time comes. It's nothing to worry about now or in the future.

We are going to have to agree to disagree on this one.  Right now Corral is sounding a bit bitter and if he doesn't get his head straight, he may just get cut outright.

[jayboogieman]

17 minutes ago, 45catfan said:

We are going to have to agree to disagree on this one. Right now Corral is sounding a bit bitter and if he doesn't get his head straight, he may just get cut outright.

This I agree with

[Seltzer]

3 hours ago, Bear Hands said:

Is OLB a concern?

We have Burns who's the one absolute lock at OLB.  Otherwise, Haynes has done everything asked of him and more, but will admit, his run defense is not good enough to have him opposite Burns.  So, MH more situational, a decent snap % is likely. YGM is a solid run defender but if we don't like him for the scheme, are we considering shipping him? 

Per Frank & Scott, they were clearly eyeing DJ in looking for a solid run defender (with pass rushing upside) taking priority at OLB.  Barno flashed last year in limited time, but you're asking a lot of a 6th rounder.  I still love his potential, he could stick.   

I should note, interestingly enough, this was also the weaker spot on Denver's defense last season.  So it may take more than one offseason to really find our guy opposite Burns.  I can see us rolling with Burns, Haynes, YGM, DJJ, & Barno...but let's not fully discount another add...why?...

Post-Draft/Early Summer Movement:

Last year, there were 3 trades post draft early May league wise and the FA market was heavy the first two weeks of May with nearly every team jumping back into things.    

Typically not a Free Agency frenzy zone, but it was busy last year.  If this year is similar, Iit will likely pick back up tomorrow as signings will officially not count towards comp pick formula. It's not a for-sure we pounce, I honestly don't expect it, but there are a few major notable guys still on the market:

Yannick Ngakoue

6'2 246, 28 years old

May not be a household name, but he's a rather balanced pass/run defender that racked up 12 sacks last year for Frank (& eventually Saturday).  Given the staff's familiarity, this could either be someone we move on, or we know we don't want/need.  After some solid years in JAX he's jumped around so maybe there's more to why he's not signed anywhere.  Regardless, I'd keep an eye on him if this defensive staff wants more assurance we're getting decent run defense in place with less rookies.   

https://www.pff.com/nfl/players/yannick-ngakoue/10703

Leonard Floyd 

6'5 240, 30 years old

One that we're all likely more familiar with.  He's still playing at a high level, played pretty consistently in both pass & run defense last year for LA.

Frank Clark     

6'3 270, 29 years old

Another name many likely know like Floyd that we could make a move on.  Is still effective. 

buuuut....

Overall, let's not get too bummed if we don't sign anyone until preseason comes around, but these are guys we could consider.

 

 

Regarding the Tight Ends:

I am a bit disappointed we didn't come away with one from this class (damn you GB for grabbing Kraft).  Really liked Whyle and a few others as well beyond the top-5ish. 

However, Hurst should be fine and good to go as our starter.  With that being said, Tremble is going into a make or break season and I believe is being overlooked in a year he could jump Ian for playing time as a more appropriate TE2 capable of both blocking and receiving.  He reminds me of a guy Reich used as a TE2 in Trey Burton, but honestly can be a tad better.  I am in no way expecting him to blossom into some star TE, but he has decent talent as a TE2; he was #83 in his draft.  Has made more than a few big plays for us in limited time.  95+ passer rating when targeted.   

 

Do trades happen?

Potential guys on the move:

Yetur Gross-Matos - Just doesn't seem to fit.  

Ian Thomas - He took a pay cut so is more movable, or could basically keep the fort down as a backup to Hurst

Matt Corral - Is he worth a 6th/7th? Is his tweet being overblown? Or is he fine staying around and competing with Eason? 

 

Some Monday musings.  Okay back to work haha

I agree OLB is still an area of need.  I expect we will still sign a FA here.  Important to note, after 4PM today, FA signings do not affect the compensatory pick calculations.

In terms of personnel, Reich talked about how they use 2 distinct types of OLB in Evero's scheme:

1) Pure speed rushers.  I assume Burns, Haynes, and Barno fit this profile.  

2) Power rusher/setting the edge.  YGM really was the only guy on the roster with this build, which is why I think there was so much urgency to trade up to get a guy like DJ Johnson.

So, while I do think and hope they sign another OLB, I think finding someone who can fit into this 2nd mold (being good against the run) needs to be an important factor b/c while we have 2 guys now that fit the profile, neither YGM nor DJ Johnson has proven they can play this position on the field.

Leonard Floyd would be my first choice to sign as a FA b/c he's better against the run.

Also, and I'm not sure it happens, but I still like the idea of signing Jadaveon Clowney b/c while he has not lived up to his potential as a pass rushing 3-4 OLB, he is elite in this role against the run.

I feel better about TE than most.  Our group certainly wasn't great last year, but adding Hurst is a big improvement IMO.  This group is not even close to one of the worst groups we've had at TE.  And while their receiving numbers aren't scaring anyone, Tremble and Thomas were a big part of the run game's dominance in the 2nd half of last year.  Tremble is only in year 3 and has shown flashes in the passing game.  Ian Thomas gets a lot of hate, but go watch how good he was as a lead blocker on run plays.

I think there is a 100% chance YGM is on the team given my statement above.  And since we didn't trade Corral in the draft, I think it's almost 100% he's on the team at least one more year given where he was drafted.