Just for the sake of discussion, is there a correlation between size and injury?

[ForJimmy]

6 minutes ago, ECHornet said:

If you ignore all combine measurements and run with your own hypothetical “playing weight” for Young, then you’re onto something. 

Honest question.  Do you really think his playing weight is above 200?  

[PantherOnTheProwl1523]

6 minutes ago, stan786 said:

Tua weighs more than CJ does though, I dont get why its not an indictment on them both.

It doesn't really matter who weighs more than who. It is how they play the games and the ability to win. All they need to do is try to adapt to any situation like avoiding injury.

Edited March 27, 2023 by PantherOnTheProwl1523

[stan786]

Just now, Moorgan said:

You can’t say you want to see stats instead of gut feelings to make an argument and then acknowledge that there are no stats bc no one has done what he’s doing.

There’s been one player that is the same size as Young that I can think of. Doug Flutie.

Flutie NFL stats aren’t great bc he didn’t always start. He played in 91 games, has 107 sacks. However, I couldn’t find any notes of any major injuries. If you add his CFL and USFL stats, he has an impressive career and was also a running threat. He threw a lot of picks so arguably Young is probably better at everything.

So I think Young people should hang their hats on Doug Flutie (mentor to Brees) as the only guy who is absolutely tiny and played QB. I found a groin injury during training camp and that was basically it.

I'm arguing that its alright to argue he's an outlier of a QB and that is a large risk, that small QBs havent been able to do it in the past because a number of reasons.  I am saying there is zero data that shows that smaller or lighter players get injured in any more drastic fashion than any other sized QB.  I would like to know what is the magic number that instantly makes Bryce so much more injury prone and why is that the case.

I would like this board to elevate their discussions from a place of "I know hes going to get hurt end of arguement" to actually discussing the pluses and minuses of the players.

[CarolinaRideorDie]

As I said in another post, the devastating injuries are concussions and ACL tears. These type of injures don't have anything to do with size. Physical freaks have had ACL tears, Luke ended his career early because of concussions and they were all big physical specimens. I think Young can have a long career because he knows how to play the QB position to protect himself. His elite trait is pocket awareness, you can't avoid every single sack or pressure but having that awareness decreases those chances. 

Young doesn't even have an injury history, draft the prospect for what he can do. Don't avoid drafting him for things that he can't control and predict in the future, ex injuries. 

[stan786]

2 minutes ago, PantherOnTheProwl1523 said:

It doesn't really matter who weighs more than who. It is how they play the games and the ability to win.

Agreed

[CPcavedweller]

I know that Tua and Wilson were knocked out cold last year and that Kyler tore an ACL. Those are the comps for Young...

Probably an anomaly though, right?

[Tr3ach]

14 minutes ago, ladypanther said:

But is that because of what they are doing (like running)?    Hard to actually compare apples to apples.

I think its just injuries overall at the qb position. 

[stan786]

4 minutes ago, Beast_3000 said:

I get the conversation you want to discuss, but the article talks primarily about lower body injuries due to weight. That’s not what analyst and GM’s are concerned with when discussing  Bryce Young. Even the statistics gathered in this article have no direct correlation to a quarterbacks like Young. How can it possibly discuss Young when he will be the first of his size? 
He’s elusive but what happens when Nick Bosa or Bobby Wagner blind sides him. I know there are rules to protect QB’s against body weight but what happens when a 300 pound man lands on Bryce? Or better yet he gets closed in a pocket where he can not escape and a 300 pound lineman possibly steps on his ankle or any part of his  lower leg???  Do you trust him to avoid body weight for maybe 5 years? I’m not even talking about the next 15 years that we want for a franchise QB drafted 1 overall. 
 

I love the player I just dont think you gamble with a billion dollar decision. What’s the point of spending  millions getting offensive minded coaches if they aren’t willing to take the safer pick Stroud and develop him ? Strouds doesn’t have any glaring weaknesses and seems like he has room to grow. 
 

 

What happens when a 300 man falls on a skinny 213 lb Stroud, its not like his frame is super robust he's still a relatively light NFL QB at 213 lbs. Why is he bulletproof there to such a high degree that you can push Bryce out of the discussion here.

[Tr3ach]

10 minutes ago, stan786 said:

Tua weighs more than CJ does though, I dont get why its not an indictment on them both.

How do you know Tua got them entirely because of his weight and not just bad luck/genetic predisposition? 

[Moorgan]

1 minute ago, stan786 said:

I'm arguing that its alright to argue he's an outlier of a QB and that is a large risk, that small QBs havent been able to do it in the past because a number of reasons.  I am saying there is zero data that shows that smaller or lighter players get injured in any more drastic fashion than any other sized QB.  I would like to know what is the magic number that instantly makes Bryce so much more injury prone and why is that the case.

I would like this board to elevate their discussions from a place of "I know hes going to get hurt end of arguement" to actually discussing the pluses and minuses of the players.

I agree with this but I think more people should look at Flutie (5’9” 180lbs) as they only and best comparison.

 You already pointed out that the small QBs of today are bigger than Young and play differently. I think Young is a better version in every way than Flutie who basically never really got injured and played for a long time and had a great career (mostly in the CFL).

I think that’s the best argument FOR Young and discussing his size from the perspective that it’s NOT a big concern…or not a bigger concern than anyone else.

[LinvilleGorge]

11 minutes ago, ForJimmy said:

Honest question.  Do you really think his playing weight is above 200?  

This. When he showed up at the Combine to do nothing but step on a scale at 200+ and then didn't weigh in again at his Pro Day when he was actually going to go through drills that told me all I needed to know. His playing weight is significantly lighter than that 204 Combine weight.

[stan786]

4 minutes ago, CPcavedweller said:

I know that Tua and Wilson were knocked out cold last year and that Kyler tore an ACL. Those are the comps for Young...

Probably an anomaly though, right?

Why is 220 lb Tua a comp for Bryce. I can name a bunch of QBs Strouds size that had injury issues. Teddy Bridgewater is almost Strouds size exactly and gets injured almost constantly. Dak missed a year last year due to his hip, Burrow tore his ACL his rookie year.

All size QBs get hurt.

Edited March 27, 2023 by stan786

[rightturn]

Just now, LinvilleGorge said:

This. When he showed up at the Combine to do nothing but step on a scale at 200+ and then didn't weigh in again at his Pro Day when he was actually going to go through drills that told me all I needed to know. His playing weight is significantly lighter than that 204 Combine weight.

Stroud weighed again at his pro day. Young wanted no part of it.  That's telling

[ForJimmy]

Also it's a much smaller (no pun intended) sample size.  QBs under 6ft that have started and played in a lot of games seems very small.  Murray (who has battled injuries, but runs a lot and hasn't played long) and Russ (who has stayed healthy) just off the top of my head.  Obviously you are going to find more injuries for QBs 6'2" plus because a huge majority of starting QBs fall into this category.