Keep this in mind Stroud vs Young...

[Eric4280]

1 minute ago, tukafan21 said:

Okay, fair

But that's also why Stroud is the guy in my mind.

The argument against Young has never been about his skill or ability, I'll be the first to admit that if he can stay healthy for a dozen years, he very well could be a HOFer.  I just don't think that seems likely to me with how he is built.

The biggest argument against Stroud is that we just haven't seen him without elite WRs, but he has rave reviews in all other aspects of his game.

In that scenario, I'm going with the guy that I don't see many/any flaws with outside of not having played with non-elite WRs in college over the guy I have serious durability concerns with.

Also, I've said many times that what we gave up to move to #1 plays into that thinking for me.  Which I 100% think should factor in for the team as well, you gave up a boatload of assets to get here, with two guys who both rank so closely together like this, I'm going with the one without the bigger red flag of the two.

 

And that’s fair. All concerns on this board are perfectly fine and I’d never draw issue to it. But I just think it’s foolish to ignore one’s flaws while faulting another. 
 

One last tid bit before I log off that may not matter. Bryce has played behind terrible by SEC standards in OL play, taken hits from NFL players. It’s happened many a times.

 

I personally just haven’t seen what Stroud is with Theilen and terrace as his go tos in the nfl vs all of those combos he’s had in college. He very well may be able to adjust and overcome* . I won’t rule that out. But it’s something to think about.

[jfra78]

16 minutes ago, Eric4280 said:

See this is the stuff I have issues with. The WR thing isn’t overblown. It’s an actual factor. Fields went 67-9 in college and is 24-21 in the nfl (and I’m plenty aware that these things don’t directly correlate) but it’s SUCH a big gap. How does Fields look on sf with kittle, deebo, aiyuk? Heck, how would he have looked with our group when we had Dj and Cmc. Probably a LOT better than 24/21. Fields is getting so much hype NOW because he’s got the guy that we had for 4 years that the media refused to acknowledge. The things around you matter.

It doesn't matter because you can't win in the NFL without superior talent around you, no matter how good the QB is

[Eric4280]

4 minutes ago, jfra78 said:

It doesn't matter because you can't win in the NFL without superior talent around you, no matter how good the QB is

Well yeah of course. Which guy offers more with less help though? We’ve seen what Young does with less than ideal options, we have not seen that with Stroud. That’s all I’m implying.

[CamWhoaaCam]

8 minutes ago, Eric4280 said:

You can still be a Stroud guy and get bashed for offering a critique. It’s amazing. Nowhere do you see the Young guys acknowledging that he’s absolutely perfect and the second coming. He’s got flaws. His size is a built in flaw for obvious reasons(which is obviously a big one) , the shoulder thing does make me a tiny bit eh, some adjustments to the nfl MAY be tough for him. 
 

Once you say one thing about Stroud, it’s like the floodgates open. It’s pretty funny with that whole Burrow thing too. Jefferson wasn’t supposed to be what he is now. He was supposed to be a sure handed solid receiver. If he were anything close to what he is now, coming out, he obviously goes before games named Jalen Raegor. Every situation is different with every single player and not every factor applies. 
 

“Marvin Harrison and Wayne made Peyton by that logic”. No, that’s not how this works. I think Garrett Wilson and Olave looking questionably better as pros vs college (questionable, don’t come at me) is a LITTLE alarming considering the fact that they had bottom 5-7 QB play and still did what they did. I’m not gonna doubt Stroud is a great ball placer and has so much arm strength. But the nfl is a lot messier and less clean cut. I’ve yet to see him play in a real mess.

I haven't been here long but one thing I notice is people pick a side and they don't care about what's fair. In their eyes Stroud can do no wrong.

 

Im a Stroud guy who's being fair minded. People only question Bryce because of his "size".

 

Turn on the tape and ignore the size factor. You can't tell me Bryce isn't the best QB in this draft. So why are people against Bryce as the pick?

 

Why can't we be happy with either QB?

[Eric4280]

1 minute ago, CamWhoaaCam said:

I haven't been here long but one thing I notice is people pick a side and they don't care about what's fair. In their eyes Stroud can do no wrong.

 

Im a Stroud guy who's being fair minded. People only question Bryce because of his "size".

 

Turn on the tape and ignore the size factor. You can't tell me Bryce isn't the best QB in this draft. So why are people against Bryce as the pick?

 

Why can't we be happy with either QB?

We’ve had a civil war in here the last 14 days. I summon a truce to all and keep pounding.

[CamWhoaaCam]

6 minutes ago, jfra78 said:

It doesn't matter because you can't win in the NFL without superior talent around you, no matter how good the QB is

That's not quite true.

 

Lamar has won with some of the weakest weapons in the NFL. He basically in the same situation we had with Cam. But he actually wins a lot more than Cam. Lamar has a 75% win percentage as a starter and I couldn't tell you the name of his WR's.

[top dawg]

1 hour ago, CamWhoaaCam said:

Burrow had the greatest season in college football history.

 

You can't use Burrow as the example for something we won't see again for a long time.

 

Jefferson also did pretty damn well without Burrow. Elite WR's are a thing and a QB doesn't make them. 

Yeah, I ain't seen Burrow do poo without damned good receivers because he's always had them. 

[CamWhoaaCam]

1 minute ago, top dawg said:

Yeah, I ain't seen Burrow do poo without damned good receivers because he's always had them. 

This is actually a fact.

 

Not saying he wouldn't be good without them, but that we will never know anytime soon.lol

[top dawg]

9 minutes ago, CamWhoaaCam said:

That's not quite true.

 

Lamar has won with some of the weakest weapons in the NFL. He basically in the same situation we had with Cam. But he actually wins a lot more than Cam. Lamar has a 75% win percentage as a starter and I couldn't tell you the name of his WR's.

 

Damn, you're right. I gotta Google it.

[csx]

I would want good receivers with either of them. 

 

[Aussie Tank]

1 hour ago, CamWhoaaCam said:

That's not quite true.

 

Lamar has won with some of the weakest weapons in the NFL. He basically in the same situation we had with Cam. But he actually wins a lot more than Cam. Lamar has a 75% win percentage as a starter and I couldn't tell you the name of his WR's.

Better coaching staff and Oline than Cam ever had 

[csx]

1 hour ago, CamWhoaaCam said:

I haven't been here long but one thing I notice is people pick a side and they don't care about what's fair. In their eyes Stroud can do no wrong.

 

Im a Stroud guy who's being fair minded. People only question Bryce because of his "size".

 

Turn on the tape and ignore the size factor. You can't tell me Bryce isn't the best QB in this draft. So why are people against Bryce as the pick?

 

Why can't we be happy with either QB?

Because you are imagining that the tape clearly shows this. The tape shows it to be splitting hairs between the 2.

[mav1234]

Stroud has definitely had better receivers overall, but it's not like Young had nobody to throw to in 2021, which as a season is a big contributor to his draft stock.

My biggest concern with Young is his durability... He's just much smaller at his playing weight than even other shorter QBs.  But he got it done in college and I wouldn't be surprised if he excelled when on the field in the pros.

[rightturn]

8 hours ago, CamWhoaaCam said:

Stroud played with a generational WR Marvin Harrison Jr.

Young WR's were probably the weakest core of WR's in the last 10 years at Alabama.

 

Young can probably do more with a weaker supporting cast of WR's. He extends plays and buys his WR's time to get open. His ability to extend plays is severely underrated. People need to consider this before we rush to conclusions. Im sure the coaching staff has brought this up when watchig film.

 

Who you play with matters. Young was great even with lesser talented WR's. 

 

This is coming from a Stroud fan btw. I call it like I see it. We have to be fair to both QB's.

Poor Bryce Young.  He has to throw to 4 and 5 star wrs and he is only coached by a world class staff and the best college HC in history.  Damn poor guy