Interesting twist regarding Lamar Jackson...

[Mr. Scot]

6 minutes ago, top dawg said:

No, you don't keep repeating the same miatake year after year after year. 

You mean like when Gruden changed Tampa's starting quarterbacks on an annual basis?

Seriously dude, yikes

[top dawg]

3 minutes ago, LinvilleGorge said:

No he didn't. I went to all but two Broncos home games that year because the company I worked for had a suite and I was the only CO based employee so I got the tickets by default unless some big wig was in town on vacation and wanted them.

The Golden Calf of Bristol looked like trash running the base offense. He'd work his magic in the two minute drill. You just can't get a coach to build an offense where every play basically amounts to "scramble drill on three, break".

He got to the playoffs with trash then. Still impressive.

[top dawg]

2 minutes ago, Mr. Scot said:

You mean like when Gruden changed Tampa's starting quarterbacks on an annual basis?

Seriously dude, yikes

You've started a "Carr Watch" thread and are trying to clown me? Come on, dude.

[Mr. Scot]

2 minutes ago, top dawg said:

You've started a "Carr Watch" thread and are trying to clown me? Come on, dude.

The "Carr Watch" is because plenty of people are interested. That includes those who prefer he sign somewhere else.

I've already said I'm okay with whatever the braintrust ultimately decides in regard to him.

Edited February 17, 2023 by Mr. Scot

[PNW_PantherMan]

1 minute ago, stbugs said:

Yep. He doesn’t seem to be improving lately. Reminds me a bit of Cam when he started having the should issues. Remember that Cam missed the last couple of games in 2016 due to his shoulder and was a question mark to start 2017. I think 2017 made people forget but then we saw his throwing issues in 2018 and he missed almost all of 2019.

LJ is not a big guy, so starting to see injuries pile up makes you very nervous about the future. I think that’s why the Ravens don’t want to commit to a giant deal and might not be more willing to franchise him.

Plus he has never shown up big in a playoff game.  That has to be a concern.

[NanuqoftheNorth]

1 hour ago, top dawg said:

Drive away talent? Who was driven away? A-Rod is known for being an A-hole. He makes it about him with his little off-season games of stringing the Packers along. The Packers gave Adams essentially the same type of contract financially. If A-Rod  hadn't been A-Rod, the Packers would've been a legit contender had Adams stayed.

Agreed.  That is precisely what I was implying with my post.  

Lamar Jackson is not an asshole by all reports. He just wants to be paid what he feels he is worth.

Yes.  Lamar seems like a nice chap.  Unfortunately, he has an overinflated value of himself.  At 1-4 in the playoffs and nagging injury issues, Jackson isn't exactly setting the NFL world on fire is he? 

Cleveland didn't lose anyone irreplaceable because they signed Watson. A a matter of fact, it's still way too early to even be alluding to any type of failure at this point. The jury is still out.

When was the last time any GM was quoted as saying, "we're modeling our franchise after the Cleveland Browns"?  Cleveland is short 3 valuable first round picks and significant cap space, all they have to show for it is an underwhelming QB and sexual deviant as the face of their franchise.

Denver has talent. Who did they lose? And the fact is that Wilson's contract ain't even in the class of Watson's or whatever people think that Jackson may get. Wilson's contract surely didn't stop another talented a-hole with a huge ego in Sean Payton. I think we're all going to find out what a difference time actually makes in the form of better coaching and chemistry.

Believe what you will about the potential of combining Payton and Wilson.  I for one believe those two over-inflated egos deserve one another and it will not end well for at least one of them.

Meanwhile, Broncos are currently locked into a quarter of a billion dollar contract for Wilson (161 million guaranteed), with two first round picks and two second round picks up in smoke.  Payoff?  Last place in the AFC West, handcuffed to Wilson with no light at the end of the tunnel for at least two more seasons.

 

Edited February 17, 2023 by NanuqoftheNorth

[Teddy2SuperBowlHeartBreaks]

2 hours ago, Mr. Scot said:

I remember some years back we were having a discussion that we needed to do whatever we could / trade whatever was necessary / pay whatever he asked to a certain quarterback from another team.

He was sold as a dynamic athlete who was worth the injury risk, guaranteed us a Super Bowl and any perceived weaknesses in his passing game were the fault of pretty much any and everybody else but him.

In the end, Michael Vick never took us (or anybody else) to the Super Bowl, but he won a lot of awards and had some really cool highlights

I would say this is fairly disingenuous . Those Falcon teams were limited at skill positions and Vick almost did get them to the Super Bowl. Had he not been a complete idiot the Falcons would have contended for another 5-6 years easy. People act like the gap between winning a Super Bowl and being a game or two away is so wide. Vick on this Panthers team at any time during the 00's results in at least a Super Bowl appearance. I actually don't think Lamar today is as valuable as Vick was back then, and our team today isn't as good as our team was back then, so it doesn't really matter. Mike Vick disrespect is weird though.

[SmokinwithWilly]

42 minutes ago, top dawg said:

Yeah, Gruden knows his stuff. As you know, he wasn't let go for football reasons. 

McDaniels made The Golden Calf of Bristol look competent. 

Yeah, if they don't want Carr, I don't either.

This is a new time with a "new" league and new rules. Old thinking isn't necessarily going to get you where you want to go.  You assemble smart minds together and come up with your own smart ways to get to where you want to go. You become that which everyone else wants to try and emulate.

They had to make a choice between McDaniels or Carr and couldn't afford to fire McDaniels. I'm not vouching for Carr, but talk of firing a coach year 1 is never a good sign that things are going well. 

[SmokinwithWilly]

1 hour ago, Luciu5 said:

If that's accurate, then that's just over $22 million/year. I don't think he is worth $40 mil a year, but that does feel low to me. I can't see him going for less than $30 mil avg per year on the open market.

The offer I saw was 250M over 5 years with 133m guaranteed that would have extended him through 2027. So the offer was 50m per year with 26.5m per year guaranteed. 

edit: also no agent fee so it would be more like 55.5m per season 

Edited February 17, 2023 by SmokinwithWilly

[Mr. Scot]

Just now, SmokinwithWilly said:

The offer I saw was 250M over 5 years with 133m guaranteed that would have extended him through 2027. So the offer was 50m per year with 26.5m per year guaranteed. 

Yeah, and from what I've read the issue isn't so much the total contract amount as it is he wants the whole thing guaranteed like Watson got.

A lot of owners really hate the Browns right now...

[SmokinwithWilly]

1 minute ago, Mr. Scot said:

Yeah, and from what I've read the issue isn't so much the total contract amount as it is he wants the whole thing guaranteed like Watson got.

A lot of owners really hate the Browns right now...

Letting a franchise QB like Lamar walk has the weird feeling of Matt Paradis to me. Obviously not same position, but following an injury, a player considered top tier at his position is being allowed to look elsewhere. That just seems... odd. 

[Jackie Lee]

1 hour ago, Luciu5 said:

If that's accurate, then that's just over $22 million/year. I don't think he is worth $40 mil a year, but that does feel low to me. I can't see him going for less than $30 mil avg per year on the open market.

$133M guaranteed, the actual offer was $250M up to $290M with incentives, he just wanted the whole $250M guaranteed. So that's $42-49M a year. 

[Varking]

1 hour ago, top dawg said:

ONLY if you think that he is a legit franchise QB. If we trade all that and he flops, the QB teeadwill will continue and we won't have the draft capital to do anything for two to three years. He (or Young) would just have to be the guy, especially with what will likely be a superior '24 class.

I mostly agree. But a rookie QB flop sets us back just a season or 2. It’s picks and not much money. Lamar is going to cost picks plus guaranteed money. If he flops or stays injured he sets us back years.

And I do believe Stroud will be a franchise guy. 

[NanuqoftheNorth]

10 minutes ago, SmokinwithWilly said:

The offer I saw was 250M over 5 years with 133m guaranteed that would have extended him through 2027. So the offer was 50m per year with 26.5m per year guaranteed. 

edit: also no agent fee so it would be more like 55.5m per season 

Yeah, this is accurate.  The first reference I came across only mentioned the guaranteed portion of 133 million.  250 million seems more than generous IMHO.