A Statistical Analysis of Signing Carr vs. Trading for L. Jackson

[top dawg]

3 hours ago, LinvilleGorge said:

Jimmy G has played for two of the better franchises and better coaches in recent NFL memory. Carr has played for the Raiders.

There's a reason why Carr will be the hottest veteran QB on the market this year and Jimmy G will be hoping for another opportunity to even compete for a starting job.

FTR, if the plan is to draft a QB I wouldn't hate Jimmy G as a bridge/mentor.

Carr? The "hottest veteran QB on the market?"

Don't confuse the first with "the hottest." 

The only negative---which is significant I admit---that Jimmy G has in comparison to Carr is injury. He's the superior player in every other way, and their careers bare that out. 

Edited February 16, 2023 by top dawg

[CamWhoaaCam]

Please stop mentioning Derek Carr in the same sentence as Lamar Jackson.

 

If you asking who do I want give me the MVP candidate every time who is only 26.

 

I don't care about picks we need a franchise QB that is how you win in this league. Carr isn't just had a loaded offense and Vegas and he took them nowhere. No thanks im tired of the castoff QB's every year.

 

Lamar>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>Carr

[ForJimmy]

4 minutes ago, top dawg said:

Carr? The "hottest veteran QB on the market?"

Don't confuse the first with "the hottest." 

The only negative---which is significant I admit---that Jimmy G has in comparison to Carr is injury. He's the superior player in every other way, and their careers bare that out. 

Really? Most have Carr rated higher than Jimmy G. Hell Jimmy G might have to find a backup job this year unless maybe the Jets sign him?

[LinvilleGorge]

10 minutes ago, top dawg said:

Carr? The "hottest veteran QB on the market?"

Don't confuse the first with "the hottest." 

The only negative---which is significant I admit---that Jimmy G has in comparison to Carr is injury. He's the superior player in every other way, and their careers bare that out. 

You think Jimmy G is the superior QB?

Okay. We'll see what their markets bear out.

[ForJimmy]

1 minute ago, CamWhoaaCam said:

Please stop mentioning Derek Carr in the same sentence as Lamar Jackson.

 

If you asking who do I want give me the MVP candidate every time who is only 26.

 

I don't care about picks we need a franchise QB that is how you win in this league. Carr isn't just had a loaded offense and Vegas and he took them nowhere. No thanks im tired of the castoff QB's every year.

 

Lamar>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>Carr

I agree Lamar is a good bit better. Hell last year Carr had Adams, Walker, Renfro, and Jacobs while Jackson has Andrews and……

[SmokinwithWilly]

3 minutes ago, ForJimmy said:

I agree Lamar is a good bit better. Hell last year Carr had Adams, Walker, Renfro, and Jacobs while Jackson has Andrews and……

Carr also had the great neutralizer in Josh McDaniels and one of the worst defenses in the NFL. I'm not saying Carr is better than LJ, but you can't judge any of these QBs in a vacuum. 

[Mr. Scot]

6 minutes ago, CamWhoaaCam said:

Please stop mentioning Derek Carr in the same sentence as Lamar Jackson.

If you asking who do I want give me the MVP candidate every time who is only 26.

I don't care about picks we need a franchise QB that is how you win in this league. Carr isn't just had a loaded offense and Vegas and he took them nowhere. No thanks im tired of the castoff QB's every year.

Lamar>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>Carr

And again, the fact that you think Jackson winning an MVP four years ago negates any and all questions and criticisms about him tells me all I need to know about your level of football knowledge.

[CamWhoaaCam]

5 minutes ago, SmokinwithWilly said:

Carr also had the great neutralizer in Josh McDaniels and one of the worst defenses in the NFL. I'm not saying Carr is better than LJ, but you can't judge any of these QBs in a vacuum. 

Even with lesser weapons Lamar can carry a offense better than Carr ever has.

 

It's not really even a debate who is the better QB. The debate is are you willing to pay the price to get Lamar Jackson.

 

I personally think he's worth it with this current roster. We have more talent than Baltimore on both sides of the ball. We are instant contenders the moment we trade for Lamar.

 

 

[SmokinwithWilly]

30 minutes ago, CamWhoaaCam said:

Even with lesser weapons Lamar can carry a offense better than Carr ever has.

 

It's not really even a debate who is the better QB. The debate is are you willing to pay the price to get Lamar Jackson.

 

I personally think he's worth it with this current roster. We have more talent than Baltimore on both sides of the ball. We are instant contenders the moment we trade for Lamar.

 

 

It actually is debatable. Lamar missed 4 games 2 years ago and 5 last year. You can only carry an offense if you're playing. His durability is a legitimate concern. His playing style also exposes him to more hits than a standard pocket QB increasing the possibility of getting hurt. Running QBs don't have the longevity of pocket QBs. 

Then you have to pay his salary and the huge picks/player haul to acquire him. That affects your ability to build your team as a whole. 

If you're confident giving up 3 1sts and 2nds and/or players plus 50m a year or more guaranteed multi year for a QB that has missed 1/4 of the season each of the past 2 years, that's your prerogative. I 

If Baltimore is willing to let this amazing MVP QB walk because they don't think they can build a successful team with his salary demands, it definitely begs the question, If Lamar isn't worth the salary he's demanding to his current team, what makes him worth that salary and a crippling amount of draft picks to another? Can he carry a team to multiple SBs and win with all the pieces a team will have to give up to acquire him?

And make no mistake, if we traded for LJ for that size haul, I would expect no less than 2-3 SB trips and Lombardis or else we lose the trade. Lamar is a very good player. I don't think he's so exceptional he can overcome the limitations he would place on a team. That's my prerogative. 

[CamWhoaaCam]

2 minutes ago, SmokinwithWilly said:

It actually is debatable. Lamar missed 4 games 2 years ago and 5 last year. You can only carry an offense if you're playing. His durability is a legitimate concern. His playing style also exposes him to more hits than a standard pocket QB increasing the possibility of getting hurt. Running QBs don't have the longevity of pocket QBs. 

Then you have to pay his salary and the huge picks/player haul to acquire him. That affects your ability to build your team as a whole. 

If you're confident giving up 3 1sts and 2nds and/or players plus 50m a year or more guaranteed multi year for a QB that has missed 1/4 of the season each of the past 2 years, that's your prerogative. I 

If Baltimore is willing to let this amazing MVP QB walk because they don't think they can build a successful team with his salary demands, it definitely begs the question, If Lamar isn't worth the salary he's demanding to his current team, what makes him worth that salary and a crippling amount of draft picks to another? Can he carry a team to multiple SBs and win with all the pieces a team will have to give up to acquire him?

And make no mistake, if we traded for LJ for that size haul, I would expect no less than 2-3 SB trips and Lombardis or else we lose the trade. Lamar is a very good player. I don't think he's so exceptional he can overcome the limitations he would place on a team. That's my prerogative. 

Everybody is entitled to their own opinion. If you think Carr is better than Lamar than that's your opinion.

 

I can only speak for myself and it's laughable to even compare the two. I would love to see what Lamar could do with those weapons Carr had though...

[onmyown]

Carr and build the team instead with picks would be the second best option.

What it’d take to get Jackson I’d rather risk on an elite talent. In fact I’d consider it pretty stupid to not do this. So drafting a QB is the best option.

That’s the most logical take imo and should be plan A and B.

Plan C is keep building the team and sign whoever at QB. It sucks but this would come into play depending on Carr’s contract etc. and not being able to draft the guy due to whatever reason, because I wouldn’t want to be stuck long term with Carr, especially overpaid and also don’t really want the 4th qb in the draft at 9.

I don’t see a scenario or even a Plan D where trading the farm for Jackson and then paying him a massive contract makes any sense whatsoever. 

But then again Tepper did go after Watson so I don’t put it past him at all. Obviously Rhule’s yes man, ‘GM’ Fit isn’t going to stop him so I sure as hell hope Reich puts an end to that thought.

Edited February 16, 2023 by onmyown

[SmokinwithWilly]

13 minutes ago, CamWhoaaCam said:

Everybody is entitled to their own opinion. If you think Carr is better than Lamar than that's your opinion.

 

I can only speak for myself and it's laughable to even compare the two. I would love to see what Lamar could do with those weapons Carr had though...

I never said Carr is better. I actually think it will be harder to build a multi year SB contender with the price LJ will cost vs Carr and elite talent picks. I'm looking at the big picture and you're focused on a single player. 

Lamar would have done great in Vegas watching his defense give up lead after lead and Josh McDaniels running a team so badly they would have fired him after one season but couldn't afford it. Imagine how bad you have to be to not even last half as long as Matt Rhule. 

[LinvilleGorge]

I definitely think Lamar is better. I also know that Lamar will require a massive contract and a massive trade package to acquire. It would be the type of deal that would greatly hamper our ability to otherwise improve our roster. That's why I'm willing to consider Carr but not Lamar. If they were both FAs I'd definitely rather have Lamar.

[CamWhoaaCam]

1 minute ago, SmokinwithWilly said:

I never said Carr is better. I actually think it will be harder to build a multi year SB contender with the price LJ will cost vs Carr and elite talent picks. I'm looking at the big picture and you're focused on a single player. 

Lamar would have done great in Vegas watching his defense give up lead after lead and Josh McDaniels running a team so badly they would have fired him after one season but couldn't afford it. Imagine how bad you have to be to not even last half as long as Matt Rhule. 

No im looking at a franchise QB.

 

I want one either draft or via trade.

 

What im totally against is bridge QB. 

 

Bridge QB's are just that. QB's that are good enough to get you time to go after a franchise QB. At some point we have to trade to get a franchise QB. I don't know why people don't understand this. If you want Carr just know what we are getting.