So which QB do we think will be available at #9?

[TheCasillas]

24 minutes ago, Varking said:

Winston had a 18/5 stretch?

Fields had 17 passing TDs on the entire season, where does the 18 come from? If we are looking from a passer POV... Winston did have an excellent stretch last year where he had almost 10% of his passes go for a TD before he got injured.

https://www.statmuse.com/nfl/ask/jamies-winston-2021-stats#:~:text=Jameis Winston had a passer,in 7 games in 2021.

 

Jameis Winston had a passer rating of 102.8 with 1,170 yards, 14 touchdowns and 3 interceptions in 7 games in 2021.

Edited January 9, 2023 by TheCasillas

[TheCasillas]

1 hour ago, UNCrules2187 said:

Since this has become a Fields thread, interesting thread below:

 

The top tweet is the start of the thread, there's several tweets though that make a compelling case the Bears should start over at QB however.

@top dawgI wasnt trying to convince anyone, I was stating observation. However if you are lookin for some convincing this could prove to be helpful.

 

The convincing also lives on the Bears forum where fans are legit making an argument to draft Young and trade Fields. His own fan base sees it as it is. Most people here didnt have to watch Bears game and sit through the bad with Fields.... they only saw the highlight runs. Not the poor decision making and crumbling in the clutch.

[UNCrules2187]

10 minutes ago, TheCasillas said:

Fields had 17 passing TDs on the entire season, where does the 18 come from? If we are looking from a passer POV... Winston did have an excellent stretch last year where he had almost 10% of his passes go for a TD before he got injured.

https://www.statmuse.com/nfl/ask/jamies-winston-2021-stats#:~:text=Jameis Winston had a passer,in 7 games in 2021.

 

Jameis Winston had a passer rating of 102.8 with 1,170 yards, 14 touchdowns and 3 interceptions in 7 games in 2021.

He's including Fields rushing scores. If you do the same from Winston in the above stat he had 15 total TDs in 7 games so similar to his argument for Fields (2.1 TDs/game for Jameis vs 2.2 TDs/game for Fields, 0.57 TOs/game for Jameis vs 0.75 TOs/game for Fields). Hell that 7 game stretch from 2021 is why the Saints thought Jameis was their answer for 2022. Fools gold.

Edited January 9, 2023 by UNCrules2187

[mav1234]

19 minutes ago, ECHornet said:

You and I have a different recollection of those Bears teams. They were built on defense and never invested in offensive weapons around Trubisky. That doesn't really matter. I'm not arguing Trubisky should be a franchise QB. I'm providing reasons why I would draft Young if I were the Bears.

I'm not saying they gave Trubisky tons of receiver weapons, I'm saying the team was significantly better. The OL was significantly better.  The rushing attack was good, the OL blocked well (half the sacks as they gave up with Fields), and importantly, the defense was incredible. While the Bears did have a good rushing attack this year, that's heavily off of Fields' 7.1 ypc.

[mav1234]

If Fields was a veteran like Trubisky or Winston, there would be no question you draft a new QB.  But he's a second year player.

[mav1234]

5 minutes ago, TheCasillas said:

@top dawgI wasnt trying to convince anyone, I was stating observation. However if you are lookin for some convincing this could prove to be helpful.

 

The convincing also lives on the Bears forum where fans are legit making an argument to draft Young and trade Fields. His own fan base sees it as it is. Most people here didnt have to watch Bears game and sit through the bad with Fields.... they only saw the highlight runs. Not the poor decision making and crumbling in the clutch.

man dude, people were talking about trading Cam right until 2014 to move up and draft a real QB. I don't give a poo what a fan forum say, lol

[UNCrules2187]

To be clear, I'd rather have Fields over any QB on our roster and over anyone not named Stroud or Young in this draft (I'd take him over Levis as well tbh). But I don't think it's insane for the Bears to think about dealing Fields and grabbing an arguably better QB prospect on a new rookie deal that's aligned with the timeline of the new coaching staff and front office.

Edited January 9, 2023 by UNCrules2187

[mrcompletely11]

1 minute ago, UNCrules2187 said:

To be clear, I'd rather have Fields over any QB on our roster and over anyone not named Stroud or Young in this draft (I'd take him over Levis as well tbh). But I don't think it's insane for the Bears to think about dealing Fields and grabbing an arguably better QB prospect on a new rookie deal that's aligned with the timeline of the new coaching staff and front office.

Bryce young would be in a coffin if he took the hits fields did this season

[UNCrules2187]

Just now, mrcompletely11 said:

Bryce young would be in a coffin if he took the hits fields did this season

Young's taken plenty of big hits this season and more importantly, as a pocket passer, I don't think Young would put himself in the line of danger as much as Fields does. Taking big hits like the ones Fields does are the reason Cam's out of the league right now.

[ECHornet]

7 minutes ago, mav1234 said:

I'm not saying they gave Trubisky tons of receiver weapons, I'm saying the team was significantly better. The OL was significantly better.  The rushing attack was good, the OL blocked well (half the sacks as they gave up with Fields), and importantly, the defense was incredible. While the Bears did have a good rushing attack this year, that's heavily off of Fields' 7.1 ypc.

According to ESPN, the Bears had the 2nd best pass block win rate in the NFL and the 5th best run block win rate. I think Trubisky would have loved that kind of support up front.

Source: https://www.espn.com/nfl/story/_/id/34536376/2022-nfl-pass-rushing-run-stopping-blocking-leaderboard-win-rate-rankings-top-players-teams

[TheCasillas]

4 minutes ago, mav1234 said:

man dude, people were talking about trading Cam right until 2014 to move up and draft a real QB. I don't give a poo what a fan forum say, lol

There is no way you can compare the way Cam came into the league vs Fields. There is reason for doubt for Fields. Cam came in and dominated and never looked back.... until 2017....

[mav1234]

34 minutes ago, MasterAwesome said:

To people saying Fields is being held back by his lack of receivers: is there no consideration that these receivers are being held back by a QB who struggles to throw the football?  Darnell Mooney for one, looked like a very promising up-and-coming receiver last season and magically seems to have significantly regressed this year.  If you look at last year where he caught passes from both Fields and Dalton, here was the split between the two QBs:

Mooney catching passes from Fields in 2021: averaged 3.45 catches and 49.8 yards per game (extrapolates to a 847 yard season)

Mooney catching passes from Dalton in 2021: averaged 6.14 catches and 72.4 yards per game (extrapolates to a 1231 yard season)

Now Mooney catching passes from Fields in 2022: averaged 3.3 catches and 41.1 yards per game (extrapolates to a 699 yard season)

That's a huge increase in production catching passes from just a meh QB like Dalton.  That production is the difference between a WR2 and a WR1.  So is a guy like Mooney really the problem here?

Same thing with Claypool.  He's supposedly a horrible weapon yet somehow fetched a 2nd round pick in his 3rd season.  His production has regressed significantly when catching passes from Fields even if you only look at this season pre-trade and post-trade.

2022 Claypool w/ Steelers: averaged 4 catches and 38.9 yards per game (extrapolates to a 661 yard season)

2022 Claypool w/ Bears: averaged 2 catches and 20.0 yards per game (extrapolates to a 340 yard season)

Basically doubled his production catching passes from bad QBs like Trubisky and Pickett.

So depending on who is throwing them the football, Mooney/Claypool either look like a legit WR1/2 duo or a meh WR2/3 duo.  To be all "poor Justin Fields" without considering his impact on their production is pretty short-sighted.

Claypool and Mooney aren't horrible weapons at all... But they're also not #1s.  Of Mooney's 4 100 yard games last year, 2 were with Fields and 2 were with Dalton.  3 of his 4 TDs were with Fields. 

Claypool had one nice game for the Steelers this year, the rest were ~50 yard affairs for both teams.  And he played very few snaps for the Bears, as he was still learning the offense.

Claypool started 3 games for the Bears and Mooney 12. 

And i'd expect Dalton to be a more refined passer than Fields, especially last year...

[jamos14]

Houston - 100% taking a QB

Indy - 100% taking a QB

Seattle, Vegas, and Atlanta are hard to predict but it's possible.

So that means 2/3 of Young, Stroud, and Levis will be gone before pick 4.      

 

I'll predict somebody trades up for the remaining "top 3" QB (potentially Carolina).   Richardson is remaining at #9.

[mav1234]

Just now, TheCasillas said:

There is no way you can compare the way Cam came into the league vs Fields. There is reason for doubt for Fields. Cam came in and dominated and never looked back.... until 2017....

My point was you can't trust fan forums, not that the two were the same.