what's more important? early draft pick to hopefully get a stud QB or getting the best HC possible?

[gakonline]

I need to retract my vote of getting a Top Tier QB over HC. 
 

I say you need a Top Tier HC. A QB is only 1 of 22 starters. A top tier HC will put players in position to win on both sides of the ball. 

[Tr3ach]

Both.  You find the great head coach and then trust the coach and your gm/scouts to find a great qb for the system they want to run.

[Jackie Lee]

2 hours ago, TheCasillas said:

i think the topic was a coach turning down a job. If it wasnt, then I replied incorrectly.

He said he thought most HC job openings are shitty situations

[TheCasillas]

1 minute ago, Jackie Lee said:

He said he thought most HC job openings are shitty situations

Then I misread it. Disregard my comment. Apologies.

[Jackie Lee]

1 minute ago, TheCasillas said:

Then I misread it. Disregard my comment. Apologies.

McDaniels did turn that Colts job down right? I think that was fairly desirable until Luck retired abruptly lol

[TheCasillas]

1 minute ago, Jackie Lee said:

McDaniels did turn that Colts job down right? I think that was fairly desirable until Luck retired abruptly lol

Yeah, the point I was making that there has been a scenario where a coach turned down a job bc of the situation. Meaning it can happen.

 

Andrew Luck retired the year before this though. So that was already on the table. 

Edited November 18, 2022 by TheCasillas

[pantherclaw]

Storied franchises, Like the Cowboys, Packers,  etc.... never have a problem attracting head coaching talent. Not saying they always select the right ones, but there is never a shortage of coaching talent for them to choose from no.matter how bad their team may actually be. 

The Panthers will NEVER be in that situation.  

To answer the OP, there is no question,  getting a great HC is like being flush with trump cards. 

The quartback position will never be as easy as people think it should be. 

Getting the HC and coaching staff correct is paramount.  

They can build a talented team, and acquiring talented potential star QB doesn't require tanking to achieve, ever. 

 

[pantherclaw]

I wanted to add, any head coaching candidate,  is going to feel that they are capable of turning a Franchise around. Honestly, it's these guys that are more highly valued by owners, because being a storied franchise, doesn't prevent that franchise from being historically bad. 

[Mr. Scot]

4 hours ago, mrcompletely11 said:

Good coaches not wanting to go to bad situations is a myth.  

It happens on an annual basis. Brian Daboll, for example, had multiple interviews last offseason and chose the Giants as his best option.

Some coaches decline even to be interviewed. When Rhule was looking for staff, Pep Hamilton was offered an interview but turned it down...and decided to stay with the Texans.

Yes, guys who have options will take the better option. Not sure why that would surprise anybody.

Edited November 18, 2022 by Mr. Scot

[Mr. Scot]

1 hour ago, 1of10Charnatives said:

QB.

And it's not close. 

An awful HC can hamstring your team's ability to compete. A brilliant HC can make your team somewhat more competitive, but the reality is most fall into a range of not brilliant, not awful, but acceptable. Finding a coach who falls into this category is not especially difficult. Getting a top tier QB is orders of magnitude harder because it's orders of magnitude more a crapshoot. The impact that player has on your record is also far greater than all but a few possible coaching options.

The post Tom Brady Patriots make it abundantly clear that Brady was the far bigger factor in the team's success over those years than Bellicheat ever was. 

Sean Payton didn't look like an offensive genius without Brees.

Mike Tomlin has a SB ring, but hardly looks like a world beater without Big Ben.

Get rid of a quarterback and you can sign, draft or trade for another one the following season.

Fire a coach and you have to fire his assistants, remake the entire system, evaluate whether the guys you have on roster will fit the next coach and a dozen other things.

[mrcompletely11]

25 minutes ago, Mr. Scot said:

It happens on an annual basis. Brian Daboll, for example, had multiple interviews last offseason and chose the Giants as his best option.

Some coaches decline even to be interviewed. When Rhule was looking for staff, Pep Hamilton was offered an interview but turned it down...and decided to stay with the Texans.

Yes, guys who have options will take the better option. Not sure why that would surprise anybody.

You do realize a interview is different then a job offer right?

[rippadonn]

Coaching first. This isn't basketball. The best college QB ain't doing a damn thing on his own in the NFL. 

Jerry Richardson pulled the plug that year and induced the tank but it was more his act of defiance during the labor dust up. That got the #1 pick. The Panthers historically have never been in that position because although JR would spend money every other season the franchise stayed away from the bottom.

Some people want to crash the ship into a rock wall to climb all the way up for a "IF". There is no clear franchise QB this draft. There are maybes. Just like last draft. A lot of maybes. Not worth a tank.

 

[1of10Charnatives]

1 hour ago, Mr. Scot said:

Get rid of a quarterback and you can sign, draft or trade for another one the following season.

Fire a coach and you have to fire his assistants, remake the entire system, evaluate whether the guys you have on roster will fit the next coach and a dozen other things.

All of which is still easier than finding an above average starting QB in the NFL. If you don't think so, consider how often teams turn over their coaching staff vs how often they jettison a franchise qb during his prime.

You can sign, draft or trade for another qb the following season yes. But that is a VASTLY different thing from signing, drafting or trading for an above average performing QB.  Tepper has proven JAGs can be had by the bushel. So what? Does that get you where you want to go?

[1of10Charnatives]

2 hours ago, mrcompletely11 said:

Wasnt payton 5-0 with teddy bridgewater?
 

He may have been, but at that point everyone paying attention knows the Saints were winning primarily off the strength of their defense and Kamara's running.  Note the actual statement I made vs the one you most likely assigned me.  Payton did demonstrate some ability to extend his team's ability to win beyond Brees tenure, but no one called him an offensive genius watching Bridgewater, Taysum Hill and Jamies Winston sling the ball. Once Payton realized it was going to be far harder to win without a Pro Bowl QB at the helm, he walked away.