FMIA: Tanking shouldn’t be a dirty word

[trueblade]

Indy getting in on the Stroud/Young sweepstakes?

 

 

[DaveThePanther2008]

3 minutes ago, Growl said:

lol did you just try to pass off Stafford and Manning as mere free agent acquisitions and not the #1 overall pick they are? Or is your plan to trade to spot #199 to lock down our elite QB prospect there

you don’t desire to have an intellectual conversation, and you’ve made this plainly clear not just with this post but your overall sentiment: if you Culture Win people would simply admit it’s an emotional plea then I could at least respect your stance, “I know elite QBs get drafted high, I know it’s not the smart thing to do, but I just want my instant gratification so bad I can’t root for a loss.”

i could respect that. but to twist and reject what is plainly documented and try to present the argument as an intellectual is an insulting to other posters here.

 

It's a valid argument.  Stafford didn't get it done with his original team and Manning was pushed out of Indy.  You have to go back to 2011 season to find a QB that was drafted #1 that won a SB with the team that drafted him.  

You can argue that Manning and Stafford were #1 picks but Manning only won one with his original team and Stafford barely made the playoffs once in a while. 

If you go back even further Peyton is the only other 1st rounder to win the Super Bowl since John Elway with Denver in 1997 and 1998 seasons.

So tanking for #1 is stupid and guarantees nothing. 

[Growl]

5 minutes ago, DaveThePanther2008 said:

Manning was pushed out of Indy.  

mankind is inherently bad

Edited October 24, 2022 by Growl

[DaveThePanther2008]

Just now, Growl said:

man is inherently bad

Tell me I'm wrong.  Manning was on the downside of his career and played poorly in the Super Bowl. Denver's defense won that game.  Remember Von Miller was the MVP not the traditional QB winning the honor.

The Colts could have stayed with Manning after all he won (Goodell going away present) in Denver.  He was a free agent.  That's no different than us signing Stafford or Baker.  Their move paid off, ours didn't.

[Growl]

2 minutes ago, DaveThePanther2008 said:

Tell me I'm wrong.  Manning was on the downside of his career and played poorly in the Super Bowl. Denver's defense won that game.  Remember Von Miller was the MVP not the traditional QB winning the honor.

The Colts could have stayed with Manning after all he won (Goodell going away present) in Denver.  He was a free agent.  That's no different than us signing Stafford or Baker.  Their move paid off, ours didn't.

Peyton Manning is one of the greatest players to ever play the game, won 5 MVPs and a super bowl mvp, you know, in the super bowl he won. He was also the 1st pick in the draft.

this has gone from looking delusional to looking outright manipulative. nobody here is as stupid as you believe they are. Cherry picking a niche standard and a niche goal isn’t going to work, especially when the argument you’ve used doesn’t even support your own position like lol. 

[Growl]

Idk why we have to keep posting the obvious for people

Anon Internet forum guy who thinks he’s outsmarted the entire League and that the magical secret to finding an elite QB is in the 6th round, or wherever you can spend the least.

The numbers have been rammed down these people’s throats time and time again and they won’t accept it. 
 

[davos]

Just now, Growl said:

Idk why we have to keep posting the obvious for people

Anon Internet forum guy who thinks he’s outsmarted the entire League and that the magical secret to finding an elite QB is in the 6th round, or wherever you can spend the least.

The numbers have been rammed down these people’s throats time and time again and they won’t accept it. 
 

For additional support (even though it's not needed), just look at the final four QBs left the past 10 years subtract Brady.  It's legit all high 1st rounders minus Russ, Brees and Cousins. 

[DaveThePanther2008]

3 minutes ago, Growl said:

Peyton Manning is one of the greatest players to ever play the game, won 5 MVPs and a super bowl mvp, you know, in the super bowl he won. He was also the 1st pick in the draft.

this has gone from looking delusional to looking outright manipulative. nobody here is as stupid as you believe they are. Cherry picking a niche standard and a niche goal isn’t going to work, especially when the argument you’ve used doesn’t even support your own position like lol. 

BS

Nobody is nitpicking anything. Manning was a shell of himself when he was with Denver.  A game manager.  He was not the MVP caliber QB he was in Indy.  

The nitpicking is more on your side.  You're using his past as justification Denver won the Super Bowl.  Their defense won that Super Bowl with some help from the NFL.  

Just to satisfy your argument 3 QBs (both Mannings) since Elway in 97 and 98.  

Now what?

[NAS]

44 minutes ago, Captroop said:

Google "Classic Projection"

 

How is it intellectual to say "tank for the #1 QB" when you have no basis to say that's a formula for success? Let's look at the talented QBs in recent memory:

XLVII			Baltimore 34, San Francisco 31 - Flacco Pick #18
XLVIII			Seattle 43, Denver 8 - Wilson - Round 3
XLIX			New England 28, Seattle 24 - Brady - Round 6
50			Denver 24, Carolina 10 - Manning - Free Agency
LI			New England 34, Atlanta 28 - Brady - Round 6
LII			Philadelphia 41, New England 33 - Foles - Round 3
LIII			New England 13, Los Angeles Rams 3 - Brady - Round 6
LIV			Kansas City 31, San Francisco 20 - Mahomes - Pick #10
LV			Tampa Bay 31, Kansas City 9 - Brady - Free Agency
LVI			Los Angeles Rams 23, Cincinnati 20 - Stafford - Free Agency

 

So go ahead, intellectually explain how tanking for the #1 QB is the super duper sure-fire smart solution. If you want a stud QB who will get you a title, buy one in free agency. Get Lamar.

If you want to develop a winning talented QB, odds are he's not the first QB off the board.

So Cam Newton was not worth the 2-14 season in 2010 because we failed to win the Superbowl? Or Joe Burrow to Bengals at #1?

[DaveThePanther2008]

3 minutes ago, Growl said:

Idk why we have to keep posting the obvious for people

Anon Internet forum guy who thinks he’s outsmarted the entire League and that the magical secret to finding an elite QB is in the 6th round, or wherever you can spend the least.

The numbers have been rammed down these people’s throats time and time again and they won’t accept it. 
 

NO NO NO NO NO, don't change the argument.  The argument is winning Super Bowls.  

[Growl]

8 minutes ago, DaveThePanther2008 said:

BS

Nobody is nitpicking anything. Manning was a shell of himself when he was with Denver.  A game manager.  He was not the MVP caliber QB he was in Indy.  

The nitpicking is more on your side.  You're using his past as justification Denver won the Super Bowl.  Their defense won that Super Bowl with some help from the NFL.  

Just to satisfy your argument 3 QBs (both Mannings) since Elway in 97 and 98.  

Now what?

Im “using” his past because im evaluating him as a player and thus his body of work, im doing this because my goal isn’t to weaponize one angle of a bad argument to try and prop up an argument I’ve dug my heels too deep in on to admit im wrong, but to consider Peyton Manning as a whole relative to his draft position, because im less concerned with good feelies and culture wins and more concerned with pulling for a team that isn’t a total embarrassment 

Edited October 24, 2022 by Growl

[DaveThePanther2008]

1 minute ago, NAS said:

So Cam Newton was not worth the 2-14 season in 2010 because we failed to win the Superbowl? Or Joe Burrow to Bengals at #1?

The argument has been winning the ultimate prize the Super Bowl.  You guys that want to tank so bad are facing the reality that Tanking does not guarantee a Super Bowl nor does it guarantee a Franchise QB. 

[Growl]

1 minute ago, DaveThePanther2008 said:

NO NO NO NO NO, don't change the argument.  The argument is winning Super Bowls.  

lol somebody is triggered now

eat the ole hurtz donut my man before you embarrass yourself anymore.

as I said, literally all you had to do was say “I just can’t emotionally process the big picture” and I would’ve gotten it, nobody here likes losing. 
 

but it is insulting to the people here to act as if there is some sort of intellectual backing to picking a franchise QB later in the draft versus the top and as long as you continue to disrespect peoples intelligence you’re going to get called out for it

[Growl]

“NO NO NO NO focus in on this, look away, don’t look at the inconvenient truth behind the curtain!”