Trade deadline

[TheCasillas]

1 minute ago, Krovvy said:

We've been one win from having both a few seasons now.

 

I can see the Justin Herbet, but that was RR's doing. What was the other QB we were 1 win from getting?

[mrcompletely11]

3 minutes ago, TheCasillas said:

CJ on film looks really good when the ball doesnt come his direction.

[Krovvy]

2 minutes ago, TheCasillas said:

I can see the Justin Herbet, but that was RR's doing. What was the other QB we were 1 win from getting?

In 2021 we could have lost one more and been in contention for one of the big three drafted. Regardless of how well they're playing, we didn't take a shot. The only way you get a quarterback is if you take a shot.

[raleigh-panther]

20 minutes ago, TheCasillas said:

If you look at our roster though... the overvalued and overpaid  barely exists. The 4 highest players who are on our team are Shaq, CMC, Moton, and Robbie. The rest of the roster is highly affordable. Those four players are 100 million in cap next year. Who else are we going to ship out to get draft picks and save money in the process?

 

Shaq and Robbie are gone after this year and we are able to save  25 million across both of them by moving on. 

No loss and neither  is Christian  split his salary and move him   Better for him  better for the Panthers 

The salary cap seems to not matter to  other teams.  Not sure why it is a death knoll for the panthers year after year   Not sure what benefit it had  in being under this year 

 

Edited October 10, 2022 by raleigh-panther

[TheCasillas]

3 minutes ago, mrcompletely11 said:

That means he covered the reciever well... that they werent open for the ball to get thrown his way....

[mrcompletely11]

5 minutes ago, TheCasillas said:

That means he covered the reciever well... that they werent open for the ball to get thrown his way....

you may want to relay that info to pff

 

https://www.pff.com/nfl/players/cj-henderson/55593

 

46

 

we gave up a 3rd for a corner with a 46 rating. 

 

2022 3rd round cb's

Martin Emerson - 69

Marcus Jones - 62

Cordale Flott - 59

Edited October 10, 2022 by mrcompletely11

[TheCasillas]

4 minutes ago, Krovvy said:

In 2021 we could have lost one more and been in contention for one of the big three drafted. Regardless of how well they're playing, we didn't take a shot. The only way you get a quarterback is if you take a shot.

one loss would have put us at the 7th spot in that draft, jsut move us up one spot. We would have had the exact pick of the options we had at 8th. Our SOS was higher that the rest of the teams picking ahead of us. 

 

Which QB could we have picked in 2021?

[Krovvy]

1 minute ago, TheCasillas said:

one loss would have put us at the 7th spot in that draft, jsut move us up one spot. We would have had the exact pick of the options we had at 8th. Our SOS was higher that the rest of the teams picking ahead of us. 

 

Which QB could we have picked in 2021?

Oh, you're just arguing to try to argue. Okay then, we should have packed it up and traded a couple players, insuring we lost two games. Now what?

Why do you bother posting this? Were you gravely wrong the last couple of years on drafting a quarterback prospect or pushing for late season wins or something? Someone help me here, I don't keep up with every poster on this board anymore. This feels like this person is defending a position that they've been wrong about numerous times.

It's the NFL. The quarterback is the most important position in all of sports. You need one to consistently win, and the Panthers should do everything in their power to draft one this off-season.

 

[TheCasillas]

Just now, mrcompletely11 said:

you may want to relay that info to pff

 

https://www.pff.com/nfl/players/cj-henderson/55593

 

46

the data is right there... only targeted 16 times..  ofc his score is going to be bad with the PIs. You watch off ball footage of CJ and you can see that he is a solid man coverage corner.  He has played as much as Donte Jackson and had less targets (CJ and Donte have played very close to the same amount of snap counts). He has had less targets than a lot of corners in the league. 

If CJ doesn't have those PIs , the only thing we are talking about when it comes to him is that awful attempt to tackle yesterday. 

[SmokinwithWilly]

19 minutes ago, mrcompletely11 said:

Julian Council from Lockedon has done an indepth review of all of Fitts moves and will be doing a podcast about it this week.  Not sure now since the firing but the brief recap of it doesnt sound very positive.

 

I mean when you look at it what is one trade where he has really won?  I aint seeing it. 

Here's the way I see it with Fitts. He wasn't really trading from an advantageous point on most of the trades. 

Little and Daley were both win trades. Guys we were going to cut and he got something instead of nothing. 

Gilmore for a 5th. Now that one I get because we had a lot of young guys in our CB room and Gilmore was DPoY. There's knowledge there that can't be coached. I don't have an issue there really. 

CJ Henderson. We lost horn. He wasn't doing well in Jax. Top 10 pick in a poo show run by an even bigger poo show. He's brought here. He has the skills. But we also had Rhule who had shown repeatedly he didn't know how to play to his players strengths. CJ is better press than man. CB is also one of the longest transitioning positions from college. Right now it's not as good as we could have hoped, but it's also not as bad as it could have been. 

Darnold. We were forced to trade because we had no one other than PJ and Grier. When you're desperate, it's a bad position to be in. You have no leverage in a trade because you can't really walk with what's available on the roster. Jets had us over a barrel and knew it. We got fleeced because we traded T2G with no other plan in place. 

Baker. The result of an owner that mortgaged everything for a QB that didn't want to be here. Baker took a pay cut to come here, which made it work for us, which was a good part of the trade. And for a 5th, potential 4th, it wasn't a bad price for a starting QB. Again though, everyone knew Darnold was poo and had to be replaced. No leverage again and we needed someone because all we had was, well, PJ. He's a QB with issues after we've already played 4 QBs in 2 years. Add in RPO is not his game and never has been, and the pairing with McAdoo makes zero sense. 

Corral. I think his hope in trading up for MC was that we would have time to develop him and while he wouldn't be a starting QB yet, he has potential and we needed a more viable backup. Again though, this trade was influenced by poor QB decisions with Cam, T2G, and Sam. 

But these trades also can't be looked at strictly in a vacuum. The big part of all of this is Rhule and his complete mismanagement of the roster. Baker is the worst QB to bring in for McAdoo's system. It's hard to use a RPO offense with a QB that can't run. Add in pointless "competitions", lack of reps all over, playing guys out of position, stubbornness that makes Rivera look flexible like a gymnast, going with his gut instead of watching film, it all just adds up. 

Rhule's incompetency can't be understated or underestimated. I knew last year watching the last game presser, Fitts was not happy with the way things were going. The guy has been in a tough spot taking a job no one else wanted with an owner that's interfered the entire way and a head coach with personnel control. 

He hasn't won trades, but at the same time, we were never negotiating from a position of strength. 

[TheCasillas]

2 minutes ago, Krovvy said:

Oh, you're just arguing to try to argue. Okay then, we should have packed it up and traded a couple players, insuring we lost two games. Now what?

Why do you bother posting this? Were you gravely wrong the last couple of years on drafting a quarterback prospect or pushing for late season wins or something? Someone help me here, I don't keep up with every poster on this board anymore. This feels like this person is defending a position that they've been wrong about numerous times.

It's the NFL. The quarterback is the most important position in all of sports. You need one to consistently win, and the Panthers should do everything in their power to draft one this off-season.

 

I am just attempting to understand where you are getting your information. Bc some of it appears to be made up.  This whole conversation has stemmed from you saying: We've been one win from having both a few seasons now. 

and I was just curious who were these qbs you are speaking of....

Edited October 10, 2022 by TheCasillas

[mrcompletely11]

Just now, Scum of the Turf said:

No, I disagree, our good parts are better than potential.  Build through free agency

with what money?

[Krovvy]

Just now, TheCasillas said:

I am just attempting to understand where you are getting your information. Bc some of it appears to be made up.  This whole conversation has stemmed from you saying: We've been one win from having both a few seasons now. 

and I was just curious who were these qbs you are speaking of....

No, you're ignoring the basic message that I've circled back to time and time again for pedantic reasons to try and 'win' an argument without actually addressing the point. It's annoying, it's some nerd poo. The Panthers could have had a quarterback prospect had they actually had tried to acquire draft capital and looked beyond the current regular season. They did not, instead they traded capital to win a nominal number of games.

You still don't want to address it or anyone that's relating to it. You've torpedoed the entire thread with this bullshit.

[Evil Hurney]

I'd prefer to keep most of the roster in-tact. It's largely talented and cheap.

Robbie, Shaq, CMC are your big ticket items that I'd entertain trades for.  Guys on expiring contracts can also go for the right price (e.g. Erving, Bozeman, Elflein)

I also strongly suspect that the team will find a way to sit Baker so they don't have to pay the 4th round escalator.