How Fox could keep his job (even with 4-12)

[Cyberjag]

Like Zod said in a couple of post up from here... Keeping Fox can be BAD business. Their were ALOT of empty seats against the Falcons, and that was a division game, with the Panthers still in the hunt. Now going forward the stadium is going to be 1/2 full and maybe worse. If Fox is back next year, no matter what the fans that are not going now wont go next season for awhile. It will take probably 1/2 season before they come back and the is assuming the team is really good. Otherwise it will be a complete season of an empty stadium and that is BAD business. With a new coaching regime, and hopefully QB there will be an anticipation and excitement from day one.

I was alluding to the fact there there may be a potential strike. If there is, coaches still get paid, which would mean Richardson would be paying two guys to do nothing on Sunday instead of just paying one. It's all speculation, I was speculating.

And I've been to all the games this year. The stadium seemed half empty at times last year, even though we were doing great. You need to look at concession numbers rather than empty seats, that's the only thing that can give you an accurate picture of what's going on.

[unicar15]

This is the only thing you need to say. All of the Fox hot seat statements have been pure speculation. It convinces people to buy papers, but it doesn't make them any smarter having read it.

You have ten teams with losing records, and every single one of them that has fired their coach has a losing record right now. The ones that kept their coach are a combined 21-12. I don't think you're making the point you think you are here.

Giving Fox a pass may in fact be good business. No one knows better than Jerry what the impact of the CBA expiring will be. He could go out and hire someone and have to buy out Fox's contract, only to pay that person to sit at home WHILE he's paying Fox for the last year of his contract. That's not good business, is it?

See point one--it's all speculation. If Richardson wants to keep Fox, he can, and he won't have to come up with a good reason to do so.

I don't think any of the teams that fired their coaches have nearly the talent on their roster that we do.

I have mixed feelings about Fox because it was his call to keep Delhomme. It has been his call to waste an entire season with Delhomme. And it has been his call to NEVER draft a capable heir at the QB position.

As far as the teams that kept their coaches have good records...they also were in different situations than we are in now. The thing that differentiates us from the Bengals and Packers of last year are that they have their future at QB set. We don't...and its because of John Fox that we don't.

I refuse to sit here and accept more seasons of John Fox not making the playoffs every other year. Especially when Bill Cowher is sitting out there and has thick ties to this organization and this state.

[Hayden Panettiere]

I think Fox will be back next year. Fox gets his last chance to do something and JR can now put some major heat on him because of that fact. If that doesn't make a coach preform nothing will.

It does make me sick we have to deal with run/play action x 100000000 for the next year but at least the d will be solid.

I truly believe the only major change is going to be Delhomme. And while I would like to see Fox gone for being an idiot, as a business man this would make more sense.

if matt moore is our qb from here out and next season then I can live with Fox for one more year. I think alot of our problems was cause of jake take him out and we are easily a playoff team.

[CRA]

I think we'll see Fox next year and if we do, I won't be angry. That said, if he's gone, I'll understand the decision.

Look at it this way. Fox likes his guys. So we kept his guys (Delhomme, Peppers). It didn't exactly work out. We bet on the wrong horse.. whatever.

I still feel like Hurney is a really good GM, and that Fox is a good coach. He's not perfect but nobody is. How much better do we get with another coach? I'm not sure. But what I do know is that Fox can win here.

not sure Peppers qualifies as a "Fox guy". Fox simply needed him b/c he has lost so much talent up front and never has replaced it will equal caliber playmakers.

[PantherDude]

This actually makes sense to me. Better to give Foxy the last year and simply not re-sign him if he doesn't turn it around. That way, not only does Jerry not have to "fire" someone, if there's a work stoppage, the organization might save money on the new staff.

Yep. I wouldn't be surprise if he stay here another season because of his contract. Perhaps maybe that why JR haven't got rid of him yet. I'm sure if we don't get to the Playoffs again next season with Fox, JR will not give him a new contract & look for a new coach. And Jake would still be here because of his contract as well, but he can sit on the bench instead. Doesn't it cost a lot to buy out any of their contract? I know Jake is worth more than Fox, so if it cost quite a bunch to terminate Jake's contract, we would have trouble looking for a good player in the Draft or Free Agents or whatever.

[Nu Guns]

He needs to go and so does Hurney. Off-season was terrible and the season is even worse. Beason ,Davis and Smitty going to want to stay with this regime?

[beastson]

Who knows. John Fox is an excellent coach if you ignore the fact that he ignored the need to groom a young QB for so long.

Either sarcasm

or

Child please!

[Lords0fPain]

Of course we'll most likely have a winning season next, we play all the OTHER losers from this year. Need to really look at our history and when we have winning season. We simply have more overall talent than the other teams. It's a pattern and we should be able to do better. Think people are just plain sick of Fox Ball and with signing Fake (and not benching him) to the contract he got was the straw that broke the camels back.

[Urrymonster]

I don't think any of the teams that fired their coaches have nearly the talent on their roster that we do.

That is such a completely irrelevant comment. It is pure speculation, your own opinion and you know this teams players like the back of your hand. Even Oakland has some genuine stars on it's roster, Aso & Seymour are prime examples.

So you really can't say that the teams that fired their coaches had less talent. Saying that is just pure fluff, with no basis at all. Could be that you see some of our players with the fan goggles on, after all, Beason of all people, has had a somewhat dissapointing season.

One thing Cowher supporters need to realise is that ZERO superbowl winning coaches have then gone on to repeat with a different team. Cowher also employs a very similar style of football to Fox, ground based possession football with defenses focused on stopping the run. Having been out the league for the duration he has, I just do not believe he will suddenly adapt to the now high scoring NFL. Frankly I think we will be trading for a coach who is essentially a similar coach and thus achieve nothing. He has allegedly stated IF he goes back, he wants an established QB. It appears he is not looking at a long time project.

[grateflday]

............One thing Cowher supporters need to realise is that ZERO superbowl winning coaches have then gone on to repeat with a different team. Cowher also employs a very similar style of football to Fox, ground based possession football with defenses focused on stopping the run. Having been out the league for the duration he has, I just do not believe he will suddenly adapt to the now high scoring NFL. Frankly I think we will be trading for a coach who is essentially a similar coach and thus achieve nothing. He has allegedly stated IF he goes back, he wants an established QB. It appears he is not looking at a long time project.

First I am not one who thinks Cowher is the answer. He might be a better alternative to Fox, but not sure yet. What I do feel is that it IS time to move on from the John Fox era - 3 winning season out of last 7 (if you included this one) just doesnt cut it.

Now while a coach has never won the superbowl with 2 different teams, there is always a first time for everyting. Five coaches have led 2 different teams:

Don Shula, Colts & Miami

Bill Parcells, Giants & Patriots

Dick Vermeil, Eagles & Rams

Dan Reeves, Broncos & Falcons

Mike Holmgren, Packers & Seahawks

[Kevin Greene]

Fox's only hope is that he can convince JR that he will be able to find or already has a great replacement for Jake. Jake right now is an anchor around his neck. Fox sticking with the worst QB in the league week after week has shown extremely poor judgement.

If both Fox and Delhomme are back next season, ticket sales will be the worst in team history. If Fox is back next season without Delhomme, there may be a chance for excitement.

Yeah with the team of Fox and Delhomme, and then throw in Hurney and Franchising Peppers which would not allow for any improvements to the team, then Carolina might be facing black outs of home games.

[Urrymonster]

First I am not one who thinks Cowher is the answer. He might be a better alternative to Fox, but not sure yet. What I do feel is that it IS time to move on from the John Fox era - 3 winning season out of last 7 (if you included this one) just doesnt cut it.

Now while a coach has never won the superbowl with 2 different teams, there is always a first time for everyting. Five coaches have led 2 different teams:

Don Shula, Colts & Miami

Bill Parcells, Giants & Patriots

Dick Vermeil, Eagles & Rams

Dan Reeves, Broncos & Falcons

Mike Holmgren, Packers & Seahawks

Fully agree with you.

I was just following the discussion of the thread, which is that Fox 'could' keep his job.

[grateflday]

Fully agree with you.

I was just following the discussion of the thread, which is that Fox 'could' keep his job.

I hear ya... and oh how I hope not :eek: I do think though it is a possbility, I can see it happening.

[Mr. Scot]

First I am not one who thinks Cowher is the answer. He might be a better alternative to Fox, but not sure yet. What I do feel is that it IS time to move on from the John Fox era - 3 winning season out of last 7 (if you included this one) just doesnt cut it.

Now while a coach has never won the superbowl with 2 different teams, there is always a first time for everyting. Five coaches have led 2 different teams:

Don Shula, Colts & Miami

Bill Parcells, Giants & Patriots

Dick Vermeil, Eagles & Rams

Dan Reeves, Broncos & Falcons

Mike Holmgren, Packers & Seahawks

Understood, but I don't really want to bet the future on us being the first team to do something no one else has ever done.

Winning a Super Bowl is generally a right combination of coach, players, system and a lot of luck. It's not an easy thing for someone to duplicate after having it in their first job. Look at Jimmy Johnson in Miami, Dick Vermeil in Kansas City, Bill Parcells in Dallas, etc.

Percentages tend to be better going the other way and building your own system.