More are starting to believe in the Panthers

[Asaria]

1 hour ago, saX man said:

We've built a top-half of league roster that can be capable of winning ~10-9 games in a best case.  We're set up for a dead end; maybe finding a QB in Baker.  But Baker is most likely what we've seen from him, it's unlikely he'll become some 35 TD QB instantly for us so are we really gonna dish him $35+ mil next year? 

Mays put it best on The Athletic Football Pod; the Panthers have a middle of the league roster built with no plan, and to what end? He emphasized we'll be competent, entirely respectable this year, but "to what end" a few times and that it really doesn't seem like this regime has a plan in place.  Joked about Rhule talking about "establishing the run" then doing the opposite.  Outsiders see it. for what it is.  

Mike Sando asked him in what circumstance he could see Rhule staying? He said "the entire fabric of the universe needs to change" lol.

You seem fun at parties

[Sgt Schultz]

26 minutes ago, CRA said:

Yeah.  It’s weird. 
 

it still reflects us as one for the bottom teams in the NFC.  Just not the absolute gutter.

The hope is captured in this video at about the :30 mark.

Somebody commented that we've built a fast defense to handle the "modern NFL."  That works well, right up until you play a team that can push you around and stuff the ball down your throats because you are fast, but don't have the brawn to control the line.  Just like what almost always happens in the playoffs.

I've heard the "modern NFL" for years, but the fact is if you can't control the line or at least hold your own, good teams will exploit that.  We have to prove we are up to that task.  Until then, the pieces are just getting smaller.

[Gash]

49 minutes ago, Wundrbread33 said:

That’s a nonsensical take. 
 

Of course they have a plan. So Rhule says one thing and does another at times. Welcome to coaching. It’s not going to be spoon fed for reporters. 
 

The team has added talent each year and we are full of athletic young talented guys.

 

How many coaching staffs are currently getting bailed out by having the most important position taken care of? Rhule and his staff hasn’t had that luxury. Also, arguably the best weapon in football has barely seen the field the first two years of his tenure. 
 

We have built a fast defense with emphasis on defending the modern NFL with focus on secondary. This is probably the best secondary we have ever fielded (on paper). We have fast/quick edge rushers. We need Brown to step up, but he was a top 10 pick so we tried there.

 

Aside from QB, what held this team back was offensive play calling and o-line play, and both received heavy focus and were addressed: the season will play out how well it was addressed.

 

But saying there is no plan is lazy, biased, and honestly just piling on to what’s hot right now: Rhules coaching seat. 

Truth.

[PappyMay]

I’m choosing to be positive. Really think we are a wildcard team if CMC and Baker stay healthy. Also really trusting in Fitterer. Would love to see us trade down to late first and grab some more draft capital and keep building this thing out.

[onmyown]

it’s so nice to hear the take of our resident wine a cheese posters who will be gone in a month if we’re losing, spoiler alert: it’s the same ‘everyone is wrong we’re tEh best wEve evEr beeeEn on paPerZ!’ poo as every year

like do you guys really think anyone takes what you post seriously?

let real fans discuss plz

Edited September 3, 2022 by onmyown

[saX man]

1 hour ago, Wundrbread33 said:

That’s a nonsensical take. 
 

Of course they have a plan. So Rhule says one thing and does another at times. Welcome to coaching. It’s not going to be spoon fed for reporters. 
 

The team has added talent each year and we are full of athletic young talented guys.

 

How many coaching staffs are currently getting bailed out by having the most important position taken care of? Rhule and his staff hasn’t had that luxury. Also, arguably the best weapon in football has barely seen the field the first two years of his tenure. 
 

We have built a fast defense with emphasis on defending the modern NFL with focus on secondary. This is probably the best secondary we have ever fielded (on paper). We have fast/quick edge rushers. We need Brown to step up, but he was a top 10 pick so we tried there.

 

Aside from QB, what held this team back was offensive play calling and o-line play, and both received heavy focus and were addressed: the season will play out how well it was addressed.

 

But saying there is no plan is lazy, biased, and honestly just piling on to what’s hot right now: Rhules coaching seat. 

Again, we've elevated our team, it's a solid roster, could be a wildcard.  Some great core pieces and the defense (especially DBs) is promising.  But where is this hodgepodge of a situation going? I don't see how asking that is some off-putting take, it's reality.  Could be decent, elevated our floor, but we're not contending.  

And I'm sorry, but I don't see what this bigger picture overarching plan/process is. It doesn't take disliking Rhule to see this, hence why my posts are referencing an outsider take of one of the most in-depth sports podcasts in the country.  People see what the deal is.  We've reworked the offense (again), new QB (again) new OC, and it seems more promising than the first few attempts.  

I'm not saying they need to spell anything out for us, it just doesn't seem like there's been much of a multi-phased plan.  It's pretty clear, just different swings each year.  What's the plan on offense? Heck, what type of offense do we want to run? What is the ideal personnel?  Where does this "build" we've done actually go?

We're over the 2023 cap with only Corral's rookie deal on the books at QB.  We've just been taking different stabs at different QBs, we've had continuous turnover.  I just don't think we have a plan.  I mean, the new OC has had 1 consulting position for 1 season in the NFL since 2017.  

I will give the situation time, and we could have a winning record with a good find in Baker, but is that going to look like a long term solution? Baker & Rhule?  

I'm ready to go, ready to see some better football from us.  We'll see, but they've got more to prove than to sustain.

 

[joemac]

1 hour ago, saX man said:

Yup.  He's saying we're setting ourselves up to be competent rather than a contender.  So in a way, your bolded is correct.  Issue being, it may be a job saving approach rather than contender building approach and our build with him seems messy, reactive, and ill-planned.  However, you're right in that it doesn't mean he can't improve, if we win, people could change their tune on Rhule.  He was really liked after the AZ game his first year, and again after 3-0 last year.  

My biggest concern is we've been operating like a fringe/high-level contender with the way we've been throwing around our assets and not really seeing results/we keep stopping our own momentum.  

My memory gets fuzzy pre-99ish since I was 12ish and it's just hard to clearly think back on that long ago, but this team does look to be the best we've fielded in some time. So the experience of the new staff and experienced players may propel us to 9/10 wins.

I'll stay hopeful, but it's an odd spot to be in.  Rhule on the hot seat, Corral being our only QB signed on for 23, will need some roster movement/cap adjustments to make room for Baker, but he's still TBD. 

If we go 10-7 wildcard and he has a 4000/28TD/14INT type line, are we happy? I just don't know.  9-8 just miss out, Baker looks decent is the base line expectation considering this roster.  

Time will tell! Excited for the year regardless.

I think if we go 9-8 or something like that, and Baker puts up those kinda numbers then yes, I would be very happy. That would be an incredible improvement from what we’ve seen the past 3 or 4 years. And would give a lot of hope for the future. I think I would be comfortable with Rhule staying and resigning Baker to a multi year contract at that point. But, that’s a long way from today so we just gotta enjoy the ride and see what happens!

[joemac]

8 minutes ago, onmyown said:

it’s so nice to hear the take of our resident wine a cheese posters who will be gone in a month if we’re losing, spoiler alert: it’s the same ‘everyone is wrong we’re tEh best wEve evEr beeeEn on paPerZ!’ poo as every year

like do you guys really think anyone takes what you post seriously?

let real fans discuss plz

Lol Ok bro. 

[saX man]

1 minute ago, joemac said:

I think if we go 9-8 or something like that, and Baker puts up those kinda numbers then yes, I would be very happy. That would be an incredible improvement from what we’ve seen the past 3 or 4 years. And would give a lot of hope for the future. I think I would be comfortable with Rhule staying and resigning Baker to a multi year contract at that point. But, that’s a long way from today so we just gotta enjoy the ride and see what happens!

If we go 8-9/9-8, no playoffs and Baker looks good enough, it puts us arguably in the toughest spot to be in.  This is the season we need to decide: Are we simply able to win a bit with the guys we have or do we have guys that can lead us to where we need to go (staff and core players)? If it's the former, then we need to move on.  That's the deciding factor for Tepper this season from my view.

Would a season with that record and an above average season for Baker really merit signing him to a multi-year deal? Also, the floor expectation for Baker is different than the floor for Rhule which makes it tricky.  So if Baker looks good, but the overall team underachieves again, do we really rework contracts, move on from other talent to throw a fancy contract at him? And then possibly find a new coach? It's just a tough spot even if we improve a bit.  We need to outperform expectations to feel successful and my expectation is a winning season and playoff berth.  Maybe we pull it off.  I'm lukewarm.  

[Sgt Schultz]

41 minutes ago, PappyMay said:

I’m choosing to be positive. Really think we are a wildcard team if CMC and Baker stay healthy. Also really trusting in Fitterer. Would love to see us trade down to late first and grab some more draft capital and keep building this thing out.

Ideally, if Mayfield has a 2020-esque season, that becomes an option.  That assumes we can resign him.  I still think we will be QB shopping in the draft, but it would be nice to do so looking for a backup that has that "who knows how far he can go" standpoint rather than a starter.

Add to that equation that our OL gels and puts us in a position we don't need an immediate starter.

If those two areas take care of themselves, we have some options on draft day that we have not had in a while.

[Panthers Rhule]

1 hour ago, onmyown said:

it’s so nice to hear the take of our resident wine a cheese posters who will be gone in a month if we’re losing, spoiler alert: it’s the same ‘everyone is wrong we’re tEh best wEve evEr beeeEn on paPerZ!’ poo as every year

like do you guys really think anyone takes what you post seriously?

let real fans discuss plz

You said that before about people gone in a month. You must think it's clever if you're repeating it. Just a heads up. It's not.  

Edited September 3, 2022 by Panthers Rhule

[DaveThePanther2008]

1 hour ago, onmyown said:

it’s so nice to hear the take of our resident wine a cheese posters who will be gone in a month if we’re losing, spoiler alert: it’s the same ‘everyone is wrong we’re tEh best wEve evEr beeeEn on paPerZ!’ poo as every year

like do you guys really think anyone takes what you post seriously?

let real fans discuss plz

Real fan? Because you are pessimistic? please.  There was a time when posters like you said Carolina would never get a franchise.  There was a time when posters said we would never go to the Super Bowl. I've been a fan from the beginning and have been on this forum since 2004 and each year I have been optimistic during good and bad seasons.  I AM A REAL FAN!!!!  

SPOILER ALERT!!!!  Your opinion is exactly that an opinion.  You nor I have no idea how this season will turn out until they play the game.  You might be right, and you might be wrong.  And even if you are right, it doesn't make you any more a real fan than anyone else.  

You can say the same thing about the traditional "the sky is falling group." That no matter how much more talent we add in the offseason we are always going to suck.  What's worse about this group is they stick around and post in this forum as if they knew it all along that we going to be better this year. 

I would never call myself a"Wine and Cheese poster"  I would call myself an eternal optimist. 

Sure, it's a tough schedule but guess what our entire division plays the same schedule, and we have 3 opponents that were last in their division last year. 

Gotta play well, stay healthy and hope for an exciting season.

 

[Panthers Rhule]

49 minutes ago, DaveThePanther2008 said:

Real fan? Because you are pessimistic? please.  There was a time when posters like you said Carolina would never get a franchise.  There was a time when posters said we would never go to the Super Bowl. I've been a fan from the beginning and have been on this forum since 2004 and each year I have been optimistic during good and bad seasons.  I AM A REAL FAN!!!!  

SPOILER ALERT!!!!  Your opinion is exactly that an opinion.  You nor I have no idea how this season will turn out until they play the game.  You might be right, and you might be wrong.  And even if you are right, it doesn't make you any more a real fan than anyone else.  

You can say the same thing about the traditional "the sky is falling group." That no matter how much more talent we add in the offseason we are always going to suck.  What's worse about this group is they stick around and post in this forum as if they knew it all along that we going to be better this year. 

I would never call myself a"Wine and Cheese poster"  I would call myself an eternal optimist. 

Sure, it's a tough schedule but guess what our entire division plays the same schedule, and we have 3 opponents that were last in their division last year. 

Gotta play well, stay healthy and hope for an exciting season.

 

Amen Brother!

 

[glenwo2]

4 hours ago, frankw said:

I'll begin to believe it when we are the ones outcoaching teams instead of the other way around. Until then we go as far as Rhule can muster on gamedays.

We'll go as far as Baker staying healthy and not getting turned into roadkill by the O-Line.