Matt Rhule hate....

[Mr. Scot]

18 hours ago, Captroop said:

Okay, if you're going to bring up rookie mistakes as failure in coaching (as though we hold rookie players to the same standard) then I'd counter that not repeating those mistakes is representative of a positive in terms of his coaching ability.

He didn't build the O-Line. The GM and the available free agents did. And that's not even a slight on Fitt. There was no one on the market we could practicably get.

...And really? Cam is the hill you're gonna choose to die on? Are you really going to hold up not renewing Cam as a failure of coaching? Knowing what we know now, moving on from Cam was 100% the right move. And Teddy was really the only option.

Rhule made mistakes, I grant you, and from where I'm sitting he's not repeating them.

However, regardless of what his moves were, no one was coming into the situation in Carolina and succeeding the last 2 years. NFL-experienced coordinators or not, he would have been rolling with broken down Cam or Teddy, and the best O-Line the FA market would bear out.

The OL that he built with Erving and Elflein didn't happen in his rookie season. It happened in his second.

And sorry dude, but if the primary point of your argument is that he's learned from his mistakes and is improving, year two should have been better than year one. Not only was the record in that year the same, but the team actually looked worse.

I get wanting to be optimistic about the team, but I'm somebody that has to have a reason for that.

When it comes to Matt Rhule and his coaching, I just don't have one.

[Mr. Scot]

17 hours ago, poundaway said:

For us it doesn't matter what the "generally speaking historically" says.

Keep in mind that mindset would also make the "Matt Rhule typically starts winning in year three" argument meaningless.

[Captroop]

1 hour ago, Mr. Scot said:

The OL that he built with Erving and Elflein didn't happen in his rookie season. It happened in his second.

And sorry dude, but if the primary point of your argument is that he's learned from his mistakes and is improving, year two should have been better than year one. Not only was the record in that year the same, but the team actually looked worse.

I get wanting to be optimistic about the team, but I'm somebody that has to have a reason for that.

When it comes to Matt Rhule and his coaching, I just don't have one.

And I'm someone who believes that you can't judge someone for not performing well in a bad situation. And rationalize however you want, but the Panthers were in a bad situation. You're stepping into the post-Cam, Post-Luke, Post Gettleman/Hurney 2.0 era. That's a mess you have to clean up, and it was never going to happen overnight. That's a New Years Day in Times Square level mess.

If you want to look at 2020 and 2021 assume that's indicative of his future performance, that's fine. I'm judging by what I'm seeing in 2022, and it's correcting a lot of his mistakes in the past.

The only arguments I'm hearing at all against Rhule are "shoulda." He shoulda done this, he shoulda done that. Well that's the past. It's a new year. If he flops he flops. But I just don't have a reason to be as pessimistic as people in this thread choose to be.

[mrcompletely11]

1 minute ago, Captroop said:

And I'm someone who believes that you can't judge someone for not performing well in a bad situation. And rationalize however you want, but the Panthers were in a bad situation. You're stepping into the post-Cam, Post-Luke, Post Gettleman/Hurney 2.0 era. That's a mess you have to clean up, and it was never going to happen overnight. That's a New Years Day in Times Square level mess.

If you want to look at 2020 and 2021 assume that's indicative of his future performance, that's fine. I'm judging by what I'm seeing in 2022, and it's correcting a lot of his mistakes in the past.

The only arguments I'm hearing at all against Rhule are "shoulda." He shoulda done this, he shoulda done that. Well that's the past. It's a new year. If he flops he flops. But I just don't have a reason to be as pessimistic as people in this thread choose to be.

What mistakes has he shown to be correcting?

[Green-Ghost]

I predict that Rhule will be fired at the end of the season. The Panthers will hire Sean Payton to be their new head coach.

i can’t see Sean going to Dallas unless he wants to end his friendship with Jerry

[Green-Ghost]

Just now, Green-Ghost said:

I predict that Rhule will be fired at the end of the season. The Panthers will hire Sean Payton to be their new head coach.

i can’t see Sean going to Dallas unless he wants to end his friendship with Jerry

Sean will resurrect the Panthers and make them the new powerhouse!

[Captroop]

Just now, mrcompletely11 said:

What mistakes has he shown to be correcting?

 

I literally spelled them out point for point on the last post you quoted me on.

[mrcompletely11]

6 minutes ago, Captroop said:

And I'm someone who believes that you can't judge someone for not performing well in a bad situation. And rationalize however you want, but the Panthers were in a bad situation. You're stepping into the post-Cam, Post-Luke, Post Gettleman/Hurney 2.0 era. That's a mess you have to clean up, and it was never going to happen overnight. That's a New Years Day in Times Square level mess.

If you want to look at 2020 and 2021 assume that's indicative of his future performance, that's fine. I'm judging by what I'm seeing in 2022, and it's correcting a lot of his mistakes in the past.

The only arguments I'm hearing at all against Rhule are "shoulda." He shoulda done this, he shoulda done that. Well that's the past. It's a new year. If he flops he flops. But I just don't have a reason to be as pessimistic as people in this thread choose to be.

this post?

 

thats point by point?

[Captroop]

1 minute ago, mrcompletely11 said:

this post?

 

thats point by point?

This post. The one you very cleverly responded to by writing "lol"

 

[Mr. Scot]

10 minutes ago, Captroop said:

And I'm someone who believes that you can't judge someone for not performing well in a bad situation. And rationalize however you want, but the Panthers were in a bad situation. You're stepping into the post-Cam, Post-Luke, Post Gettleman/Hurney 2.0 era. That's a mess you have to clean up, and it was never going to happen overnight. That's a New Years Day in Times Square level mess.

If you want to look at 2020 and 2021 assume that's indicative of his future performance, that's fine. I'm judging by what I'm seeing in 2022, and it's correcting a lot of his mistakes in the past.

The only arguments I'm hearing at all against Rhule are "shoulda." He shoulda done this, he shoulda done that. Well that's the past. It's a new year. If he flops he flops. But I just don't have a reason to be as pessimistic as people in this thread choose to be.

He was given complete control of the franchise.

Not a single move that was made came without his approval.

It's pretty difficult to excuse him for "the situation" when the reality is he had complete control of it...and proceeded to make it worse.

[mrcompletely11]

1 minute ago, Captroop said:

This post. The one you very cleverly responded to by writing "lol"

 

oh yeah I forgot

 

LOL

 

Your post was thoroughly debunked by numerous posters.

 

And he was clearly told to upgrade his staff

[KSpan]

3 minutes ago, Captroop said:

This post. The one you very cleverly responded to by writing "lol"

 

The problem is that none of that is directly attributable to Rhule at this time (voluntold to hire NFL coaches, Fitterer leading the personnel decisions and draft, etc are strong possibilities), but the terrible personnel and lineup decisions, under qualified coaches, and college-esque actions of the past are. Let's see where things shake out in 6, 8, 10 weeks when things that ARE directly attributable to his work can be assessed.

[Captroop]

1 minute ago, Mr. Scot said:

He was given complete control of the franchise.

Not a single move that was made came without his approval.

It's pretty difficult to excuse him for "the situation" when the reality is he had complete control of it...and proceeded to make it worse.

Shoulda shoulda shoulda

What are you seeing right now, leading up to the 2022 season that is 2 weeks away that is worse than last year?

Is he, in your honest opinion, continuing to make the team worse?

[Captroop]

1 minute ago, KSpan said:

The problem is that none of that is directly attributable to Rhule at this time (voluntold to hire NFL coaches, Fitterer leading the personnel decisions and draft, etc are strong possibilities), but the terrible personnel and lineup decisions, under qualified coaches, and college-esque actions of the past are. Let's see where things shake out in 6, 8, 10 weeks when things that ARE directly attributable to his work can be assessed.

I agree.

He doesn't have the under-qualified coaches anymore. He's not doing the DBO nonsense. He's improved in every area he was skewered for in the past. So people can either continue to hate him because of the past, or choose to see the trajectory as improving and wait until the actual season to judge him on the things a coach should actually be judged for.