Throwing Hurney under the bus.

[Cyberjag]

Hurney has done a pretty good job over the years. For the most part we still have our dirst rounders for the past 7 or 8 years and they have played well. We also do a pretty good job maxiimizing other folks throwaways and finding gold with lower picks and undrafted guys. If were Detroit or Saint Louis and picked a bunch of duds in the first round, we could surely complain, but overall we have done well and the fact that many people feel we have good talent is directly due to Hurney. If you are going to throw Hurney under the bus they don't put in another thread you think we have good talent. Otherwise both things can't both be true.

So in this thread, I guess Fox is a genius for winning at all because Hurney sucks. In others Fox needs to be fired because he can't win with the wealth of talent that Hurney has provided him.

Got it.

Great minds...

Just a couple more points to ponder...

Hurney was here before Fox, he hired Fox, and he'll probably be the guy who hires Fox's successor.

Hurney doesn't select who gets drafted in a vacuum, and it's debatable that he makes the actual selections at all. Fox and Co. have a huge influence, and so does Don Gregory. Hurney is responsible for Fox and Gregory being here, but not necessarily Beason, Peppers, Delhomme, etc...

Hurney manages the cap and tries to maximize the talent on the roster. In that, he does a very, very good job. Cry about Jake's extension this year, but if that isn't made we don't sign Hollis Thomas and several other free agents. And if Jake needs to be cut, sure we'll take a cap hit, but Hurney is good enough to hide it and stretch it out to the point where it's not killing us.

Hurney has done an outstanding job at horse trading so far. You can be mad about next year's pick all you want, but that's just one in a multitude of trades he's made that have helped this team. Even if it turns out to be a mistake, and that's not certain, he's got a track record that should buy him a little forgiveness for it. Especially if Tank Tyler and Louis Leonard work out at NT in the long run.

For better or worse, or maybe because the Big Cat says so, Hurney believes that the Panthers with Peppers and his contract are a stronger team than the Panthers without Peppers and his contract. Sure that's open for debate, but this isn't Madden and he's done a hell of a job keeping our talent level high for several years now.

IF Fox stays, and IF they go after a QB, they're not going to look for the next Peyton Manning anyway. Sure, they would take him if he fell into their laps, but the Panthers will look for a QB with presence, one with smarts, and THEN one with an arm. That perfectly describes Tom Brady when he came out--no arm but leadership and smarts to spare. You can find one of those late in the draft, and hope that they develop the arm needed.

Hurney and Fox both know they need a long term solution at QB. But there hasn't been a pick that made sense in the past couple of years. If you beat them up on Flacco then you need to beat them up on Rodgers and Brees and Brady as well. They tried with Carr, thought they had something with Moore, and signed McCown when they realized he wasn't it. I think Moore has the arm, but from what we've all read he doesn't have the smarts and that probably means the leadership is a question mark too. This offseason QB will be very, very high on the list, and the draft will reflect that.

I think Fox is a good coach, I really do. But I think Hurney is a GREAT general manager.

[hook]

"You guys need to chill. You know not all good players come from the first round. Look up the HOF qbs you'll find that only about 50% of them came from the first"

I think scouting has gotten better in this regard. Rivers, Manning(eli), Roethlisberger, Flacco, and Ryan all have panned out or look like they will. Obviously there are always Jamarcus Russells and Ryan Leaf's but I think they are fewer and farther between than they used to be. Thinking you will find another Brady in the lower rounds is less likely to get you a good QB.

[goodoleboy]

Great minds...

For better or worse, or maybe because the Big Cat says so, Hurney believes that the Panthers with Peppers and his contract are a stronger team than the Panthers without Peppers and his contract. Sure that's open for debate, but this isn't Madden and he's done a hell of a job keeping our talent level high for several years now.

I believe Richardson plays a bigger role than many think in determining who gets extended contracts. This dates back to Dan Morgan. The teams hangs on to guys a year or two past prime. We are doing it with Jake, Peppers and will probably do it with Smith.

[DaveThePanther2008]

Great minds...

Just a couple more points to ponder...

Hurney was here before Fox, he hired Fox, and he'll probably be the guy who hires Fox's successor.

Hurney doesn't select who gets drafted in a vacuum, and it's debatable that he makes the actual selections at all. Fox and Co. have a huge influence, and so does Don Gregory. Hurney is responsible for Fox and Gregory being here, but not necessarily Beason, Peppers, Delhomme, etc...

Hurney manages the cap and tries to maximize the talent on the roster. In that, he does a very, very good job. Cry about Jake's extension this year, but if that isn't made we don't sign Hollis Thomas and several other free agents. And if Jake needs to be cut, sure we'll take a cap hit, but Hurney is good enough to hide it and stretch it out to the point where it's not killing us.

Hurney has done an outstanding job at horse trading so far. You can be mad about next year's pick all you want, but that's just one in a multitude of trades he's made that have helped this team. Even if it turns out to be a mistake, and that's not certain, he's got a track record that should buy him a little forgiveness for it. Especially if Tank Tyler and Louis Leonard work out at NT in the long run.

For better or worse, or maybe because the Big Cat says so, Hurney believes that the Panthers with Peppers and his contract are a stronger team than the Panthers without Peppers and his contract. Sure that's open for debate, but this isn't Madden and he's done a hell of a job keeping our talent level high for several years now.

IF Fox stays, and IF they go after a QB, they're not going to look for the next Peyton Manning anyway. Sure, they would take him if he fell into their laps, but the Panthers will look for a QB with presence, one with smarts, and THEN one with an arm. That perfectly describes Tom Brady when he came out--no arm but leadership and smarts to spare. You can find one of those late in the draft, and hope that they develop the arm needed.

Hurney and Fox both know they need a long term solution at QB. But there hasn't been a pick that made sense in the past couple of years. If you beat them up on Flacco then you need to beat them up on Rodgers and Brees and Brady as well. They tried with Carr, thought they had something with Moore, and signed McCown when they realized he wasn't it. I think Moore has the arm, but from what we've all read he doesn't have the smarts and that probably means the leadership is a question mark too. This offseason QB will be very, very high on the list, and the draft will reflect that.

I think Fox is a good coach, I really do. But I think Hurney is a GREAT general manager.

GOOD Post.

The worst thing we can do is push the Eject button. Fire everyone!! Start Over.

I like Hurney, I think he has done a good job building our team.

Fox is a good coach but needs to be open to change. How many teams have made a change at QB for the good. TB let the rook start. (that will pay dividends in the years to come) Tenn put Young back in, Oakland dumped Russell, Cleveland put Quinn in charge and threw for 3-400 yds. (though it was a loss)

I would be content either way. Fox or someone else. Changing Fox has its risk. His replacement could be worse. Just remember Be careful for what you ask for. YOU MIGHT JUST GET IT.

Go Panthers