Are people really STILL defending the decision to stick with Jake going into '09?

[Sandy Claws]

yeah, the same guys who thought there was no better option than Godfrey this year........

You thought there was no better option than Godfrey?

[carolinanimal]

It is not in fox's philosophy to value qbs. Ask why he hasnt spent higher than a 4th on a qb or bring in more than undrafted fa qbs.

What is funny is that we traded 1st round draft picks away in consecutive years for a rt and de but somehow there is no way we could have drafted a qb in that time period. yeah right.

Also CRA, there is no point in arguing about moore with them. Obviously they go to all the practices and know john fox's opinions and mind. Theres no way we can compete with that!!! HA!

I have said this before. The time to put in matt moore was at the bye week. 2 weeks to prepare would have help him. fox realistically cant put moore in now. it is a lose lose situation for him. if he puts him in and he just plays decent but lacks the to's that jake has and is on target. He will look like a idiot for keeping this kid on the bench. if he comes out and sucks worse than delhomme, he looks like and idiot for keeping a #2 backup on the team for 3 years that is worst than one of the leagues worst starters. especially since "he watches him in practice every day".

[AceMan]

No one really knows how Moore would do...Fox is in a lose-lose situation...if Moore does good, he will look like a complete idiot. If Moore does bad, he will still look stupid for keeping him on the team.

Also, Savior, Fox is the same coach who thought Jake was the same this year, even though Jake has looked awful ever since that Arizona game. Training camp, scrimmage, preseason...I do think Matt Moore sucks though. He sounds like a QB that doesn't want to play from his comments...just like David Carr.

[AceMan]

It is not in fox's philosophy to value qbs. Ask why he hasnt spent higher than a 4th on a qb or bring in more than undrafted fa qbs.

What is funny is that we traded 1st round draft picks away in consecutive years for a rt and de but somehow there is no way we could have drafted a qb in that time period. yeah right.

Also CRA, there is no point in arguing about moore with them. Obviously they go to all the practices and know john fox's opinions and mind. Theres no way we can compete with that!!! HA!

I have said this before. The time to put in matt moore was at the bye week. 2 weeks to prepare would have help him. fox realistically cant put moore in now. it is a lose lose situation for him. if he puts him in and he just plays decent but lacks the to's that jake has and is on target. He will look like a idiot for keeping this kid on the bench. if he comes out and sucks worse than delhomme, he looks like and idiot for keeping a #2 backup on the team for 3 years that is worst than one of the leagues worst starters. especially since "he watches him in practice every day".

Great minds think alike

[carolinanimal]

Interesting how some point to Moore in '07 and his 85 passer rating as a starter (67 overall) as the reason to start him over Delhomme who had a 110+ rating with that same team. Delhomme is not what he was but, for some reason. everybody wants to assume that Moore has improved. Of course, the only ones that know for sure are the ones that have seen him play. You know the guys, the ones that see him everyday in practice.

Just like the guys who saw tom brady play, preist holmes etc etc. Coaches make mistakes. not saying that they are. but why are you guys so eager to shoot down moore from starting? is jake your hero or something? i you guys used the same logic with moore , JAKE DELHOMME WOULD HAVE NEVER STARTED! He was a backup to freakin Aaron Brooks. Those coaches watched him in practice too! Why didnt they see his greatness? Why was he in NFL Europe? didnt coaches who watch him in practice see his skills?

[Guild]

Going into '09 yeah I think Jake was the right choice. Now that we're in the season... I feel differently.

[MaineManPanther]

Just like the guys who saw tom brady play, preist holmes etc etc. Coaches make mistakes. not saying that they are. but why are you guys so eager to shoot down moore from starting? is jake your hero or something? i you guys used the same logic with moore , JAKE DELHOMME WOULD HAVE NEVER STARTED! He was a backup to freakin Aaron Brooks. Those coaches watched him in practice too! Why didnt they see his greatness? Why was he in NFL Europe? didnt coaches who watch him in practice see his skills?

Maybe he was bad early on? Maybe all those practises and time at NFL Europe helped him grow? Delhomme showed enough in practise to warrant his starting spot in 03. And Fox was right, which leans toward the idea he's pretty good at judgin if a qb derserves to start above another.

Are coaches wrong? Yes but for every Tom Brady there and 20 other no name qb's that coaches were right about.

Coaches make mistakes sure, but chances are that 9 times out of ten there more correct then anybody on here. That doesnt mean you can't complain or should shutup, but know that there alot more reliable at judging talent.

[carolinanimal]

Maybe he was bad early on? Maybe all those practises and time at NFL Europe helped him grow? Delhomme showed enough in practise to warrant his starting spot in 03. And Fox was right, which leans toward the idea he's pretty good at judgin if a qb derserves to start above another.

Are coaches wrong? Yes but for every Tom Brady there and 20 other no name qb's that coaches were right about.

Coaches make mistakes sure, but chances are that 9 times out of ten there more correct then anybody on here. That doesnt mean you can't complain or should shutup, but know that there alot more reliable at judging talent.

why so much hate on moore? no one is saying that he will be tom brady, but why not give him a chance to prove he sucks? why not give him the same chance as delhomme had?

[KillerKat]

What's amazing to me is some people would rather stick to something they know is terrible (Delhomme) rather than seeing what we've got with the unknown (Moore). Delhomme has proven time and time again that he is done. Moore almost won 3 games for us and has been in the system longer since then and should be improved since starting at the end of 2007. Bringing up practice is bullshit. Keary Colbert was a practice God. There are some players that are gamers and some guys that are just good in practice. Fox will not give Moore a shot, so we'll never know. He's said it to Delhomme..."Im sticking with you no matter how much you screw up." Since he said that to Delhomme, there is alot of reason to believe he is not objective when evaluating the QBs in practice. Not to mention they aren't going to bench a QB they just gave a 5 yr extension to in the offseason.

[Sandy Claws]

Just like the guys who saw tom brady play, preist holmes etc etc. Coaches make mistakes. not saying that they are. but why are you guys so eager to shoot down moore from starting? is jake your hero or something? i you guys used the same logic with moore , JAKE DELHOMME WOULD HAVE NEVER STARTED! He was a backup to freakin Aaron Brooks. Those coaches watched him in practice too! Why didnt they see his greatness? Why was he in NFL Europe? didnt coaches who watch him in practice see his skills?

I'm not sure how you get to some of that from any of my posts. The bottom line is that some people want Moore to start. They don't come to this decision from seeing his current play. In other words, they base their decision on a lack of knowledge. Fox sees Delhomme, Moore, Feely, and Cantrell daily. He has based his determination that Jake is the best option on that. He has decided based on knowledge. Since everybody wants everybody else to chose sides, the options are to side with message board posters who haven't seenany more than TV allows, or side with the folks who are with the players everyday. The bottom line is Jake sucks bad. I don't want to see the guy that is rated as worse.

[MaineManPanther]

why so much hate on moore? no one is saying that he will be tom brady, but why not give him a chance to prove he sucks? why not give him the same chance as delhomme had?

Why not give every backup player who's behind a struggling vet on every team a chance? I mean there's a chance that all the coaches were wrong about their talent that they see every day.

Techinaclly there's always a "chance' the player behind them is better. But that doesnt mean you start them just to be sure. The player behind them must prove to the coaching staff that he desreves to be starting, he must put cofidence in them. Not the other way around

[MaineManPanther]

What's amazing to me is some people would rather stick to something they know is terrible (Delhomme) rather than seeing what we've got with the unknown (Moore). Delhomme has proven time and time again that he is done. Moore almost won 3 games for us and has been in the system longer since then and should be improved since starting at the end of 2007. Bringing up practice is bullshit. Keary Colbert was a practice God. There are some players that are gamers and some guys that are just good in practice. Fox will not give Moore a shot, so we'll never know. He's said it to Delhomme..."Im sticking with you no matter how much you screw up." Since he said that to Delhomme, there is alot of reason to believe he is not objective when evaluating the QBs in practice. Not to mention they aren't going to bench a QB they just gave a 5 yr extension to in the offseason.

Just to clarify, can you post the link that says that quote?

Colbert is a horrible example. He had a promsing season follwed it up with a bad one and Fox benched him. In fact you could argue that like Colbert, Moore had a promising season and, like colbert, showed nothing afterwards. So fox left him on the bench.

Bringing up practise is not bs, how else are you supposed to judge who should be the 2nd and who should be the thrid? How are you suppose to judge when two players are fighting out in training camp for the starting job?

And brining up Moore 2-1 record two years ago as an argument is as dumb a bringing Delhomme 12-4 of last year.

[Sandy Claws]

Moore almost won 3 games for us and has been in the system longer since then and should be improved since starting at the end of 2007.

"almost" won 3 games? LOL

Seahawks game was all defense and running game. We'd have won it with Vinnie still in there.

Dallas game wasn't as close as the score.

Tampa didn't even play most of their normal starters.

Moore wasn't the deciding factor in any of those.

[CRA]

You thought there was no better option than Godfrey?

No, it was clearly obvious after last season the Panthers could have picked up anyone off the street and gotten slightly better S play going into this season in comparison to what Godfrey was doing.

Carolina/Fox clearly thought Godfrey was the best guy they could plug in for the moment.....injury again proved Fox's evaluation was incorrect when most arm chair QBs realized he was too big of a liability to continue to play.

Yet, guys like you continue to point to Fox starting Jake as proof there aren't better options at QB currently.