Kirk Cousins Trade Potential?

[Mr. Scot]

On 1/24/2022 at 3:52 PM, Jon Snow said:

NO MORE TRADING FOR QB'S!!! They are in a deep enough hole already! Stop digging it deeper.

Ive said before that Rhule reminds me of John Fox...minus his good qualities.

Fox was never that big on developing quarterbacks (or quarterbacks in general). Hence his preference to look for a player someone else already trained.

Darnold was something of a half-measure on that front. Kind of wonder if he'll go full bore with the next one.

Edited January 30, 2022 by Mr. Scot

[KSpan]

These 'prove it deal' comments are silly - Cousins has nothing to prove. He's a competent above-average starter with a TD to INT ratio approaching 4:1 who has thrown for more then 30 TDs 3 of his 4 years in Minnesota and only less than 4,000 yds 1 of the last 7. He can make a few plays when needed and will be paid as such with more than one year on a contract.

Stats don't tell the whole story but the guy is a clear 2 or 3 levels above prove-it players like Teddy, Dalton, Jameis, Mariota, etc.

[CmC2k]

We need someone to come in and be our version of Alex smith. Someone who we all can accept isn't our franchise guy but can add some stability to the position while we continue to look for a franchise guy. Kirk and Jimmy could both play that role very well, but their current contacts are just too expensive. The fact is there's no short cuts in finding a franchise QB you either have to draft and develop one or pay a premium for one on the trade or free agent market. We tried to gamble on Darnold, and it failed. In hindsight what we should've done is taken a QB last year and let teddy finish being the bridge QB he was brought here to be, but we tried to get too cute by trading for Darnold and now where stuck here with no vet QB on the roster and a failed project in Darnold with very little draft capital to improve the team. So now we're stuck with either riding with another season of Darnold, drafting a guy at 6 who probably isn't worth the selection, trading for an overpriced vet who can maybe make the playoffs in what looks to be a weak division, or having Tepper trade away all the assets we have for Watson.

[Mr. Scot]

1 minute ago, CmC2k said:

We need someone to come in and be our version of Alex smith. Someone who we all can accept isn't our franchise guy but can add some stability to the position while we continue to look for a franchise guy. 

Wasn't that the idea behind Teddy Bridgewater though?

That didn't work out, but it's also true that we didn't realize just how dysfunctional everything else was at the time.

Edited January 30, 2022 by Mr. Scot

[LinvilleGorge]

We need a coach. Bridgewater could've been that guy for us. But despite these guys talking about a rebuild, five year process, etc. everything they've actually done has indicated that they thought they were smarter than everyone else and this was going to be a quick and easy turnaround.

Kirk Cousins is a good QB. If you put him on the best roster in the NFL you can compete for a SB. Kirk Cousins on a rookie contract would be something to work with. But paying Kirk Cousins legit starter money hamstrings you. He doesn't make enough of a difference to eat up that much cap space. The ceiling for a team with Kirk Cousins is competing for a wildcard spot unless you hit some draft classes out of the park. That's just reality.

[MHS831]

21 minutes ago, Mr. Scot said:

Wasn't that the idea behind Teddy Bridgewater though?

That didn't work out, but it's also true that we didn't realize just how dysfunctional everything else was at the time.

I just think that if they do sign a free agent again and fail to draft a QB again, all hell is going to break loose.  The list of QBs we pass on will become larger and more distinctive as we continue NOT drafting a QB. When Fields has a good year--when Jones has another winning season...

Maybe a bit off topic because no QB in this draft will be ready to start day 1, but I think a line and some offseason ball enhancement may help Darnold enough to play until a rookie is ready.  If Pickett is there at #6, for example, and we do not pick him, and he goes on to become a Joe Burrow-ish NFL QB--people will lose their jobs over that.  Same with Howell, who I think could end up being the best of the bunch (Not a UNC fan, but a good OL and WRs make him very dangerous).

I expect the following:  The Panthers will not go after another free agent QB.  They will sign a Guard or two in free agency and develop BC as the LT.  Elflein will play center.  (NOT SAYING THIS IS MY PLAN--but when the reality of the situation takes hold--when you look at the big picture--they may be forced to do something like this).  BC does not come off as a guard--too much finesse. He will start in 2022, and he will start at LT.  When the dust settles, that is what they will do.

I know there are other options, but if they think BC can be a serviceable LT, they will address G in free agency.  That means at #6 they either take the #1 QB on their board or trade back.  If they trade back, they may take the best QB then as well.  I just do not see us bypassing a QB again.

Edited January 30, 2022 by MHS831

[LinvilleGorge]

3 minutes ago, MHS831 said:

I just think that if they do sign a free agent again and fail to draft a QB again, all hell is going to break loose.  The list of QBs we pass on will become larger and more distinctive as we continue NOT drafting a QB. When Fields has a good year--when Jones has another winning season...

Maybe a bit off topic because no QB in this draft will be ready to start day 1, but I think a line and some offseason ball enhancement may help Darnold enough to play until a rookie is ready.  If Pickett is there at #6, for example, and we do not pick him, and he goes on to become a Joe Burrow-ish NFL QB--people will lose their jobs over that.  Same with Howell, who I think could end up being the best of the bunch (Not a UNC fan, but a good OL and WRs makes him very dangerous).

I expect the following:  The Panthers will not go after another free agent QB.  They will sign a Guard or two in free agency and develop BC as the LT.  Elflein will play center.  (NOT SAYING THIS IS MY PLAN--but when the reality of the situation takes hold--when you look at the big picture--they may be forced to do something like this).  BC does not come off as a guard--too much finesse. He will start in 2022, and he will start at LT.  When the dust settles, that is what they will do.

I know there are other options, but if they think BC can be a serviceable LT, they will address G in free agency.  That means at #6 they either take the #1 QB on their board or trade back.  If they trade back, they may take the best QB then as well.  I just do not see us bypassing a QB again.

I just don't see any evidence that Rhule thinks investing heavily in the QB position unless it's for a proven high caliber vet (who ain't signing off on coming here) is how to build a winner in the NFL. We'll see if faceplanting twice changes his perception but I'm not holding my breath.

[MHS831]

2 minutes ago, LinvilleGorge said:

I just don't see any evidence that Rhule thinks investing heavily in the QB position unless it's for a proven high caliber vet (who ain't signing off on coming here) is how to build a winner in the NFL. We'll see if faceplanting twice changes his perception but I'm not holding my breath.

Predicting Rhule has been exhausting, but if he goes with a proven winner, we are investing $40m per-and as you say-who would come to this joke of a franchise right now?  Small Market, 3 consecutive years of 5-win seasons, and a coach on the hot seat (we hope).

[CmC2k]

5 minutes ago, Mr. Scot said:

Wasn't that the idea behind Teddy Bridgewater though?

That didn't work out, but it's also true that we didn't realize just how dysfunctional everything else was at the time.

Everyone knew at the end of 2020 that teddy wasn't the answer, but we were all were too eager to move on from him completely instead of having him stay and be the bridge QB to a rookie. In an alternate universe we could have Teddy with one-year remaining on his contract that we could move on from with very little cap hit and a rookie Justin Fields who would've shown flashes with his athleticism in his playing time and an entire draft of picks to improve the Oline and 50 million in cap space without having to restructure anyone. 

[Mr. Scot]

16 minutes ago, CmC2k said:

Everyone knew at the end of 2020 that teddy wasn't the answer, but we were all were too eager to move on from him completely instead of having him stay and be the bridge QB to a rookie. In an alternate universe we could have Teddy with one-year remaining on his contract that we could move on from with very little cap hit and a rookie Justin Fields who would've shown flashes with his athleticism in his playing time and an entire draft of picks to improve the Oline and 50 million in cap space without having to restructure anyone. 

My biggest thing with Bridgewater is that we all thought his criticisms of the staff were just sour grapes.

Turned out he had some valid points.

[KSpan]

3 hours ago, Mr. Scot said:

My biggest thing with Bridgewater is that we all thought his criticisms of the staff were just sour grapes.

Turned out he had some valid points.

It can be, and IMO was, both. The issue with this scenario was that Teddy folded like a card table as 2020 went on (and looked exactly the same in Denver this year), so how do you keep a player like that at the QB position?

The core problem was signing him in the first place expecting something that years of film showed clearly wasn't there, similar to Darnold. It's appears a major flaw in this regime thus far.

Edited January 30, 2022 by KSpan

[Mr. Scot]

13 minutes ago, KSpan said:

It can be, and IMO was, both. The issue with this scenario was that Teddy folded like a card table as 2020 went on (and looked exactly the same in Denver this year), so how do you keep a player like that at the QB position?

The core problem was signing him in the first place expecting something that years of film showed clearly wasn't there, similar to Darnold. It's appears a major flaw in this regime thus far.

No argument