Regarding Fitterer

[Toomers]

45 minutes ago, 45catfan said:

Ooof.  I sure hope so, because I was totally against that extension.  If that meant Robby walked at the end of the season, then so be it.

This thread aged well. Comical watching people make up numbers needed to justify this mistake. 

[Basbear]

Fitts FA class was 2/10, the one saving grace was reddick and hes only here cause temple.

I dont judge rookie classes in the first year. I gave his draft class 8/10 a couple weeks after. In season...........its been closer to the FA class even without factoring in the injury to horn. TMJ got Joke Brady fired me thinks as well. 

I do really enjoy having a aggressive GM, the issue is the results.......he seemed to think this was a playoff team and spend resources......it blew up.

just not a good start, but also unfair to him judging this early into his first GM gig. 

Edited December 29, 2021 by Basbear

[Scott12345]

2 picks for darnold

signs 2 awful OL 

trades a 3rd & a starting TE for a washout

 

who made those deals?

[Toomers]

    So best case, he signed up to be a yes man that knew he would be judged by Rhule’s final word. Or he had a say in all the failed moves this off-season? Either way, what makes anyone think a rookie GM should choose the next HC? One with a questionable one season at that. 
 

  Y’all need to “tent” the building and get rid of all the problems. 

[Basbear]

20 minutes ago, Scott12345 said:

2 picks for darnold

signs 2 awful OL 

trades a 3rd & a starting TE for a washout

 

who made those deals?

Not to nit pick, but he traded 3 picks for Sammy boy- 2021 4th........2022  2nd&6th

He also traded 6th for a bufflao DE/STer that never gets a game day jersey(I blame Dan morgan for this mostly)

Traded pro bowl perryman and a 7th tor an 6th(also got dead cap for this...)

He did move Greg Little for 7th without any BS to lose the pick if greg doesnt play 12.8% of the snaps stuff.

Traded a 2023 6th to prevent the Bucs form getting Gilmore, could still get a comp pick for him.

His pratice squad pick ups have been poor as well, tho its not talked about....

 

Again I liked the moves.....not liking the results.....Id STILL do that CJ henderson trade, he was injured and didnt have a panther training camp. See how he is after a full panthers off-season, I still got big hopes for Henderson&Horn seatbelts. 

Edited December 29, 2021 by Basbear

[Mr. Scot]

30 minutes ago, Basbear said:

Fitts FA class was 2/10, the one saving grace was reddick and hes only here cause temple.

I dont judge rookie classes in the first year. I gave his draft class 8/10 a couple weeks after. In season...........its been closer to the FA class even without factoring in the injury to horn. TMJ got Joke Brady fired me thinks as well. 

I do really enjoy having a aggressive GM, the issue is the results.......he seemed to think this was a playoff team and spend resources......it blew up.

just not a good start, but also unfair to him judging this early into his first GM gig. 

Fitterer's not a pro personnel guy.

Dan Morgan is.

That's why I want to see what they can do together...without Rhule.

[NanuqoftheNorth]

How large a role did Fitterer have in deciding Panthers draft priorities, free agency and giving Robby his new contract?  That would be very helpful information when trying to determine his future w/the organization.  

I also have concerns about any GM candidate who would accept an offer knowing they'd be playing second fiddle to the HC.  It just doesn't seem like a situation highly sought after GM candidates would agree to. 

Another area of concern:  The Seahawks have been on a steady decline for several years now.  One of their biggest problems has been the offensive line.  Another problem is Seattle's bad habit of wasting valuable draft picks on trades that don't pan out.  When the Panthers were searching for someone talented enough to promote into their GM position, I'm not sure Seattle was the best place to look.

Finally, who hired Fitterer?  Was that Rhule's call?  A reason for concern as well/look at Matt's coaching staff.

All things considered, I'd reluctantly give Scott Fitterer the benefit of the doubt for now since we have so little to go on. 

The optimist in me says he could be a diamond in the rough. 

Edited December 29, 2021 by NanuqoftheNorth

[Khyber53]

1 hour ago, Mr. Scot said:

I know there are some on here who want to keep him and some who don't. For clarity though, I would ask this question:

How many of you have ever been put on a group project in school or at work where the person in charge of the project was a dumbass?

Not much fun when your results are affected by the work of someone who doesn't have a clue, is it?

I've been there. I suspect you have too.

That particular dynamic is a big reason why I'd like to see what Fitterer and Morgan can do unencumbered by the incompetence of Matt Rhule.

Here's hoping we get that chance.

I do understand what you're getting at here. And you make a good point. 

My problem is that in the preseason and draft time, Fitterer made such a big deal out of "being in on every deal" and working hard to make trades and get more draft capital for the team. And then the results of his labors hit the field like a half-baked loaf of bread: soft, doughy and completely unable to rise to the occasion.

Yes, Fitterer may have been saddled with Rhule's guidance, but when he ran out there to get resources, he just didn't get much that was any good. Reddick was good to great, and Gilmore was a potentially a short-term rental that may be gone with free agency. They didn't balance out that offensive line, the Robby Anderson extension and nowhere near the Sam Darnold debacle. He hit on an Edge rusher (who played stout in the run game, too) and on at least one of what 12 defensive backs? 

I just don't think his talent evaluation is that good when it comes to free agents. His contract negotiations so far include Anderson and picking up Darnold's fifth year before the kid had ever thrown a meaningful pass for us. And draft? We can go into how many top linemen and QBs he passed on. 

Did he make those decisions or did Rhule? We'll never know, but just like getting stuck in a bad group project, a failing grade paints the whole group, not just the guilty parties. 

I think we need a clean slate. 

And someone get Luke back before he signs on as the DC at Buffalo.

[Mr. Scot]

8 minutes ago, NanuqoftheNorth said:

I also have concerns about any GM candidate who would accept an offer knowing they'd be playing second fiddle to the HC.  It just doesn't seem like a situation highly sought after GM candidates would settle agree to.

I think that's why Ed Dodds backed out of the process.

With Fitterer though, that's the environment he was coming from in Seattle.

  

5 minutes ago, Khyber53 said:

I do understand what you're getting at here. And you make a good point. 

My problem is that in the preseason and draft time, Fitterer made such a big deal out of "being in on every deal" and working hard to make trades and get more draft capital for the team. And then the results of his labors hit the field like a half-baked loaf of bread: soft, doughy and completely unable to rise to the occasion.

Yes, Fitterer may have been saddled with Rhule's guidance, but when he ran out there to get resources, he just didn't get much that was any good. Reddick was good to great, and Gilmore was a potentially a short-term rental that may be gone with free agency. They didn't balance out that offensive line, the Robby Anderson extension and nowhere near the Sam Darnold debacle. He hit on an Edge rusher (who played stout in the run game, too) and on at least one of what 12 defensive backs? 

I just don't think his talent evaluation is that good when it comes to free agents. His contract negotiations so far include Anderson and picking up Darnold's fifth year before the kid had ever thrown a meaningful pass for us. And draft? We can go into how many top linemen and QBs he passed on. 

Did he make those decisions or did Rhule? We'll never know, but just like getting stuck in a bad group project, a failing grade paints the whole group, not just the guilty parties. 

I think we need a clean slate. 

And someone get Luke back before he signs on as the DC at Buffalo.

There are two things relevant to me about last offseason...

First obviously is Rhule's influence, but the second is that for the majority of our free agent decisions, Dan Morgan wasn't here.

As mentioned before, Fitterer's primary expertise is college scouting. Morgan's is pro personnel.

I want to see how that combo works.

Edited December 29, 2021 by Mr. Scot

[NanuqoftheNorth]

19 minutes ago, Toomers said:

So best case, he signed up to be a yes man that knew he would be judged by Rhule’s final word. Or he had a say in all the failed moves this off-season? Either way, what makes anyone think a rookie GM should choose the next HC? One with a questionable one season at that. 

Yeah, four years in, does Tepper really want to put his trust in a first year GM to find the Panthers next HC? 

Sounds like a recipe for disaster.

I'd be much more comfortable relying on the knowledge of a well regarded former NFL team executive, someone like Ozzie Newsome.  

[Basbear]

Just now, Mr. Scot said:

Fitterer's not a pro personnel guy.

Dan Morgan is.

That's why I want to see what they can do together...without Rhule.

Awful rough start.

I know 6th rounder are what-evars, they traded one for a DE thats only be active twice (i think) for the whole season. He came form Buffalo, Dan should know him well. He can not get a jersey for ST on a team with some of the worst ST in the league. 

Scott, Dan and the whole front office have had a "Rhule" like season right there with the coaching staff. Without blaming Rhule the free agents, draft picks, and in-season moves have yielded very poor results.

When Fitt first got here he had close to 120 million in cap space for the 2022 season. He burned nearly 4/5 of that this season!!!! I think its close to 30 million. TERRIBLE>> Can not blame Rhule for that.

Awful rough start. 

[Mr. Scot]

1 minute ago, NanuqoftheNorth said:

Yeah, four years in, does Tepper really want to put his trust in a first year GM to find the Panthers next HC? 

Sounds like a recipe for disaster.

I'd be much more comfortable relying on the knowledge of a well regarded former NFL team executive, someone like Ozzie Newsome.  

Technically, he put his trust in a veteran GM the last time.

(didn't go so well)

Thing is, it's not just Fitterer, but Fitterer and Morgan. And while Fitt is a first time GM, he's got twenty plus years as part of a winning organization on his resume.

Still, if you want to have a "guiding hand" in the process, there's at least a decent chance Kevin Colbert will be available. We know Tepper trusts him.

[Toomers]

1 minute ago, Mr. Scot said:

I think that's why Ed Dodds backed out of the process.

With Fitterer though, that's the environment he was coming from in Seattle.

So he has never been responsible for anything in his NFL career. But he’s ready to pick a HC. 
 

   Let’s say Dan Morgan was just named GM in JAX. Hypothetically. Does anyone still want Fitterer, or is this an infatuation with a former player? 

[Mr. Scot]

3 minutes ago, Basbear said:

Scott, Dan and the whole front office have had a "Rhule" like season right there with the coaching staff. Without blaming Rhule the free agents, draft picks, and in-season moves have yielded very poor results.

Given who's actually in charge, that probably shouldn't come as a surprise.